W3C | TAG

W3C TAG meeting 13-15 Septembter 2011 in Edinburgh, UK

Noah Mendelsohn, Larry Masinter, Jonathan Rees, Dan Appelquist, Tim Berners-Lee, Henry Thompson, Yves Lafon, Ashok Malhotra, Peter Linss
(Jeni Tennison participated by telephone)

Agenda Summary

Logistics

Required Reading

See "(required reading)" annotations in agenda items below. For your convenience, I've listed some of the main required reading here as well:

• TAG Product Listing and all product pages linked from that — note especially the proposed revision to the scope of Product: MIME architecture for the Web and the new proposed page for Product: Web Application Storage
• Identifying Application State W3C Editors Draft: Proposed TAG Finding 30 August 2011 (new version with minor fixes in response to Noah's comments: W3C Editors Draft: Proposed TAG Finding 10 September 2011) — proposed as ready for publication as a TAG finding
• Mime Types and Fragment IDs: Draft TAG Finding 12 August 2011
• Email from Larry Masinter suggesting change in focus for work on Product: MIME architecture for the Web; also, links from the sections itemized as (a. - f.) in the proposed revision section at the top.
• Interoperability of referential uses of hashless URIs by Jonathan Rees (announcement email)
• Information Resources and Web Metadata: Editor's Draft 25 June 2011 by Jonathan Rees (announcement email)
• Providing and discovering definitions of URIs: Editor's Draft 25 June 2011" by Jonathan Rees (announcement email)
• HTML/XML Task Force Report W3C Editor's Draft (with revision marks) 15 August 2011

