Publishing Working Group Telco — Minutes
See also the Agenda and the IRC Log
Present: Wendy Reid, Gregorio Pellegrino, Dave Cramer, Teenya Franklin, Ivan Herman, Deborah Kaplan, Nick Ruffilo, Avneesh Singh, George Kerscher, Franco Alvarado, Bill Kasdorf, Charles LaPierre, Romain Deltour, Garth Conboy, Brady Duga, Marisa DeMeglio, Laurent Le Meur, Simon Collinson
Regrets: Tzviya Siegman, Matt Garrish, Nellie McKesson, Ric Wright, Geoff Jukes, Rachel Comerford, Mateus Teixeira
Chair: Wendy Reid
Scribe(s): Nick Ruffilo
- 1. horizontal reviews
- 2. remaining issues in audio and lpf
- 3. Manifest issue #39 on I18N
- 4. TPAC agenda
- 5. Resolutions
Wendy Reid: Lets get started!
Wendy Reid: See Last week’s minutes
Wendy Reid: approval of minutes from last week. No comments - minutes approved
Resolution #1: last week’s minutes approved
1. horizontal reviews
Wendy Reid: Main topic to discuss today: as TPAC approaches, the main topics is prepping Audiobooks and manifest for CR. Before that we want to do horizontal reviews. Ivan has completed internationalization for pub manifest which extends to audiobooks
… however we do need to do the security review, privacy review, and now that we’ve changed the documents it’s worth re-doing the accessibility review. When we met at the face to face, we designated people to do it.
… Brady, Benjamin, Tim, and possibly Deborah? We do need to actually do this. It took Ivan a couple of hours, and security review is no different. I’m hoping we can get commitments today to do that.
… the trick to committing is that it needs to be done this week - or by our next meeting.
Brady Duga: I’m not here… (looks around ominously) Before Friday?
Wendy Reid: How about before next Friday - as next week we may not be meeting…
Brady Duga: Is this for audiobooks?
Wendy Reid: Audiobooks and publication manifest. Will you commit to the security review?
Brady Duga: I will do the thing I signed up for.
Wendy Reid: See The security questionnaire
Ivan Herman: The big test you’ll have to go through is security and privacy.
… It does say Security and Privacy in the title…
Wendy Reid: Since it is 2, Brady, would you like some assistance?
Brady Duga: It would be helpful to have 2 sets of eyes on this. It would be better to have more than just me.
Deborah Kaplan: I vaguely remember to be part of this. I remember saying “I have no expertise, but I have eyes” I am no more expert than any other security concerned person.
Brady Duga: I’m in the same boat.
Deborah Kaplan: I’ll do it with you then.
Ivan Herman: I try to be helpful… these tests are very big - they address a wide range of recommendations. We are in a position where we are - most of the issues that are there are irrelevant. For internationalization one, it was certainly the case that most of the questions were irrelevant.
… they were talking about markups or user fillable forms. The internationalization - it was a 2 level form. There were lots of questions where if you answer no, you don’t have to fill in more data. For most of your questions, it will be similar.
… I promise it won’t be as awful as it looks like.
Wendy Reid: Internationalization, Security & Privacy, then we have Accessibility. Avneesh…
Avneesh Singh: See Issue #13 for audio has just been raised
Avneesh Singh: I have gone through the draft today (latest) and I was pleased to see the info under the accessibility heading - I opened up a minor issue. I just want to know when the editors draft will be published, so I can start discussing the details with the accessibility group.
… This will be discussed at TPAC in a joint session. I’m comfortable with it. Once this one issue is resolved and we have the official public draft, it’ll be good to have the public data.
Ivan Herman: The publication manifest will become a first public working draft tomorrow. Once that’s out, Matt, Wendy or I will publish the Audiobook as a new draft. We do it later to ensure all the cross references.
… by tomorrow evening - my time - both documents will be official drafts, and you can use them as you need.
Wendy Reid: to add to that, the issue you filed, it’s a simple one to solve. I’ll make that change so it’s in the latest draft since it’s such an easy one to check off
… Ivan, have I covered all the horizontal review?
Ivan Herman: we had an earlier review with the TAG and that is all covered. One thing that is important is the APA review, and the work that Brady and Deborah will do - it needs to be very well documented.
… and at least be public in having us signing off - which I did for internationalization. When we ask for authorization to go to CR, we have to prove that we’ve done what has been requested. We are a little late, and we should have done this 2 months ago, but we can always ask forgiveness…
2. remaining issues in audio and lpf
2.1. Hadrien’s issues
Wendy Reid: See Audio issue #12
Wendy Reid: The next thing was to quickly make sure we’ve covered up any additional issues with LPF - Hadrien opened up an issue regarding a minor point of metadata, should we have a field for abridged/unabridged, and “does this contain adult content”
… I’ll write a PR for in the publication manifest, as they are both valid information for audiobooks or publications in general. Another is a mention of preview, which is already in manifest, but I’ll make a point of saying it’s included in audiobooks as well.
