VC WG Telco — Minutes

Date: 2022-01-12

See also the Agenda and the IRC Log

Attendees

Present: Brent Zundel, Shigeya Suzuki, Markus Sabadello, Logan Porter, Ryan Grant, Manu Sporny, Dave Longley, Joe Andrieu, David Chadwick, Juan Caballero

Regrets:

Guests:

Chair: Brent Zundel

Scribe(s): Markus Sabadello

Content:


Brent Zundel: We begin with agenda review.
… Agenda is plan for meetings going forward, then conversations about draft charter, review PR, issues.
… Any additions to the agenda?.

1. Meetings moving forward.

Brent Zundel: The voting period for changes we proposed for VC Data Model that will result in 1.1, that period is up on 18th January.
… This means we have fulfilled the primary purpose of this WG.
… So far all votes to my knowledge have been positive.
… I anticipate that we will want to determine how much work we as a WG have the capacity for.
… My thought is between this week and next, if it works for the editors, we could create the set of editorial changes that we want to fold in as soon as 1.1 spec is released.
… Then next week we can make a WG resolution to incorporate changes.
… After that, i think it makes more sense to meet less often, and focus on WG charter for the next group.
… Feedback about this?.

Manu Sporny: Largely supportive of that. I think we fulfilled charter for 1.1. update.
… There are still some 1.1 editorial issues, I will make a pass through to see which ones really need to get in there.
… I don’t think there is anything that can’t wait until re-chartering.
… Also +1 to focusing on charter.
… Did you say we will have fewer meetings? E.g. once a month? Or similar to DID WG?.
… I’d be supportive of scaling back to once a month, or ad-hoc.

Brent Zundel: That was my intention to say.

David Chadwick: When do we expect 2.0 WG to start?.

Brent Zundel: Really good question. I had a good conversation with Ivan who is planning to be team contact..
… I also had a good conversation with potential co-chair..
… Best timeline we could come up with was .. Charter gets formally reviewed by AC and voted.. We could see new WG as early as late March, that’s a best guess..
… Any other questions about meetings, document status?.

David Chadwick: Another question. If during next week we do edits, can we still do edits in between now and March?.

Brent Zundel: There is always more work that we can do.
… Speaking personally, with all the DID work and this, it’s been a heavy load, and a period without much spec work may be beneficial.

David Chadwick: So we should only concentrate on really pressing issues.

Brent Zundel: I think officially our charter ends at the end of April. That doesn’t mean we have to continue meeting weekly, considering we have met charter demands..

2. VCWG Draft Charter Issues.

Brent Zundel: https://github.com/w3c/vc-wg-charter/issues?q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen+sort%3Aupdated-asc.

Brent Zundel: I believe there are 2 issues and we can close 1.

2.1. Verifiable Credential Linked Data Integrity work should happen in a Linked Data working group (issue vc-wg-charter#21)

See github issue vc-wg-charter#21.

Brent Zundel: The discussion we had in this meeting, with lack of response from MikeJones who posted the issue, in my opinion this issue has been addressed and can be closed..

Manu Sporny: +1 to closing, agree with brentz’s assessment..

Brent Zundel: Any disagrees?.
… Going to write a quick note and close it..

2.2. Multilingual support for selecting a image file (issue vc-wg-charter#38)

See github issue vc-wg-charter#38.

Shigeya Suzuki: Sometimes we need to select from multiple image files to handle multi lingual text. Images may contain text inside images..
… This is different from how multilingual text is handled.
… I was thinking about opening a PR, but I could not find a good way to disclose that in a simple text.

Brent Zundel: Manu posted a comment.

Manu Sporny: But I was wrong.

Brent Zundel: Any suggestions for shigeya how to address this?.

Manu Sporny: We should reach out to Internationalization folks. We might want to ask them. Nothing is coming to mind, I understand the problem and desired to address it, but I don’t know…
… I could think of one way in JSON-LD how to do it, but not in this text approach..
… Maybe Internationalization folks have an idea how this can be done.

Shigeya Suzuki: I will talk to my friend to find out who is best to talk to.

Brent Zundel: As you discover things, please add comments to the issue.

David Chadwick: Work Human Colossus is doing on OCA could be a solution for this. They have tables with different tables to represent things. Table could also contain multiple images..
… I think markus is familiar with this.