Agenda Details

1. Convene, review agenda
   • Scribes: TAG members are encouraged to sign up for scribing by using CVS to edit scribing assignments table, or by emailing the chair
   • Roll call
   • Approve minutes of teleconferences:
     • 1 September 2011
   • F2F Goals:
     • Main goals:
       1. Make progress on our five top priority products:
          • HTML5 Last Call Review
          • Fragment Identifiers and Mime Types
          • Web Application State
          • URI Definition Discovery
          • MIME architecture for the Web
       2. Prepare client-side state finding for publication (unless we decide there's too much more to do on #! and/or RDFa use of fragids
       3. Review status of RDFa/Microdata task force, and set up appropriate ACTIONs for tracking
       4. Make progress on our other active products
       5. Rebalance TAG member assignments (noting, e.g., Jeni's new responsibilities for RDFa/Microdata)
     • Other goals:
       1. Help Noah prepare for: ACTION-563: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Arrange for periodic TAG key issues reports to Jeff per June 2011 F2F Due 2011-10-15 - Due: 2011-09-15 - OPEN
2. Review TAG Priorities for 2011
   • Goals:
     • Remind ourselves of priorities and commitments from TAG product pages
     • This Tuesday session is primarily a quick level-set at the start of the F2F — updates and debates about the priorities will happen as we go along and in a session on Thursday.
   • Agree that product "HTML5 Last Call Review" has been completed. Assign action for long term tracking of future HTML5 developments.
3. ACTION-568: Track high priority developments for Jeff Jaffe
   • Goals:
     • Gather information to help Noah respond to ACTION-568: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Draft note for Jeff Jaffe listing 5 top TAG priorities as trackable items. - Due: 2011-07-26 - PENDING REVIEW
   • Background:
     • ACTION-568: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Draft note for Jeff Jaffe listing 5 top TAG priorities as trackable items. - Due: 2011-07-26 - PENDING REVIEW
     • 6 June 2011 discussion with Jeff Jaffe
4. HTML5 Review: HTML5 Last Call — Overview
   • Goals:
     • Split this work: 1) Mark as completed the TAG's Last Call review of HTML5 except for 2) start tracking a separate specific work-item on Microdata/RDFa (see agenda item below)
     • Assign an ACTION to track ongoing developments relating to HTML5, so TAG will be alerted when further review is needed
   • Background:
     • The HTML working group issued a press release inviting comments from the public.
     • The last call period ran through 3 August 2011. Several TAG members reviewed particular sections, but declined to suggest addtional comments be made on behalf of the TAG.
     • Background notes from June 2011 F2F:
       • Note from Noah to HTML WG chairs questioning non-normative status of the HTML5 Edition for Web Authors
       • On 12 May 2011, Henry Thompson and Dan Appelquist agreed to review selected items, but we probably need more coverage from other TAG members if possible.
       • Note that Polyglot Markup: HTML-Compatible XHTML Documents is part of the Last Call, and is pertinent to the HTML / XML Unification agenda item.
       • public-iri mailing list discussion of IRI handling and RFC 3987 in HTML5 (heads up email from Noah)
5. HTML5 Review: HTML5 Last Call — Microdata/RDFa
   • Note: per discussion on 1 Sept 2011, we will not schedule fixed time for this, but Jeni or others may request time during our time in Edinburgh, if side discussions prove inadequate for making progress.
   • Goals:
     • Decide whether Microdata/RDFa task force remains the most appropriate approach to helping the community resolve the overlap between these technologies
     • If the TAG will have ongoing involvement, establish goals, target dates, assignments, etc., and capture in a product page (there are currently no open ACTIONs on this)
   • Background:
     • TAG e-mail raising last-call issues on Microdata and RDFa. (required reading)
     • Discussion on 21 July 2011
6. ISSUE-60 (webApplicationState-60): Web Applications: Client-side state
   • Goals:
     • Prepare for publication of a TAG finding on Identifying Application State
     • Review the Identifying Application State W3C Editors Draft: Proposed TAG Finding 30 August 2011 with the intention of announcing publication of a TAG finding shortly after the F2F.
     • Assign new action to publish T.V. Raman's original draft as a W3C Note with an indication that it is no longer on the Rec track, and referencing the new finding (see Key Deliverables for this product
   • Background:
     • Product page: Product: Identifying Application State Commitments:
       • TAG Finding: Identifying Application State Due date: 1 Nov 2011
       • 25 June 2011: Draft for TAG review based on June 2011 F2F review
       • 1 Sept 2011: Last-call quality draft
       • W3C Note with FPWD (Raman's version) indicating this work no longer on Rec. track (to be done after reference to finding available)
     • ACTION-481: Update client-side state document with help from Raman
     • ACTION-586: on - Ashok Malhotra - Add text covering advice equivalent to "Use of AJAX implementation technology is not a sufficient excuse for failing to provide first class URI identification for documents on the Web" - Due: 2011-08-11 - OPEN
7. ISSUE-66 (mimeAndWeb-66-27): IETF Draft on MIME and the Web
   • Goals:
     • Consider Larry Masinter's suggestion that the goals of this effort be changed to focus more on review of ongoing work at the IETF.
     • Coordinate this general work on MIME with the ongoing work on fragment identifiers.
   • Background:
     • Product page: MIME architecture for the Web Commitments:
       • 31 December 2011: Final TAG Report on MIME architecture, most likely in the form of an Internet Draft