… Preview, abridged, and ‘contains explicit material’. Outside of Avneesh’s issue, this is the last to address before the next draft.
Ivan Herman: These will be added to publication manifest?
Wendy Reid: Yes. The preview stuff is already in there.
Ivan Herman: Are we sure those terms don’t exist in schema.org?
Wendy Reid: They do exist in schema.org - so those are the ones we need to use.
… we need to call them out as ones important to publications.
Ivan Herman: One practical thing, I know that Matt (who is out today) has made a pretty big rewrite and I presume he’ll do a PR today or tomorrow. It may be worth waiting for that to get through and done as those issues have already been accepted.
… otherwise we get into merge problems.
Wendy Reid: I’ll wait for that
2.2. LPF issues
Wendy Reid: Laurent - meant to reach out, do you have more issues?
Laurent Le Meur: I have 2 tiny issues for LPF. One is in pull request #1, it was a wording matter speaking about path in archives where the publication manifest is talking about URL strings. I prefer the renaming the notion of path in URL strings to be consistent with publication manifest.
… I can merge as soon as we agree. I see Ivan and Luc seems to be OK with that.
Wendy Reid: Does anyone have concerns with that PR?
Laurent Le Meur: The other issue I haven’t created a PR yet. It’s only that we still make reference to the web pub manifest, and I have to redirect the reference to the publication - so it’s an editorial.
Wendy Reid: As someone who just did that 2 weeks ago, it’s a bit of a pain, but not too bad.
Laurent Le Meur: Everything else is ok. If you can read it before we publish it as well, that would be good.
… If the people in the group can review - I think this is the final state.
2.3. Back to issue audio #12
Garth Conboy: I just wanted to reflect, the other issue that Hadrien raised in #12 - the HTML TOC, as we discussed historically and recently, we do not want to reopen this at this time. His point is that it didn’t map well to audio-ingest platforms. The discussion we had previously..
… was that most support epub, and this is a relic of that, so we want to stay with that HTML agreement, and if this crops up as an implementation issue, it can be re-evaluated, but at the time, we had some producer input as well that got on board with this.
… we are in OK shape until we’re at the implementation stage. If we’re wrong there, we can reopen
Wendy Reid: Any other questions about Audiobook or LPF work?
3. Manifest issue #39 on I18N
Wendy Reid: See Issue #39
Ivan Herman: See proposal to resolve #39
Ivan Herman: This has come up with the internationalization. There are 2 issues with the language. One is that we do set the language of the manifest - what we say is that the language setting we have is for the textual entries of the manifest and the publication as a whole…
… so we are conflating 2 different things. In many cases, those two languages are the same, but I can imagine publishers publishing a language book, which has one or more languages inside and on the other hand, the metadata is in a different language.
… this conflation is too narrow in some cases - and that’s the kind of question I saw there. I came up with a proposal for simple cases its’ fine, but we introduce a new term - publication language - which could be an array/list of languages
… these can be different in what we set for the manifest. If the property is not used, it’s the same as the manifest, but we leave the door open for additional terms. That’s my proposal
Wendy Reid: OK - does anyone have questions or comments?
Laurent Le Meur: I answered already that I agree. It seems the most robust solution, but in the wording, let’s be careful that the languages are set - the implementors must know what is the primary language of the content showing to the user. It should be pub language.
… I think that the best solution is that if pub language exists, that’s the primary.
Proposed resolution: create a PR along the lines of comment on issue #39 and this would close issue #39 (Ivan Herman)
Garth Conboy: +1
Wendy Reid: +1
Laurent Le Meur: +1
Bill Kasdorf: +1
Nick Ruffilo: +1
Brady Duga: +1
Dave Cramer: 0
Resolution #2: create a PR along the lines of comment on issue #39 and this would close issue #39
Dave Cramer: I’ve just suffered too much from these discussions with epub - the language of the publication and the metadata, and what if they don’t match… Leaving as much to the content is a good thing - just makes me nervous…
4. TPAC agenda
Wendy Reid: See Preliminary agenda
Wendy Reid: TPAC agenda - I’m working on a rough agenda. You’ll see it fill out more this week. If you’re going to be there, please RSVP for dinner so we can figure that out. We’ll flesh out the schedule more this week, so keep an eye out there.
… I believe that is everything for today - unless anyone has other matters they want to talk about.
Avneesh Singh: How much time to polish for working draft after TPAC?
Ivan Herman: the end of the charter is July - so we have to finish all the testing, which is part of the CR - sometime in May. The question is how much time we’ll need for testing…
… how we will do testing and what’s our plan
… and then we will have a very hard deadline to get the documents out after TPAC. I would hope to get them out 1-2 weeks after TPAC…