Markus Sabadello: Little bit, but not enough to solve this.

David Chadwick: I’ll give you an email address of Human Colossus lead, you can chat to him directly. There are various presentations on Google, Youtube…
… On ESSIF-Lab they did a demo a few weeks ago.

David Chadwick: paul.knowles@humancolossus.org for details of Overlays Capture Architecture (OCA) that should provide a solution to multi-lingual images.

Juan Caballero: the oca repo is here: https://github.com/the-human-colossus-foundation/oca-spec.

Juan Caballero: they do some overlay/decorator stuff for mapping VC property names to new languages and char-sets.

Juan Caballero: described here: https://humancolossus.foundation/blog/cjzegoi58xgpfzwxyrqlroy48dihwz.

3. Charter PRs.

Brent Zundel: That is the set of issues. There are 2 PRs..

Brent Zundel: https://github.com/w3c/vc-wg-charter/pulls.

3.1. Add concrete cryptosuites to deliverables. (pr vc-wg-charter#37)

See github pull request vc-wg-charter#37.

Manu Sporny: At a previous meeting we decided we wanted to move some cryptosuites into normative deliverables..
… Data Integrity is not a concrete serialization, but Ed25519 and VC-JWT are.
… This says we will work on concrete cryptosuites, and it lists some preliminary work that the WG could standardize.
… Markus raised a good point, what if we want to standardize additional cryptosuites. Current language isn’t clear on it.
… Specifically, we don’t directly list NIST curves like P-386, we probably should add some language.

Ryan Grant: +1 to language allowing too add curves.

Manu Sporny: Prefer to not pull in the PR until that language is in there.

Brent Zundel: I think we could leave it a bit more open.

Ryan Grant: Is there a requirement to focus only on NIST curves?.

Manu Sporny: k1 curve potentially.
… If we are vague, we might do normative things on all of it. This might be a red flag on charter review, since we’re not very clear on concrete realizations we want to do..
… Feedback may be we need to specify this exactly..
… W3C members don’t like very open charters.
… That’s the challenge with making it more general. If we can’t point to a draft spec, people might push back on it..
… Easiest thing to do would be to point to draft spec. I think there is one for k1..

Juan Caballero: it may be helpful. i believe it’s MIT if I remember correctly.

Manu Sporny: Before charter goes out for review, someone could create a cryptosuite.
… Safest thing to do would be, if you want a particular type of cryposuite to be standardized, create a draft spec for it that we can cite in the charter..

Markus Sabadello: https://w3c-ccg.github.io/lds-ecdsa-secp256k1-2019/ ?.

Ryan Grant: makes sense here.

Brent Zundel: How harmful would it be to include a line “an others as determined by the WG”.

Manu Sporny: We can do that, I would expect that to result in a Formal Objection.
… We could try.
… If we are tied to it, we probably should be very specific.

Brent Zundel: So we hold off on merging this PR.
… Make comments on the PR if you want additional cryptosuites.

Manu Sporny: If someone wants a NIST curve, we could put together a cryptosuite.

Brent Zundel: Other comments or questions?.

3.2. Update link to Data Integrity draft CCG spec (pr vc-wg-charter#39)

See github pull request vc-wg-charter#39.

Manu Sporny: +1 to merge..

Brent Zundel: Markus fixed a link, appreciate that.
… Any concerns?.
… That’s our draft charter work, like I said we anticipate within a couple of weeks sending it out to the AC..

4. Review spec PRs.

Brent Zundel: We don’t have a lot of time to discuss; if there is any more tweaking, it needs to happen soon.

Brent Zundel: https://github.com/w3c/vc-data-model/pulls?q=is%3Apr+is%3Aopen+label%3A%22v1.1+%28editorial%29%22+sort%3Aupdated-asc.

See github pull request vc-data-model#847.

4.1. add section to differentiate between contexts and credential Schemas (pr vc-data-model#847)

See github pull request vc-data-model#847.

Manu Sporny: By Kyle, this tries to add language to clarify difference between @context and credentialSchema.
… I asked for changes, David Chadwick asked for changes as well. David Chadwick you rejected this?.

David Chadwick: I don’t know what the results of my proposed edits are. If my edits are accepted, I’d be +1.
… I got -1 from him, he doesn’t want to add types, seems he is rejecting all my changes.

Manu Sporny: So we can’t do anything with this without more discussion.