       • 30 September 2011: Report finalized
       • 30 September 2011: TAG achieves success criteria , and identifies further goals and next steps, if any
     • Drafts have been published at: http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/products/mimeweb.html
     • See proposal at the top of the product page suggesting new goals for this effort.
     • Blog posting from Larry that kicked off this work.
     • ACTION-472: on - Larry Masinter - Update the mime-draft based on comments & review - Due: 2011-07-30 - OPEN
     • ACTION-588: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Work with Larry to update mime-web product page Due 2011-08-18 - Due: 2011-09-15 - OPEN
     • Closed actions:
       • ACTION-425: on - Larry Masinter - Draft updated MIME finding(s), with help from DanA, based on www-tag discussion - Due: 2010-05-31 - CLOSED
       • ACTION-458: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Schedule discussion of followup actions for TAG to coordinate with IETF on MIME-type related activities - Due: 2011-09-01 - CLOSED
       • ACTION-467: on - Larry Masinter - Revise Mime & Web blog entry, perhaps leading to Internet Draft - Due: 2010-09-21 - CLOSED
8. ISSUE-60 (webApplicationState-60): Web Applications: Fragment ID Semantics and MIME Types
   • Goals:
     • Review Mime Types and Fragment IDs: Draft TAG Finding 12 August 2011
     • Consider the relationship of this work to our publication of a finding on Web Application State
     • Make decision on direction we take on RDFa Core (ACTION-509)
     • Decide whether ACTION-543: on - Jeni Tennison - Propose addition to MIME/Web draft to discuss sem-web use of fragids not grounded in media type - Due: 2011-06-28 - OPEN is properly phrased given change in direction on MIME architecture for the Web
     • Make decision (again) on direction we take on 3023bis (application/xml)
     • Make sure Product Page Fragment Identifiers and Mime Types reflects our intentions for work in this area moving forward.
   • Background:
     • Product page: Fragment Identifiers and Mime Types Commitments:
       • Draft Finding for review by relevant editors by end of 31 July 2011
       • 31 December 2011: TAG Finding
     • On 4 August 2011, Peter Linss agrees to join Jeni Tennison and Henry Thompson working on ACTION-567 and ACTION-543
     • ACTION-567: on - Jeni Tennison - Draft a document describing problems around fragids and ways things should be changed - Due: 2011-06-28 - OPEN
     • ACTION-543: on - Jeni Tennison - Propose addition to MIME/Web draft to discuss sem-web use of fragids not grounded in media type - Due: 2011-06-28 - OPEN
     • See also: background material for 6-8 June 2011 F2F discussion of Fragment Identifiers
     • Note possible relationship to draft TAG Finding on Client-Side State
     • ACTION-508: on - Larry Masinter - Draft proposed bug report against HTML5 media type registration regarding interpretation of fragid in HTML-based AJAX apps - Due: 2011-07-19 - PENDING REVIEW
     • ACTION-509: on - Jonathan Rees - Communicate with RDFa WG regarding documenting the fragid / media type issue - Due: 2011-09-15 - OPEN
9. ISSUE-57 (HttpRedirections-57), ISSUE-63 (metadataArchitecture-63) and ISSUE-14 (HttpRange-14) : URI Definition Discovery; Metadata Architecture
   • Goals:
     • Review new drafts from Jonathan
     • Validate product page
   • Background:
     • Product page: URI Definition Discovery Commitments:
       • Key Deliverables:
         • July 2012: PR(s) or similar document covering the following:
           1. URI definition discovery architecture
           2. ontology (RDF vocabulary) as needed
         • July 2012: TAG Note on semantics of metadata for 'information resources'
       • Schedule:
         • 20 June 2011: Revise the two issue-57 drafts, put out for review on semantic-web and/or LOD lists
         • 20 Jul 2011: Telcon or meeting with concerned parties
         • 18 Sept: Decision regarding venue (rec track vs. something else)
         • 25 Sept: FPWD or equivalent (note: TPAC 2011 publication freeze is mid-October)
     • Interoperability of referential uses of hashless URIs by Jonathan Rees (announcement email) — required reading
     • Providing and discovering definitions of URIs: Editor's Draft 25 June 2011 by Jonathan Rees (announcement email) — required reading
     • Information Resources and Web Metadata: Editor's Draft 25 June 2011 by Jonathan Rees (announcement email) — required reading
     • Wiki page on httpRange-14 history (optional reading)
     • A diagram explaining "metadata", from Jonathan Rees
     • ACTION-201: on - Jonathan Rees - Report on status of AWWSW discussions - Due: 2011-09-06 - OPEN
     • ACTION-282: on - Jonathan Rees - Draft a finding on metadata architecture. - Due: 2011-09-06 - OPEN
     • ACTION-413: on - Dan Connolly - Suggest a path thru some logic terminology that might speed up httpSemantics discussions - Due: 2010-05-07 - CLOSED
     • ACTION-587: on - Jonathan Rees - Prepare issue-57 and issue-63 documents for TAG members to discuss at Sept F2F - Due: 2011-08-23 - OPEN
10. ISSUE-60 (webApplicationState-60): Web Applications: Client-side Storage
    • Goals:
      • Decide whether Product Page: Web Application Storage represents work the TAG wants to undertake
      • Discuss Slides from Ashok (these were reviewed at the June F2F but they are the latest technical analysis we have)
      • Currently tracking under ISSUE-60, which is the same one we're using for more transient client-side state. Is ISSUE-60 appropriate for both?
    • Background:
      • Required reading: Slides from Ashok to be presented at the June 2011 F2F (announcement email)
      • Discussion of Storage at June 2011 F2F
      • Earlier background:
        • From discussion of storage at Feb 2011 F2F:

