Accessible Platform Architectures Working Group Teleconference

25 August 2021


amy_c, becky, FredrikFischer, IanPouncey, janina, Jonny_James, Lionel_Wolberger, MichaelC, mike_beganyi, PaulG_

Meeting minutes


Agenda Review & Announcements; W3C Calendar: https://www.w3.org/Guide/meetings/organize.html <https://www.w3.org/Guide/meetings/organize.html>

<becky> regrets, Gottfried Zimmerman, David Fazio

becky: We are trying the new calendar
… you can opt out of updates if you wish

Lionel_Wolberger: APA Chairs encourage every task force to enter the meetings into the calendar

becky: This should me it easier to track meetings.

TPAC Planning <https://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC/2021/GroupMeetings>

janina: Personalization requested a full session of their own.
… RQTF has decided to bow out of the full meeting
… the wiki list is up-to-date
… a new meeting on automotive accessibility
… will be organized as a breakout session
… THe meeting pattern is based on our live in person TPACs

Agenda Review & Announcements; W3C Calendar: https://www.w3.org/Guide/meetings/organize.html <https://www.w3.org/Guide/meetings/organize.html>

Task Force Updates;

Joshue108: XAUR has been published

janina: RQTF is discussing SAUR
… it will soon be ready
… there was a relevant white paper from BBC

PaulG_: Pronunciation is clarifying language around the suggestion API
… an i18n issues

Lionel_Wolberger: Personalization spent a lot of the meeting planning for TPAC
… Smoothed how we track actions, not using the wiki so much as git (with labels) and w3c action tracker

FAST Progress)

Joshue108: Jake has been working on a methodology that we can use for gap analysis of user needs and outcomes
… Jake from Functional needs (also active in Silver)
… In the Error TF (sub-group of Silver)
… checking if the errors can be parsed through this methodology is effective
… user needs list and various functional outcomes
… should have results by end of this week

New Charters Review <https://github.com/w3c/strategy/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+label%3A%22Horizontal+review+requested>

MichaelC: No new charters this week

Accessibility Review Comment Tracker <https://w3c.github.io/horizontal-issue-tracker/?repo=w3c/a11y-review>

<MichaelC> https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/6351

MichaelC: Scroll bar width, Paul put in a comment and generated some debate

PaulG_: In the discussion, the trend is to assume that we cannot influence browser behavior
… I advocated for adding thick
… Browsers are bad at detecting when scroll bars are needed
… "thin" is in the spec, but "thick" was shot down
… the justification is the use of the spec when that is not a feature that they want authors to control, that is not appropriate
… since APA has not said that thick is generally required, they have nothing to point to

becky: can't users override CSS, and a user could request 'thick'?

PaulG_: Sounds good to me, but not to them


MichaelC: Sounds like they are ignoring an a11y issue for reasons that are not very well founded

janina: We had a use case as well: on zoom, this would be needed

PaulG_: They retort that zoom is handled by zoom, the browsers can have a setting that scroll bars grow with zoom or remain as-is
… all of the above is in the browsers' hands, and not in the CSS

PaulG_: We could assert a AAA requirement that a widget's scrollbars could be thickened with CSS

janina: AAA is a 2.x specification for WCAG, it's likely late for 2.2

<PaulG_> the "reel" https://every-layout.dev/layouts/reel/

MichaelC: I do see that it is browser developers pushing back in that discussion

PaulG_: How could it be a AAA issue without a CSS method to control it? Implies needing a ton of JS

becky: Use case, designing an exam for low vision people. The page is designed to have large text, and that population would want the thick scrollbar.

IanPouncey: Leaning on WCAG for this has an issue, as they dont rely on browser defaults (similar issue with placeholder text)

janina: Add this to the agenda of the group meeting

becky: We could say, if 'thin' was a mistake and you do not want thin & wide, then remove 'thin'

MichaelC: Recording that APA thinks our use cases are enough of a reason to address this, and we should meet at TPAC

New on TR <http://www.w3.org/TR/tr-status-drafts.html>

<MichaelC> Developing Localizable Manifests

janina: p11n is going to raise the issue that 'lang' attribute does not support today's and tomorrow's text-to-speech needs

<MichaelC> VirtualKeyboard API

Action: FredrikFischer to review VirtualKeyboard API https://www.w3.org/TR/virtual-keyboard/

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2307 - Review virtualkeyboard api https://www.w3.org/tr/virtual-keyboard/ [on Fredrik Fischer - due 2021-09-01].

<MichaelC> action-2307: https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/VirtualKeyboard_API

<trackbot> Notes added to action-2307 Review virtualkeyboard api https://www.w3.org/tr/virtual-keyboard/.

<MichaelC> WebXR Augmented Reality Module - Level 1

MichaelC: No review needed.

CSS Update (Amy) <https://github.com/w3c/css-a11y/issues>

<amy_c> https://github.com/w3c/a11y-request/issues/11

<amy_c> https://www.w3.org/TR/2021/CRD-css-masking-1-20210805/#intro

amy_c: CSS Masking Module Level 1. The main focus deals with SVGs
… seems that APA will not have a lot to say here

janina: Let's propose the TPAC joint meeting be at this hour, which we share anyway

becky: Regarding CSS Masking Module Level 1, decided: APA has no comments.

Dangling Spec Review Cleanup: <https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/wiki/Category:Spec_Review_Assigned>

Actions Checkin (Specs) <https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/track/actions/open>

<becky> discussing Review mitigating browser fingerprinting in web specifications (https://www.w3.org/wai/apa/wiki/mitigating_browser_fingerprinting_in_web_specifications)

<becky> https://www.w3.org/WAI/APA/track/actions/2306

<becky> https://www.w3.org/TR/fingerprinting-guidance/

FredrikFischer: The only note I had was the accessibility is used as a word meaning "available" or "connected." It would avoid confusion if the note used another word

janina: availability is a generally accepted word for this concept. So APA should point this out.

FredrikFischer: I will communicate this to them.

<becky> ACTION-2302: Review epub 3 text-to-speech enhancements 1.0, https://www.w3.org/tr/epub-tts-10,

<trackbot> Notes added to ACTION-2302 Review epub 3 text-to-speech enhancements 1.0, https://www.w3.org/tr/epub-tts-10, due in 2 weeks.

FredrikFischer: I find it good work, a good doc. Its work is overtaken by p11n

becky: We know we will be discussing this further at TPAC, so no further action needed at this time.

Summary of action items

  1. FredrikFischer to review VirtualKeyboard API https://www.w3.org/TR/virtual-keyboard/
Minutes manually created (not a transcript), formatted by scribe.perl version 136 (Thu May 27 13:50:24 2021 UTC).


Maybe present: Joshue108