David Chadwick: He accepted one of my proposed changes.

Manu Sporny: I forgot to hit my “request changes” button..
… We can’t pull it in, will pick it up later.
… Adding a comment to the PR about there still being disagreement.

4.2. Rename “Linked Data Proofs” to “Data Integrity”. (pr vc-data-model#859)

See github pull request vc-data-model#859.

Manu Sporny: Renaming LD Proofs to Data Integrity, by Markus.
… I haven’t approved it yet, looks like it does what it says, looks good to me.
… It’s a change we’ve made across the board.
… Anyone on the call concerned with this?.
… We had just 1 day period on this PR…

Brent Zundel: I think we need a resolution what we will merge next week.

Manu Sporny: This will go in.

4.3. Chaals more diagrams (pr vc-data-model#855)

See github pull request vc-data-model#855.

Manu Sporny: Set of hand-optimizations to SVG files by Charles.
… brentz I think you were concerned about changes you requested?.

Brent Zundel: I believe requested changes have been made.

Manu Sporny: No objections I can see.
… If there are no huge problems with it, we should take the PR into the change set for next week.
… Any objections or concerns?.
… Charles is basically optimizing and compressing SVGs..

4.4. Edit of Proof Format section (pr vc-data-model#857)

See github pull request vc-data-model#857.

Manu Sporny: David Chadwick 5 days ago you opened this, and got changes requested from dlongley.
… I guess as long as these changes are made, this should go into change set for next week.
… These are all of our 1.1 editorial PRs.
… For 847 there’s time until next week to try to resolve it.

5. Triage Issues.

Brent Zundel: We still have a week to try and get PRs in.

Brent Zundel: https://github.com/w3c/vc-data-model/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+-label%3Av2.0+-label%3A%22v1.1+%28editorial%29%22+sort%3Aupdated-asc.

Brent Zundel: It’s still worth looking at issues to see if they fit in scope of work that is still before us.
… Support for multiple signatures https://github.com/w3c/vc-data-model/issues/856, appying a v2.0 label now.

Manu Sporny: No concerns with the actions. We do have a number of items that are marked as 1.1 editorial.

Brent Zundel: That’s the next topic.

6. v1.1 Issues.

Brent Zundel: https://github.com/w3c/vc-data-model/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+label%3A%22v1.1+%28editorial%29%22+sort%3Aupdated-asc.

Brent Zundel: All v1.1. editorial issues are at this link. Any of them we want to get into the spec? We should sort that out pretty much today.

Manu Sporny: Maybe just ask everyone on the call to look at them, and scream if one needs to be addressed?.

David Chadwick: I’m interested in JWT examples.

Manu Sporny: I’ll take that action.

David Chadwick: That’s a really good beneficial improvement.
… Issues 836 and 838?.

Manu Sporny: I’m talking about 838.

David Chadwick: It’s the presigned, which is useful.

Manu Sporny: If I can get to it, I will.

David Chadwick: Can I help you?.

Manu Sporny: Sure, add the features to the software library.

David Chadwick: Can I hand-do it?.

Manu Sporny: No, it’s automatically applied, requires software development.
… I’ll try to do it, it will be in the same area of code.. Just depends whether I have enough time to do it.

Brent Zundel: Is it different code for every example?.

Manu Sporny: Just need to write the code, test it, pull in new version.. Not hard, just takes time.

Brent Zundel: Anything else people feel needs to happen?.
… Otherwise issues will wait for next WG where we can cover them.
… Plan is to meet again in 1 week at a slightly earlier time. We will have a recently published revised recommendation.
… We will have a set of PRs that we have already merged, and a set of PRs in addition to that, and a proposal to the group to incorporate them.
… Kyle should we talk about the PR with you and David Chadwick ?.

Kyle Den Hartog: I can review Github comments.

Brent Zundel: I think 1-on-1 between you and David Chadwick would be helpful.

Kyle Den Hartog: Makes sense.

David Chadwick: Timezone is challenging.. Should we have a private Zoom call now?.

Kyle Den Hartog: Works for me.

Brent Zundel: Will end this meeting..

David Chadwick: Can we stay on this Zoom?.

Brent Zundel: It should stay open.

juancaballero: thx all.

Brent Zundel: Thanks everyone for incredible work, looking forward to working with you in a newly chartered group.