          NM: Assuming this is a separate document, what are the top three questions it will answer for the community?

          AM: Give me three weeks

          NM: OK, let's suspend judgement on the long-term future of this work until we see your response

        • Ashok' slides from Feb 2011 F2F "Client-Side Storage" (ppt, pdf)
        • Required reading: Client-side Storage : this version was prepared for the October 2010 F2F
        • ACTION-475: on - Ashok Malhotra - Write finding on client-side storage, DanA to review - Due: 2011-05-24 - OPEN
        • ACTION-482: on - Ashok Malhotra - Write a draft on client-side storage with help from DanA Due: 2010-11-30 - Due: 2010-10-27 - CLOSED -- it was noted that this action was redundant with ACTION-475
11. ISSUE-50 (URNsAndRegistries-50): Persistent references
    • Goals:
      • Prepare product page for this work
      • Discuss possibility of a workshop on domain persistence
    • Background:
      • E-mail from Jonathan Rees Persistence at Sept 2011 TAG F2F (required reading)
      • E-mail from Henry Thompson suggesting consideration of a possible workshop on domain persistence at the 7th International Digital Curation Conference
      • ACTION-478: on - Jonathan Rees - Prepare a second draft of a finding on persistence of references, to be based on decision tree from Oct. 2010 F2F - Due: 2011-08-09 - OPEN
      • ACTION-477: on - Henry Thompson - Organize meeting on persistence of domains - Due: 2011-08-10 - OPEN
      • See also agenda item on Persistent References from 6-8 June 2011 F2F (as best the chair can determine, this was on the agenda for June, but not discussed due to time constraints)
      • Jonathan requests opportunity for F2F discussion and lists potential discussion topics
      • Closed actions and earlier discussion:
        • Discussion at Feb. 2011 F2F
        • ACTION-444: on - Jonathan Rees - Draft a white paper on link persistence - Due: 2010-10-11 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-414: on - Henry S. Thompson - Prepare a draft agenda, including goals and means, for a proposed afternoon session with invited guests, and circulate for discussion prior to a decision, on the subject of addressing the persistence of domain names - Due: 2010-06-01 - CLOSED
        • June 2010 F2F discussion of domain name persistence; October 2010 F2F discussion of domain name persistence
12. ISSUE-25 (deepLinking-25): Can publication of hyperlinks constitute copyright infringment?
    • Goals:
      • Resolve confusion regarding goals, TAG member assignments and next steps for this work.
      • Discussion with Thing Nguyen if it can be arranged (per suggestion on teleconference of 1 Sept. 2011)
    • Background:
      • Product page: Publishing and Linking on the Web Commitments:
        • Key Deliverables:
          • TAG W3C Proposed Recommendation: June 2012
        • Schedule:
          • Preliminary legal review between draft editors, W3C legal staff (Rigo?) others (Thinh Nguyen)
          • First public working draft 15 October 2011 - before TPAC 2011 publication freeze
      • Draft: Publishing and Linking on the Web Draft TAG Finding 08 June 2011
      • June 2011 F2F discussion concluded next step would be legal review. Dan Appelquist agreed to look into it, but progress has been slow.
      • TAG chair's query for status of this work and followup discussion
      • ACTION-541: on - Jeni Tennison - Helped by DKA to produce a first draft of terminology about (deep-)linking etc. - Due: 2011-07-26 - OPEN
      • Earlier background:
        • Discussion on 28 April 2011, 17 March 2011, 31 March 2011, and 14 April 2011 of "Copyright and Deep Linking"
        • Tim Berners-Lee alerts the TAG to US legal case in which a Mr. Brian McCarthy has been accused of copyright infringement resulting from his (alleged) publication of links to copyrighted material. (See also long ensuing email thread.) (Criminal complaint)
        • Suggestion to write a technical document on linking and copying (Jonathan)
        • Discussion with Thinh Nguyen at 3 Dec 2010 TAG telcon
