Verifiable Credentials Working Group Telco — Minutes

Date: 2023-01-11

See also the Agenda and the IRC Log

Attendees

Present: Chris Abernethy, Ivan Herman, Brent Zundel, Sebastian Elfors, David Chadwick, Will Abramson, Dave Longley, Manu Sporny, Ted Thibodeau Jr., Phillip Long, Joe Andrieu, David Lehn, Michael Jones, Dmitri Zagidulin, Shawn Butterfield, Oliver Terbu, Andres Uribe, Juan Caballero, Orie Steele, Kristina Yasuda

Regrets:

Guests:

Chair: Brent Zundel

Scribe(s): Sebastian Elfors

Content:

Sebastian Elfors: Brent kicked off the meeting..

Sebastian Elfors: Agenda was reviewed: face to face meeting and open issues..

Manu Sporny: Status list has been moved to the working group..

Brent Zundel: Any new participants?.

Ivan Herman: No changes in status, little less available than usual..

1. F2F Meeting.

Brent Zundel: First topic is face to face meeting. The plan is a face to face meeting in February in Miami..
… Still unclear about travelling plans. Could postpone meeting..

Michael Jones: What are the dates?.

Brent Zundel: Dates to be decided still..

2. Work Item status updates/PRs.

Manu Sporny: Going through work items. Sharing the screen….

2.1. Added presentationSchema (pr vc-data-model#987)

See github pull request vc-data-model#987.

Manu Sporny: A lot of topics for today. Asking David Chadwick for PR 987..

David Chadwick: Don’t believe anyhting outstanding..

Manu Sporny: Confirmed. Orie to confirm..

2.2. Remove ZKP Section (pr vc-data-model#999)

See github pull request vc-data-model#999.

Manu Sporny: Next PR is to remove the ZKP section..
… PR 999 is the ZKP section. We need guidance what to do with the ZKP section..
… Brent has written most of the ZKP section..
… We need more commentary on this PR..

2.3. Add media type registration request (pr vc-data-model#1000)

See github pull request vc-data-model#1000.

Manu Sporny: Next PR 1000 is about media types registration..

Michael Jones: There is an important distinction between the type that is signed versus the type that is the entire thing..

Manu Sporny: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-mediaman-suffixes.

Manu Sporny: Mike’s comments will be useful input to the PR. Mike will provide more info in writing..

Michael Jones: IETF may need multiple plus signs..

Manu Sporny: This will have impact on the W3C VC efforts as well..
… We need more reviewers what to do to with this..

2.4. Add @vocab to v2 context (pr vc-data-model#1001)

See github pull request vc-data-model#1001.

Manu Sporny: Next PR is 1001. It’s about add vocabulary. We need more reviewers on this..

2.5. Update all examples to use new v2 JSON-LD Context (pr vc-data-model#1003)

See github pull request vc-data-model#1003.

Manu Sporny: Next PR is 1003. This PR updates all examples to use JSON-LD context..
… PR 1003 updates the examples to use JSON-LD context. Updates all URLs..

2.6. Add termsOfUse to presentations in v2 context. (pr vc-data-model#1004)

See github pull request vc-data-model#1004.

Manu Sporny: PR 1004 fixes an issue that Kyle found a year ago. Convey that a holder should present the VC in accordance with JSON-LD. Supposed to be a bug fix..

Ivan Herman: Is this term that should go to the vocab?.

Manu Sporny: It should already be there..

2.7. Clarify appropriate usage of type information during validation. (pr vc-data-model#1005)

See github pull request vc-data-model#1005.

Manu Sporny: Next PR is appropriate use of types. Kristina raised an issue about what is an appropriate VC/VP..
… DavidC and Manu have proposed edits what is appropriate use. That is PR 1005..

David Chadwick: No problem with the text, there was a reference to an appendix without any further details on type..

Manu Sporny: It points to the section on validations..

David Chadwick: This section does not contain the details..
… Will propose changes to the section..

