See also: IRC log, previous 2007-07-05
<ShaneM> I am going to be on the call... btu I expect I will be on the road when doing it. sry
<Steven> ok
<Steven> When you have time
<Steven> I need advice on what exactly to do to convert an html doc to mhtml
<Steven> (for your system)
<Steven> hi
<scribe> ScribeNick: mhausenblas
http://www.w3.org/2007/07/05-rdfa-minutes.html#ActionSummary
<RalphS> previous 2007-07-05
<ShaneM> that chop is likely from ben's IP phone
<scribe> ACTION: [NEW] Ben make a scribe schedule [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/05-rdfa-minutes.html#action01] [DONE]
<scribe> ACTION: [NEW] Ben summarize the state of @rel everywhere [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/05-rdfa-minutes.html#action16] [DONE]
<scribe> ACTION: [NEW] Ben to send to mailing list PROPOSE: LINK and META appear only in HEAD with no changes to content model [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/05-rdfa-minutes.html#action15] [DONE]
<scribe> ACTION: [PENDING] Ben/Ralph to figure out the RDFa-GRDDL-profile URI (at w3.org) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/14-rdfa-minutes.html#action15] [CONTINUES]
<scribe> ACTION: [PENDING] Ben to look into Science Commons use case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action04] [CONTINUES]
<scribe> ACTION: [PENDING] Elias to send email to list with use case from IBM [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/04-htmltf-minutes.html#action10] [CONTINUES]
<scribe> ACTION: [PENDING] Mark get input from Joost on @HREF everywhere [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/21-rdfa-minutes.html#action14] [CONTINUES]
<RalphS> Scribe schedule
<scribe> ACTION: [PENDING] MarkB to work rdf:label back into RDFa syntax when using @content [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/03/19-rdfa-minutes.html#action25] [CONTINUES]
<scribe> ACTION: [PENDING] Shane investigate the @xml:base validation issue [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/28-rdfa-minutes.html#action02] [CONTINUES]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Jul/0059
Ben: XHTML 1.1: it would be
useful to have an attrib
... issues: clickable
Steven: XHTML 2 all URL need to
be navigable
... but not the same as clickable (as <a>)
... I opt for dereference URL
Mark: Cf. to RDF URIRef
Ralph: Mark's interpretation
might be too strict
... support Steven's POV
... compare with CSS-aware client
Mark: If information resource is
derefable, it should be used
... isbn-URN
Ben: Ok, let's take the book
example
... has an URN (ISBN)
Ralph: Try to understand Mark's
POV
... see example <span href="urn:...">
Mark: You could create UI for
user, but need the metadata
... what is the default behaviour
Ralph: A non-metadata client might not have a default behaviour
Mark: Example: Page with hundreds
of books
... linking to, say, amazon
... with how many clickable links you end up?
Ralph: Interpreting Steven, it
depends on the client to figure out what to do
... with a link (derefable)
Mark: Think about smart
browser
... but what if there is nothing to go
Ralph: The concern might be
that the author has no way to determine the way
scribe: a user might follow the link
Mark: We deal with RDF resources vs. navigable links
Steven: Subject and Objects are intersting things to follow
Mark: currently only object
Ralph: Any time there is a
URL
... display context sensitive menu that allows for exploring a
URL(I) content
Ben: So there may be cases for @resource
Mark: Don't mind @href
everywhere
... but different layers (triple layer, render, etc.)
... Misuse is possible, but that might not be a problem
Ben: Try to find an
agreement
... @href should be everywhere
... but also need @resource
Mark: One step at a time
... @href might need to become derefable
Ralph: A bit confused ...
... in Mark's mail @href and @resource not the same semantics
wrt RDFa
Mark: In XHTML 2 context not a
problem
... we can't enforce it in XHTML 1
... RDFa is about RDF - in (X)HTML
... not change the behaviour of host language
Ralph: But we can define how to behave wrt @resource
Mark: What I mean is, we try here to add functionality in the UA
Ralph: Have a foot in both fields (RDF and HTML)
ACTION: Ben to sum up @href/@resource everywhere proposal [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-rdfa-minutes.html#action10]
I'd opt for a new attrib (liked @instanceOf)
Ben: Preferences for new attribute?
Ralph: No strong opinion
<RalphS> Ralph: from the pure RDF perspective, @href and @resource may have identical semantics. We can also say that we do not expect UAs to go to great lengths to make @resource "navigable". I would not, however, _prohibit_ UAs from making @resource have some interface representation
Steven: happy with new attrib
Ralph: new attrib would be ok
Ben: Looks like I'm the only one who prefers @class
<RalphS> Ralph: architecturally, I believe a new attribute is the right choice
Ralph: Architectural POV would be good
<RalphS> ... however I respect the well-adopted precedents in the community
Ben: Might cause problems
... Agreement to have new attrib
<benadida> PROPOSAL: use a new attribute, not class or role, for syntactic sugar for rdf:type, name to be determined on the mailing list
BEN: Any oppostion?
<benadida> RESOLVED, with Ben's reservation regarding changing away from @class
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Jul/0057
Ben: Let's split
... for bNode resolved
Mark: Can live with @rel
everywhere
... but 'political' level
... with all new attribs
Ben: So let's keep @rel
... striping discussed separatly
... remaining issues: what happens when you have @href and @rel
everywhere
Ralph: Fallback wrt HTML 5
Ben: Will be addresses, though wide ranging
Shane: Example what @rel without @href means
Steven: New validator is available next week, AFAIK
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Jul/0041
<benadida> <img about="s" rel="p" src="o" class="t">
<benadida> <img about="s" rel="p" src="o" instanceof="t">
<benadida> s p o
<benadida> o rdf:type t
+1
Ben: As <img> has no
content, this causes no prob
... same for <object>
... <script> may have no content either
Ralph: Why it isn't [s rdf:type t]
Mark: Because we are talking about the img
Michael: This might be a bit too much of syntactic sugar, confusing (new) RDFa users
<benadida> <div rel="foo:bar" instanceof="foo:Baz">
<benadida> <div about="#a" rel="foo:bar" instanceof="foo:Baz">
Mark: Cf. to the 'old way' with link in div (bNode)
<benadida> <#a> foo:bar [rdf:type foo:Baz]
Mark: Nothing stops us writing it all longhand in the examples
Ben: Can we agree on <img> @src behaves like @rel
Ralph: Might need to study this deeper
Ben: We making good progress
Michael: TC TC TC :)
Ralph: F2F SWD-WG action
... Nov TechPlenary meeting
... but as of our schedule, we might not need a F2F,
there
... if so then in the context of the XHTML 2 WG
<Zakim> RalphS, you wanted to mention f2f
Ben: Thanks everyone ... till next week