        • ACTION-505: on - Daniel Appelquist - Start a document wrt issue-25 - Due: 2011-03-01 - CLOSED
13. ACTION-590 and ACTION-592: Unicode normalization
    • Goals:
      • Prepare a response to the request from Addison Phillips for TAG involvement in setting standards for Unicode normalization
      • If this does become a long-term focus for the TAG, consider opening an issue (existing ones don't seem applicable) and/or creating a product page.
    • Background:
      • ACTION-590: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Follow up with Addison Phillips on Unicode normalization http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2011Jun/0188.html - Due: 2011-08-30 - PENDING REVIEW
      • ACTION-592: on - Peter Linss - Draft possible TAG position statement on Unicode, and alert Addison Phillips of our intention to attempt to get agreement starting in October after the F2F - Due: 2011-09-08 - OPEN
      • Discussion on 1 Sept. 2011
14. Web Applications: Design of APIs for Web Applications (minimization)
    • Goals:
      • Recommit to (or cancel) this effort, which appears to be far behind the scheduled commitment for a finding in October
      • Update product page and team assignements accordingly.
    • Background:
      • Product page: API Minimization Commitments:
        • Key Deliverables:
          • By 15 October 2011: an approved TAG finding on API minimization
        • Schedule:
          • Initial draft finding for community review 2011-07-31
      • Discussion at 8 June 2011 F2F suggested we want to publish quickly, do a product page, and target Sept (this F2F) for review of a draft.
      • Earlier background:
        • Data Minimization in Web APIs: Draft TAG Finding 05 June 2011
        • Brief discussion on 12 May 2011
        • Discussion at Feb 2011 TAG F2F
        • ACTION-514: on - Daniel Appelquist - Draft finding on API minimization - Due: 2011-07-12 - OPEN
        • From previous F2F: Dan Appelquist writeup on API Design - (announcement email)
        • ACTION-461: on - Daniel Appelquist - Draft "finding" on Web Apps API design - Due: 2010-12-31 - CLOSED
15. ACTION-545: Privacy
    • On 11 August 2011 we agreed to have "at most" 1/2 hour on this, and much skepticism was expressed
    • Goals:
      • Decide how the TAG will engage in privacy-related work for the remainder of 2011
    • Background:
      • ACTION-583: on - Ashok Malhotra - (with help from Dan) organize TAG review of proposed W3C charter on tracking protection (privacy) Due 2011-07-26 - Due: 2011-08-30 - OPEN
      • ACTION-566: on - Daniel Appelquist - Contact Alissa Cooper, organize a future joint discussion on privacy with IAB. - Due: 2011-07-19 - OPEN
      • Earlier background:
        • Report of the W3C Workshop on Web Tracking and User Privacy (required reading)
        • IETF/W3C Privacy workshop was held at MIT 8-98 December 2011. "Action Items" for W3C were proposed. See: Action items (PDF - may need rotating) collected at IETF/W3C Privacy Workshop wrapup
        • ACTION-264: on - Ashok Malhotra - Draft agenda item for upcoming telcon discussion of geolocation and privacy - Due: 2009-08-04 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-290: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Write to Geolocation WG saying "we have concern that the spec does not say enough user privacy" - Due: 2009-07-30 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-408: on - Daniel Appelquist - Look into next steps on a workshop around device APIs, privacy etc. with tlr - Due: 2010-03-31 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-460: on - Daniel Appelquist - Coordinate with IAB regarding next steps on privacy policy - Due: 2011-07-21 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-550: on - Daniel Appelquist - With help from Noah to plan TAG work on privacy, leading to session at F2F, next step is contact with TLR - Due: 2011-05-12 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-507: on - Daniel Appelquist - With Noah to suggest next steps for TAG on privacy - Due: 2011-05-03 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-545: on - Ashok Malhotra - Report to TAG, after privacy workshop, regarding architecture issue on privacy and especially degree to which use cases beyond those addressed by "Do Not Track" need attention - Due: 2011-05-03 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-506: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Noah to bring proposed W3C Actions on Privacy before the TAG - TLR to report back to IETF - Due: 2011-01-11 - CLOSED
