LLD XG

<emma> Previous : http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/06/10-lld-minutes.html

<emma> zakim LLD to here

<kai> thanks antoine

<kcoyle> there's a fair amount of background noise on the line

<bernard> Can't get through through Nice call number

<dlukose> finally I managed to understand how this thing works - I think......lol

<jodi> US bridge: +1-617-761-6200

<dlukose> yes please

<bernard> should I call the US bridge too ?

<emma> Scribe : Ed

<rsinger> i can't get the conference code to work

<dlukose> dlukose zakim, who is noisy

<rsinger> oh well, i don't have any idea how to call internationally from here

Administrative

emma: anyone have comments on the minutes?
... now we have antoine to report on clean up of mailing list

antoine: i edited the mailing list page on the wiki, hopefully it's clearer now?

<antoine> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Lists

antoine: it's a set of guidelines about when to use each list, public-xg-lld for administrative stuff, and public-lld for other stuff

emma: you wanted to mention something about branding?

<antoine> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Jun/0058.html

antoine: for example there was an email from william, about work he had done, i feel that this would fit the wide open list
... since it's of interest to people outside our working group potentially
... asking about deliverables, this fits the member list better (karen's email)
... if people feel it's not useful to do this, please voice it

emma: any comments?

<jodi> I think that the mailing list structure adds a little bit of mental overhead, but that it could be useful for public (filtering out phone calls, etc)

<antoine> ACTION: Antoine to clean up mailing list on http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/ [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/06/03-lld-minutes.html#action01] [DONE]

emma: next issue is the Wiki login, is it working for everyone now?

<antoine> ACTION: All group members should please post an introduction to http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/06/10-lld-minutes.html#action01] [CONTINUES]

emma: there was an action to indicate your availability for the f2f meeting

<antoine> ACTION: ALL: group members please indicate your availability for the proposed F2F meeting in a Doodle poll: http://www.doodle.com/gaipzmfc7xp9f4zq [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/06/10-lld-minutes.html#action08] [CONTINUES]

emma: we didn't have many answers, but we want to schedule asap, so please fill it out

<stu_> everything went quiet... did I lose the call?

<bernard> 24 answers to the poll now

emma: the next topic is the summer schedule
... jul-1, jul-15 and aug-05 we don't have meetings scheduled

<antoine> ACTION: ALL: Flag July/August availability at http://www.doodle.com/hvwb4fe4x2kdq3cy [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/06/03-lld-minutes.html#action03] [DONE]

<rsinger> +1 to during DC-2010

TomB: we need a clear picture of the people who can attend, if we're going to have a smaller meeting we could have it during the dc2010 conference (weds, thurs, fri) ... i will post a note about this to the list, but please everyone answer the poll so we get a picture of how many people could potentially attend

<rsinger> but i've already made that known :)

Topic 2: Task group progress

<kai> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/UseCases#Use_Case_template

kai: i copy n' pasted from the provenance xg, and wrote a mail on the public list, we have some open questions
... the provenance group used 'dimensions' to organize the use cases...to provide some direction to where we expect use cases to focus...we would need to decide on these ... maybe we could ask for specific rdf vocabularies that are in use (e.g. skos, dublincore) , or leave it open
... the schedule for the next steps, perhaps 1 or 2 weeks to get comments on the template http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/UseCases#Use_Case_template
... do we publish it on mailing lists, or do we fill them out ourselves, or a combination?

emma: 3 questions: first is whether or not we need to define dimensions

antoine: i was wondering if the topic list on the wiki could be used to help define this analysis grid you are mentioning

kai: yes, that could be a good starting point

emma: i agree too

<jeff_> +1

<Andras> +1

emma: does everyone else agree that we could use the topic list to define the dimensions for the use case grid?

<gneher> +1

<GordonD> +1

<matolat> +1

<marma> +1

<jonphipps> +1

<dlukose> +1

antoine: kai, you were involved in the provenance xg?

<bernard> +1

antoine: did the dimension thing work well?

<rsinger> +1

<marcia> +1

kai: yes, it did, take a look at the provenance xg wiki, especially if there are a lot of use cases

<jar> I assume we're talking about http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Topics ?

<jodi> Here are the provenance attributes/dimensions: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/Provenance_Dimensions

emma: it sounds like there is consensus there about using the dimension idea

<jodi> that looks useful to me!

<jodi> (use cases then wound up here: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/prov/wiki/Use_Cases )

emma: the 2nd question you asked, was about specific use cases for the template? useful for skos implementations?

kai: it depends if we want to lead it in a specific direction, but the risk is that we don't get responses because it's too specific
... antoine's idea to just ask for the vocabularies really makes sense

emma: maybe we could discuss this on the list?

kai: better to do this more open, without much time pressure, i suggested 1 to 2 weeks so everyone can contribute

<antoine> +1 for kai's timeline

<jeff_> +1

emma: suggested timeline: public comments till june 30th ; summary on july 1st ; july 7th finalizing template ; july 8th final decision

<Zakim> antoine, you wanted to ask kai about the coverage of Prov XG UCs

antoine: it seems like provenance group was targeted at many different domains?

kai: that definitely was the case. but i still think the question for background makes sense, because i'm not sure what use cases to expect

antoine: was it descriptions of scenarios, or things that have already been implemented?