2.8. Automatic generation of the vocab files via github actions (pr vc-data-model#1006)

See github pull request vc-data-model#1006.

Manu Sporny: Automatically generating vocabulary in PR 1006..
… Ivan wrote tools for autogenerating vocab..

Ivan Herman: It should not be merged until the repo is updated; the github pages would then rely on the gh-pages branch rather than main..

Manu Sporny: Will fix the repo before merging..

Ivan Herman: There are details to be fixed manually..

2.9. Add note on verification relationships to Security Considerations. (pr vc-data-integrity#75)

See github pull request vc-data-integrity#75.

Manu Sporny: It’s filling out the security considerations section..

2.10. Add section on Canonicalization Method Correctness. (pr vc-data-integrity#76)

See github pull request vc-data-integrity#76.

Manu Sporny: Clarify that key is used for data integrity. PR 75..
… PR 76 is about canonicalization schemes..
… Both editorial changes..

2.11. VC status list.

Manu Sporny: Finally, VC status list is a thing. There are no pull requests in it..
… We need to do some processing. There are some questions who are the editors. No PRs for this..
… And that’s it..

3. Issue Discussion.

Brent Zundel: Will move on to issues. Thanks manu for the PRs..

Brent Zundel: https://github.com/w3c/vc-data-model/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+label%3Adiscuss+sort%3Aupdated-asc.

Brent Zundel: We are working through the list above..

3.1. Dereferencing relative to issuer (issue vc-data-model#914)

See github issue vc-data-model#914.

Brent Zundel: Start with issue 914..
… Referencing relative issuer. When somebody looks at the issuer URL, what should they get back?.
… No action taken since last time. Any updates?.

Manu Sporny: There will be text in the VC Data Model who to reference this..
… We can keep it like this if it addresses Orie’s concern..
… This text has to be written for the VC Data Integrity Model..

Brent Zundel: When this PR has been written, it should be linked to the issue..
… Next issue is 846..

3.2. Include a regex for XML Date Time in the next version of the standard. (issue vc-data-model#846)

See github issue vc-data-model#846.

Brent Zundel: Include date and time for the standard..
… No opposition to this proposal..
… Any volunteers to write this?.

Manu Sporny: Terrified to get this wrong. A bug in the scheme. It’s possible that the regx could be incorrect..
… There should be timezone in the date and time. We need regx experts to get it right..

Brent Zundel: Any volunteers?.

Ivan Herman: Do we have a decision to use the XSD date and time?.

Manu Sporny: We have gone through three variants. XML schema 1, regx, ….

Ivan Herman: Not asking about regex. Asking for definition about daytime..

Manu Sporny: We have looked into this. We are looking at XML schema for daytime, but it was wrong..
… You have to specify the timezone..
… Times are hard. :-).
… XML schema must specify timezone..

3.3. Implementation Issues and under specification (issue vc-data-model#709)

See github issue vc-data-model#709.

Brent Zundel: Implementation issues. Lost track of what this means. Update the title..
… What is the shape of the document and VC? Related to the issue Orie has raised..
… Will be partially addressed based on Orie’s issue..
… Any comments?.
… Will change the title to something more useful..

Manu Sporny: This is also related to the previous issue. It’s the same question. It’s a duplicate..

Brent Zundel: Tony has requested this to remain open..

3.4. ACDC (Authentic Chained Data Containers) in VC DM 2.0 (issue vc-data-model#895)

See github issue vc-data-model#895.

Brent Zundel: Authentication changes raised by Mike Smith. Discussed at TPAC..
… Not much has happened since the TPAC..

Manu Sporny: Work has to happen. General meta-comment about challenges related to the big tens..
… Can we address this problem by calling them digital credentials. There are several different digital credentials..
… Unless there is technical work, we can come to a resolution that the big tents are digital credentials..

Joe Andrieu: It’s a conversion to be had. that issue 895 requires work to be done – PRs to VCDM – and it’s not about “big tent” discussion.