        • Papers from earlier IETF/W3C workshop on privacy were at http://www.iab.org/about/workshops/privacy/Privacy_Workshop_Papers.zip but that link appears not to work any more (ACTION-490: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Noah and others(?) going to privacy workshop to report back to the TAG? - Due: 2010-12-21 - CLOSED) (ACTION-506: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Noah to bring proposed W3C Actions on Privacy before the TAG - TLR to report back to IETF - Due: 2011-01-11 - CLOSED)
16. Web Applications: Security
    • Goals:
      • This will be a brief, and mostly non-technical(!) discussion of how the TAG can engage on security issues now that John Kemp is no longer a memeber
    • Background:
      • On 11 August there was some encouragement for a session on security, but goals not really clear
      • ACTION-341: on - Yves Lafon - Follow up with Thomas about security review activities for HTML5 - Due: 2011-05-10 - OPEN
      • ACTION-344: on - Jonathan Rees - Alert TAG chair when CORS and/or UMP goes to LC to trigger security review - Due: 2011-09-13 - OPEN
      • ACTION-515: on - Larry Masinter - (as trackbot proxy for John) who will publish http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/02/security-web.html, slightly cleaned up, with help from Noah and Larry - Due: 2011-07-30 - PENDING REVIEW
      • ACTION-516: on - Yves Lafon - Talk with Thomas Roessler about organizing W3C architecture work on security - Due: 2011-07-19 - OPEN
      • ACTION-554: on - Noah Mendelsohn - Formulate product page for TAG work on security including John Kemp security draft Due: 2011-05-24 - Due: 2011-09-15 - OPEN
      • See also:
        • ACTION-33: on - Henry Thompson - revise naming challenges story in response to Dec 2008 F2F discussion - Due: 2011-08-10 - OPEN
        • ACTION-280: on - Dan Connolly - (with John K) to enumerate some CSRF scenarios discussed in Jun in Cambridge - Due: 2010-10-11 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-340: on - John Kemp - summarize recent discussion around XHR and UMP - Due: 2010-06-04 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-412: on - Dan Connolly - Try the clarification question, blog item, or wiki approach to metadata-in-uris vs CSRF - Due: 2010-06-07 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-417: on - John Kemp - Frame section 7, security - Due: 2011-01-25 - CLOSED
        • ACTION-435: on - Jonathan Rees - Consult Tyler Close regarding UMP-informed web storage vulnerability analysis - Due: 2010-06-22 - CLOSED
        • CORS, UMP and XHR by John Kemp (required reading for previous F2F)
        • John Kemp's note framing a security section for the architecture of Web Applications
17. Administration:
    • Future TAG F2F meetings
      • TPAC in Santa Clara, 31 Oct. - 4 Nov. 2011
      • RESOLVED (at June 2011 F2F): The TAG will meet in Cambridge, MA USA 4-6 January 2012
      • RESOLVED (at June 2011 F2F): TAG members will hold 2-4 April 2012 for TAG meeting in Sophia Antipolis, France. The meeting is not yet confirmed. It's still in order to ask for changes.
      • Is it too early to start thinking past April
      • Are there any options for co-location with the IAB?
    • Group photo?
18. Action item review:
    • Pending review actions in Tracker
    • Overdue actions in Tracker
    • Open actions in Tracker
19. Open issue review:
    • This is an optional agenda item: we'll do it if there's time
    • Goal: review our list of open issues — look especially for issues that are open but dormant decide to assign resource/close/leave as background activity.