<trackbot> Date: 02 May 2013

<Jan> zakmi, code?

open item 1

announcement

<scribe> scribe: allanj

send Jeanne an email if attending

will discuss more at item 6

Timelines for the charter

http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2013/draft_uawg_charter20130314

js: what can we do to shorten timelines? World need UAAG done.

more face to faces, longer F2F, subgroups, parallel projects, etc. What resources are needed.

js: big problem with 2 years between LC and CR
... we have same amount of work, 1 week = 1.5 hours, 3 day f2F = 4+ months of work.

jr: +1
... there is time to write between meetings.

kp: 3 day f2f =3 months

js: schedule daily calls or longer calls (3+ hours, not 6 or 8)

<scribe> ACTION: jallan to redo charter timelines for review with group. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2013/05/02-ua-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-826 - Redo charter timelines for review with group. [on Jim Allan - due 2013-05-09].

Invited Guest Gary Driscoll, ETS, Application/Browser testing ((at the half-hour mark)

gd: introducing self. works for ETS, working on APIP, SIF, IMS, and a bunch of other stuff.

<Jan> http://www.imsglobal.org/apip/

gd: Accessible item protocol

introductions by group

gd: working on conformance for IMS and APIP, to transmit data between companies
... at test delivery, the item must conform to the specification.
... current conformance testing is an auditing process. walk through application and check off items.
... testing in general, develop functional criteria, outsourced to testing company. they automate the test.
... somebody has sit down and physically go through the application.

jr: look at application to communicate with an a11y API, inspector, etc for manual checks. are there any tools to automate?

gd: don't know of any.
... we would write a functional test case, then manually test the app

jr: ATAG is doing manual testing based on their suite.

ja: UAAG 10 test suite http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/TS/html401/

<jeanne2> JA: those tests can be used, they are manual but they are already written

wcag20 test suite http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/TS/html401/

<jeanne2> GD: They are a pot-pouri of tests, some of which could be scripted.

<jeanne2> JA: In WCAG, you can find 25-30% of errors with automated test.

html5 http://w3c-test.org/html/tests/approved/

<jeanne2> GD: Also every used version of those browsers

<jeanne2> ... we have a list of our supported browsers, and we have to test all of them.

CSS testing http://www.w3.org/Style/CSS/Test/

<jeanne2> JR: Do you have web based apps, or are you still working in standalone apps on Windows or Mac?

<jeanne2> GD: Mostly .net or java, but we have a lot of legacy applications in cobol and other legacy hardware/software.

<jeanne2> JA: You will have to test your individual APIP items? If you have people working, they could gain experience helping us test browsers.

<jeanne2> GD: they would be testing application, not the browser. If they ran into a problem with a browser, they would work around that problem, not test the browser themselves.

<jeanne2> JA: Do you have any API test tools?

<jeanne2> GD: I don't think so. We normally don't test APIs, but we might do it when a new technology is introduced where we would want to confirm that the API is working the way we expect.

<jeanne2> ... I haven't looked at the problem this way before, which doesn't mean that the tools don't exist.

<jeanne2> JA: We don't always have the right vocalbulary and expertise to explain what we need. Having you use the optimal terms to describe our needs, would be very helpful to us.

<jeanne2> GD: we all had to agree to use the same terms to communicate.

<jeanne2> JA: Can you talk to your outsouce people that would make this easier and not so manual?

<jeanne2> GD: we have people onsite that directs the testing area, and will talk with her and see if they have any tips and advice.

<jeanne2> ... maybe we could talk directly if that would be helpful.

<jeanne2> GD: As we are working through the APIP conformance, I'll talk to Mark about communicating useful tests back to the group. And vice versa.

js: there isn't a level were we can test the browser chrome. the browsers block it...a security feature.

ja: UA makers should have internal testing tools. should contact them about this issue

<Jan> Here is the most recemt ATAG2 test list: http://www.w3.org/WAI/AU/2013/ATAG2-10April2012PublicWD-Tests

Scheduling a subgroup to work on implementations for level A

js: Level A SC there are lots, the major browsers meet X of these. need to know what X is based on the spreadsheet
... want to get a group together to resolve the rest of the Level A that are still open

<jeanne2> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AiiGLIaAlHSKdHNrcGNacUp2MHdXQW9sUmpBQ21Lenc#gid=0

need to fill in column R.

jr: will try to take a look.

open item 5

https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20130430/results

greg had comments

<jeanne2> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2013AprJun/0039.html

<jeanne2> ACTION: jeanne to update the definition of levels with comments from GregL from http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2013AprJun/0039.html [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2013/05/02-ua-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-827 - Update the definition of levels with comments from GregL from http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2013AprJun/0039.html [on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2013-05-09].

open item 6

js: agree today, then meeting would be June 27.

host in austin, or Toronto

<jeanne2> July 1 is CA holiday

first or second week in July in Austin

<jeanne2> 2nd week in July is not good at OCAD

<jeanne2> Jan could come to Austin in 2nd week of July. Anytime except for late August.

discussion to continue. the testing sub group could meet separate from a formal f2f. Jim will create a doodle for the test writing group.

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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/montsh/months/
Succeeded: s/July 1 is US holiday/July 1 is CA holiday/
Found Scribe: allanj
Inferring ScribeNick: allanj
Default Present: Jeanne, Jim_Allan, Jan, Kim_Patch, Greg_Lowney, +1.609.734.aaaa
Present: Jeanne Jim_Allan Jan Kim_Patch Greg_Lowney +1.609.734.aaaa
Regrets: Kelly Eric
Found Date: 02 May 2013
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2013/05/02-ua-minutes.html
People with action items: jallan jeanne