See also: IRC log
http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/open
close action-332
<trackbot> Closed action-332.
leandro: coming to TPAC
richard: new community
group
... looking for members
... character description group
<r12a> http://www.w3.org/community/cdl/
richard: describing characters based on strokes
JcK: ietf vs unicode issue about precombined marks suspended by not gone away
<JcK> Especially if it is to be an action item, that should be more like "new apparently precombined characters without decompositionss" or words to that effect. A different version would be whether Unicode "characters
<JcK> are language and phonetically independent within a script (as described in Section 2.2 of the Standard) or the degree to which language, phonetic use, and other usage issues that cannot be detected by a reader with no context are significant.
https://www.w3.org/International/wiki/Review_radar#Scheduled_Last_Call_reviews
<r12a> http://www.w3.org/International/docs/encoding/encoding-doc.html#issue-26154
<r12a> http://www.w3.org/International/docs/encoding/encoding-doc.html
(addison summarizes)
richard: want to reach CR by 12
september
... what is outstanding?
... working on clarifying, etc.
... going through disposition of comments
... will help
... two sections
... first is the LC issues
... two raised in bugzilla, rest on winter list
... second section is bugzilla items
... mostly old
... anne not willing to work on the larger items
... he sees this as on-going project without specific
deadlines
... don't know if we can defer
addison: don't know how we could correct later
richard: unicode violation
text
... ken whistler, chief editor, said "none of these are
violations"
... went further and suggested changes
... anne will change
... another thing causing worry
... things are not as clear cut on list of encodings and
indexes
... what characters in what codepoints, etc.
... thought it came from survey
... of all browsers
... but seems to be based on older version of opera (12?)
<r12a> http://www.w3.org/International/tests/repository/encoding/indexes/results-indexes.en.php
addison: did discuss with Anne, many errors are of the same type
richard: above link is from
martins tests which I adapted
... for example 1253
<r12a> windows 1253
<r12a> Firefox
<r12a> 0081 -> FFFD
<r12a> 0088 -> FFFD
<r12a> 008A -> FFFD
<r12a> 008C -> FFFD
<r12a> 008D -> FFFD
<r12a> 008E -> FFFD
<r12a> 008F -> FFFD
<r12a> 0090 -> FFFD
<r12a> 0098 -> FFFD
<r12a> 009A -> FFFD
<r12a> 009C -> FFFD
<r12a> 009D -> FFFD
<r12a> 009E -> FFFD
<r12a> 009F -> FFFD
<r12a> Chrome
<r12a> 00AA -> ª instead of FFFD
<r12a> IE
<r12a> 00AA -> ª instead of FFFD
<r12a> 00D2 -> F8FA instead of FFFD
<r12a> 00FF -> F8FB instead of FFFD
<r12a> windows 874
<r12a> Firefox
<r12a> 23 mismatches in rows 8 and 9
<r12a> Chrome
<r12a> 8 mismatches in rows D and F
<r12a> IE
<r12a> same as Chrome
<r12a> ibm866
<r12a> Firefox
<r12a> 001A -> 007F
addison: need to say what to do and get consensus on moving to it or allow variations
<r12a> 001C -> 001A
<r12a> 007F -> 001C
<r12a> Chrome
<r12a> replacement characters after 0080
<r12a> IE
<r12a> same as firefox
richard: bit of a shock
... calls into question label choices
addison: need to survey the browsers?
JcK: claims of some of the wilder changes are troubling
addison: 1252 thing seems well
established
... multibyte mappings require deeper insight into what is
actually happening
... any actions?
richard: plh?
... one option, not the best, would be to deeply fork
addison: hard to fork because it forms a system
richrad: looked for
references
... mainly sectoin 6
... utf-8
... a few things
... if just going to "normal" CR
... could then go back to LC if needed to if tests found
issues
plh: could work, but can't change things ref by html5
richard: mainly indexes and
mainly details
... check what css and html actrually need
addison: more references now than just the big 2
richard: css cares only about
determine encoding, I think
... define "indexes and such" as the "registry part"
addison: if only the registyr part is subject to correction, won't cause problems to advance on CR and then correct later
plh: not a REC, so would work to
fix if testing came back negative
... did we address enough of issues to move to CR
richard: probably yes
addison: may know we have some flaws (bugzilla bugs on mbcs)
plh: put notes in CR version to
call attention to that
... on specific encodings
richard: don't know if IE will change as well?
plh: best way to get attention is to get CR
richard: obsolete word
removal
... provided option, but anne didn't like
addison: 26514 looks like it could be defer
plh: would agree that it could defer
addison: violation statement
"is not relevant"
<r12a> "For the purposes of specifications using this specification, that registry is obsolete"
<r12a> User agents actually use a subset of the IANA Character Sets registry in a particular way. This specification documents this to establish interoperability on the Open Web Platform. Specifications and applications using this specification must restrict themselves to the encodings as documented in this specification.
<r12a> Anne's preference: For the purposes of specifications using this specification, that registry no longer relevant.
addison: could fork and replace or bin that paragraph
JcK: reuse of lables with
different meanings is more problematic
... hard to tell what an implementation is doing when it sees a
given label
... which standard it follows
richard: already a real problem
plh: not looking for convergence... looking for everyone to use UTF-8
<plh> "Authors must use the utf-8 encoding and must use the ASCII case-insensitive "utf-8" label to identify it. "
addison: mention actual goal (UTF-8) in preface?
<r12a> New protocols and formats, as well as existing formats deployed in new contexts, must use the utf-8 encoding exclusively. If these protocols and formats need to expose the encoding's name or label, they must expose it as "utf-8".
richard: close remaining
... press on with tests
... get anne to do edits
... and work on false statement
... move towards CR
JcK: refocus the preface on moving to UTF-8 and the rest of this is legacy compatibility
richard: "is no longer relevant"
<scribe> ACTION: richard: kick off additional discussion with anne about preface wording [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/21-i18n-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-333 - Kick off additional discussion with anne about preface wording [on Richard Ishida - due 2014-08-28].
JcK: will suggest new text in the next hour
richard: will look into CR
<r12a> oh, one thing i forgot to mention in the infoshare - we published an updated WD of Predefined Counter Styles today !