kai: we had a lot of use cases, and we tried to consolidate along dimensions, in the final report we only had 3 scenarios where we combined a lot of use cases together

<scribe> ACTION: All to comment on the template http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/UseCases#Use_Case_template [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/06/17-lld-minutes.html#action06]

<scribe> ACTION: Antoine and kai to prepare a template for use cases. Kai to contibute a template from the provenance group [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/06/10-lld-minutes.html#action03] [DONE]

<TomB> Karen is referring to http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Presentations

<antoine> Karen's page: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Presentations

emma: karen can we get an update about the presentations page?

kcoyle: we should organize content of the presentations following the topic list
... was wondering if that made sense to everyone

<jeff_> +1

<antoine> +1

<TomB> +1 following the topic list

<stu_> +1

<marma> +1

<gneher> +1

<kai> +1

<marcia> Karen asked people to add the known or their own presentations there.

<GordonD> =1

<antoine> edsu: I wonder how many we have

edsu: maybe just adding them to a page first, and organizing later might be good

<marcia> +1

<jonphipps> +1

kcoyle: can you paste the wiki url in here if there is one?

<rsinger> i just added my code4lib presentation to the wiki page

<kcoyle> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Presentations

antoine: should blog posts and articles be included?

<jodi> maybe we could have a separate page with blog posts and articles?

<antoine> I added the SKOS presentations

kcoyle: when tom and i talked about this we were focused on ways of showing what linked data is about ; but texts would have drawings and diagrams in them ; also relevant would graphics that people use and reuse

<jodi> I have tagged many things semantic libraries (e.g. in delicious and pinboard)

<gneher> +q about language of presentations

kcoyle: i tend to have images that i tend to re-use in many different presentations ; if people have different graphics they've created it would be nice to have them collected so that everyone can look at them and use them

<Zakim> TomB, you wanted to suggest that we need real examples with nice graphics

TomB: i think we would all benefit, we need a few real examples from actual projects, and have them done up with nice graphics, if we all contribute our piece

gneher: i wanted to ask if the language of the presentations matter

edsu: gneher++ # good question

<Zakim> gneher, you wanted to ask, if language of presentations does matter

<TomB> +1 to link to presentations in any language

<rsinger> all languages welcome, in my mind

kcoyle: my feeling is that they should be any language, i hope that the presentations we create for re-use we would do it so that they are easily translated, or not require translation -- not wordy

<kai> +1 for any language, better a foreign language than no presentation at all...

<emma> +1

<antoine> +1

<gneher> +1

<GordonD> +1

TomB: yes i agree

<bernard> +1 (for french :)

<fumi> +1

<scribe> ACTION: TomB and KCoyle will create a page for presentations and will upload some slides [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/06/10-lld-minutes.html#action04] [DONE]

<antoine> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Presentations

emma: any comments on adding topic to the wiki? http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Topics

antoine: people added some topics that were really interesting, but i think there might be some overlap between the topics
... maybe it needs some cleaning, i've made some comments on ones that can be connected, it would be nice if people who added them could group them

<kcoyle> +1 for cleaning up after a while

<scribe> ACTION: ALL: Edit the topics for our work at the wiki: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Topics[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/06/03-lld-minutes.html#action02] [CONTINUES]

Community building and outreach

emma: i've added a few words about this in the agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Jun/0082.html
... also some information in the charter
... there are connections to other activities
... what we would like to do is create a relation with these activities so it can help us with the use case and technology parts of our deliverables
... there is probably a specific task for the group, about building the community within and without the library community
... we need to determine the objectives of the effort, what we can expect from these outside groups
... demonstrate how these technologies are relevant to the lld use cases

antoine: seems like a good thing for getting use cases, where to send the call for use cases, if we decide to send call out to wider world
... i wanted to ask participants if they could act as liasons, was happy when reading the participant introductions

emma: it would be nice to identify the participants that can help with this task

<stu_> I think care should be taken to not incite excessive input from the outside, as it will risk overwhelming the agenda. We have a substantial roster of people participating... are we really concerned about not covering the range of Linked Data activities in our community?

<bernard> how do we register?

<jodi> +1

<antoine> edsu: +1 for sending UC to different communities

<GordonD> I can liaise with the various IFLA initiatives (FRBR, FRAD, ISBD, and I hope more to come (UNIMARC, FR consolidated model)

stu_: it would be easy to enter a period of thrashing, this group has a very high calibre list of people, we probably will capture most of what we are interested in without going outside, maybe when we create subgroups of activities it will make sense to make further progress

<GordonD> +1 for being cautious about inciting excessive input - cf involvement of library community with RDA

<jeff_> +1

<TomB> +1

<rsinger> +1

stu_: maybe ask this question of outside groups when we are looking for next steps

<antoine> +1 I buy the argument!

<bernard> +1

<kai> +1

:-)

<kai> :-)

emma: next meeting we will talk about the vocabularies best practices, and planning issues

emma: ok, meeting adjourned

<bernard> bye all

<jodi> bye

<gneher> bye

<marma> bye

<GordonD> bye

<matolat> bye

<Andras> bye

<emma> rrsagent draft minutes

<antoine> scribenick: edsu