Manu Sporny: I agree with Joe’s take on the issue..

Joe Andrieu: The specific request is adjustment to the VCDM as opposed to the request on big tens..
… We have started the conversation..
… If there are any concrete proposals we can proceed..

Michael Jones: Naming is hard. Digital credentials name leaves out the verifiable part..
… You can call it digital verifiable credentials..
… In the OpenID world we can call it credentials. Subtype is W3C VCs..

Orie Steele: +1 selfissued.

Michael Jones: Prefer to keep the word VC..

Manu Sporny: Strong -1..
… Reusing terms is problematic..

Orie Steele: There is no trademark on Verifiable Credentials, AFAIK..

Joe Andrieu: @Orie, you should talk with a lawyer. I would wager good money there is, in fact, a trademark. No doubt is unregistered, but that is not how trademarks are established in fact..

Manu Sporny: This will lead to conflicts in the ecosystem. Please don’t do that in OpenID..

Michael Jones: This is not only term for VC..

David Chadwick: Support Manu. The title is W3C VC Data Model. We have claimed term VC in the W3C VC spec..

Orie Steele: Notice the search trends for “verifiable credentials”… https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=verifiable%20credentials.

Joe Andrieu: Agree with Manu..

Phillip Long: +1 to Manu’s and David’d comments VC is known and connected to W3C in the public’s mind..

Joe Andrieu: Inappropriate to reuse the term in other specs..

Ted Thibodeau Jr.: Agree that we cannot control other groups..
… There are people that can influence other groups. We minted the term VC..

3.5. Limit JSON-LD optionality to enhance developer experience (issue vc-data-model#948)

See github issue vc-data-model#948.

Brent Zundel: Next issue is 948. Limit JSON-LD to enhance developer experience..

Manu Sporny: There are other things we can do..
… Only JSON-LD compact form could be allowed..
… We are using vocab already..
… Developer mode context has been taken over by the vocab..
… Only thing to do is to raise PR to use JSON-LD compact..

Orie Steele: See the related open PR: https://github.com/w3c/vc-data-model/pull/1001.

3.6. Fix the vc-data-model namespace with https://www.w3.org/ns/vc/v2 (issue vc-data-model#758)

See github issue vc-data-model#758.

Brent Zundel: Next up is 758..
… Fix the VC Data Model namespace..
… Brought up by the previous WG..

Manu Sporny: We should do this, but the URL may be wrong.

Manu Sporny: This PR establishes a new JSON-LD context location: https://github.com/w3c/vc-data-model/pull/1003.

Manu Sporny: There is an open PR. It’s 1003.

Manu Sporny: new URL is: https://www.w3.org/ns/credentials/v2.

Manu Sporny: This PR specifies a new URL.

Orie Steele: +1 to the PR that removes 2018 from the context URLs…..

Manu Sporny: NS/Credentials should be used..

Ivan Herman: We may mix up things. Are we talking about the URL for the context or the vocabulary?.
… The PR is about the LD context, the issue about the vocabulary..

Orie Steele: I am in favor of removing 2018 from “both places”..

Manu Sporny: There are three things..
… One URL is about the LD context. No legacy there..
… The other one is the human readable vocab. Should NS/credentials..

Orie Steele: +1 Manu.

Orie Steele: Lets fix the easy ones first…. but I am in favor of fixing this everywhere.

Manu Sporny: The next issue is changing the term URLs..

Ivan Herman: We should accept that there is a bad URL for the terms..
… There has been ugly URLs in the past. We should be careful to change them..

Orie Steele: -1 Ivan… I don’t agree..

Manu Sporny: +1 Ivan, agree… no one but developers see those URLs and shouldn’t care..

Manu Sporny: (there are also variations of what we could do here).

Manu Sporny: +1 to what Ivan says above ^.

Orie Steele: -1, and would like to discuss this in depth..

Brent Zundel: Ending the meeting..