SVG Working Group Teleconference -- 03 Sep 2010

<trackbot> Date: 03 September 2010

SVG Vector Effects

<ChrisL> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/modules/vectoreffects/master/SVGVectorEffects.html

<Cyril_Concolato> scribe: Cyril

<ChrisL> scribenick: Cyril_Concolato

ChrisL: some examples are not in the spec

when specifying a paint you can use all existing options plus currentFill and currentStroke

you can then stroke a path and the markers with the same stroke

I blew off some editorial comments

everything should be animatable

Doug: we should have a look at all of them

ChrisL: couple of cleanups that I did, the spec has not changed for 2 years
... the need for DOM came up to get an individual primitive or the whole geomrty
... but when the effect is used multiple times, we need to discuss how to do that

ED: the same problem exists with gradients

ChrisL: there was a concern that union/intersection are complex

anthony: there are expensive
... I don't know how fast it could be once animated

ChrisL: why do this in the language, why not in the authoring tool
... but if it's dynamic it has to be in the client

Doug: also for interchange between authoring tools

CC: our concern was also complexity but it can be explained in a note
... why currentFill and currentStroke are linked with vector effect

ChrisL: it could be added to the main spec

CC: we also think that vector effect can be used for grouping path semantically but we are concerned with the file size increase

ChrisL: if it's a modest increase in file size it should be acceptable

CC: is adding points to SVG a feature related to vector effects

ChrisL: no

<ChrisL> Its a good idea but no obvious intersection with vector effects

CC: yes but points may be shared between paths
... and if we want to express that sharing and if we use vector effects to share paths between objects, it might make sense to have points in vector effects

Tav: path along path
... is it insane ?

ChrisL: having a shape repeated along a path was shown in the mapping requirements

Tav: I can show an example of a object being stretched along a path

<tbah> Lizard along path http://tavmjong.free.fr/INKSCAPE/MANUAL/html/Paths-LivePathEffects-PatternAlongPath.html

<ChrisL> and not ties to the subpath positions, like markers are

CC: It could be a way to make variable stroke along a path

<ChrisL> yes that would be very interesting

Tav: in Inkscape you have a pattern and a path and you can edit them separately
... it would be nice to be able to edit when the positioning of the pattern is active

ChrisL: I want that we agree on any new feature so that I can move on with the spec

CC: we will provide feedback when we have implemented the use of vector effect for our application (superpath)

ED: I don't have the ressources at the moment to work on it

ChrisL: if anyone has an implementation it would help to move the spec along
... I'll try to get the spec ready for another draft
... the spec does not talk at all about API
... how can it be best done ?
... a method on each graphical element or on the filter ?

DS: having the list of places where an effect is used could be useful for online editors

ChrisL: that could fix the gradient problem

Anthony: didn't we put wording in the spec about that ?

ChrisL: I don't recall

ED: if you have a gradient that use bouding box unit, on the gradient we could have an API to evaluate the gradient on a specific context

<shepazu> that would allow us to evaluate an effect on an element before it's applied, which could be useful, if it's not too expensive

<anthony> http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG11/pservers.html#GradientsIntroduction

ChrisL: the vector effects don't change the stroke
... I wonder if it would be better to separate the stroke into two halfs
... inside and outside so that you can manipulate them separately

DS: that should be accessible with a short hand

<shepazu> it would be nice to have 'stroke-width-inner' and 'stroke-width-outer'

<shepazu> and shorthands should be added to the VE spec

<ed> topic: SVG 1.1 Last Call

<ChrisL> scribenick: tbah

SVG 1.1SE Last Call

<ed> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/products/24

<ChrisL> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/DoC/dump.html

<ed> CL: don't check the file in, gets picked up by tracker and linked to every issue

DS: what about the issue with SVG pointer-events on the svg root, esp. used in HTML

<ChrisL> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/DoC/getxml.html

<ed> that's ISSUE-2364, right?

<ed> ISSUE-2364?

<trackbot> ISSUE-2364 -- SVG 1.1 may be ambiguous about the root element acting as a proximal event target -- raised

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2364

ChrisL: Don't close issues for last call or they disappear (XSLT doesn't pick it up).

<ChrisL> s/dissapear/dissapear from the autogenerated disposition of comments/

<ChrisL> action-2800?

<trackbot> ACTION-2800 -- Chris Lilley to send in and track the media type registration for image/svg+xml -- due 2010-06-24 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/actions/2800

ChrisL: Received comment that there should have two different media types for svg and compressed svg.

ChrisL/Cyril: But this isn't necessary since it is handled by content headers.

ChrisL: Please look at registration to see how SVG content is handled by clipboards; does it work?

<ChrisL> Macintosh Universal Type Identifier code:

<ChrisL> org.w3c.svg conforms to public.image and to public.xml

<ChrisL> Windows Clipboard Name:

<ChrisL> "SVG Image"

<ChrisL> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.1F2/publish/mimereg.html

<ChrisL> don't know for kde or gnome, do they use internet media type?

<ChrisL> tracker, status

<ChrisL> trackbot, status

<ChrisL> ACTION: tavmjong to investigate Inkscape SVG on clipboard usage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2833 - Investigate Inkscape SVG on clipboard usage [on Tavmjong Bah - due 2010-09-10].

<shepazu> http://svg-whiz.com/svg/HideShow.svg

<shepazu> I copy-pasted that with FF

tav: Inkscape seems to copy as text the svg file... but will investigate further.

DS: It sounds like ChrisL has done due diligence on established precedents.

<ChrisL> Copy and pasting the text is needed, but is separate from copy pasting an image (for example to drop into a dtp program)

<ChrisL> I checked what MathML did and looked at some documentation for windows and macosx; did not find good docs for linux gnome, or kde

ED: Is there something to specify if the content is gzipped or not?

<ChrisL> action-2809?

<trackbot> ACTION-2809 -- Erik Dahlström to investigate ISSUE-2334 and report back -- due 2010-07-06 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/actions/2809

ED: Basically done, will write an email.

<ChrisL> action-2812?

<trackbot> ACTION-2812 -- Erik Dahlström to find the test case, commit it and make some proposed wording -- due 2010-07-13 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/actions/2812

<ChrisL> relates to ISSUE-2335 -- Clarify feConvolveMatrix bias property, specificasly the bias attribute

ED: Finding the test case probably not too hard, but will need to check that it does what people want.

<ChrisL> action-2813?

<trackbot> ACTION-2813 -- Chris Lilley to propose wording for ISSUE-2336 to say if it is malformed it doesn't have an effect -- due 2010-07-13 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/actions/2813

ChrisL: Change checked in, no comment back from commentor.

<ChrisL> ah, i now see he did agree http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2010Jul/0081.html

<ChrisL> action-2814?

<trackbot> ACTION-2814 -- Anthony Grasso to add wording to the specification to say that the behaviour is unspecified for those cases in ISSUE-2337 -- due 2010-07-13 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/actions/2814

Anthony: Still working on it.

<ChrisL> action-2817?

<trackbot> ACTION-2817 -- Chris Lilley to add the promised note relating to ISSUE-2340 -- due 2010-07-13 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/actions/2817

<ChrisL> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2010JulSep/0010.html

ChrisL: Made test case, got different results in different implemenations.

<ChrisL> erik: check animval in the dom to be sure its not cut off at the semicolon

<ChrisL> <animate keytimes="0s, 2.9s" attributeName="xlink:href" values="../images/linkingCircle-f.svg#svgView(viewBox(120,200,40,40));../images/linkingCircle-f.svg#svgView(viewBox(64,227,72,72))"

ED: Try quote marks.

<ChrisL> erik: try quote marks around each uri

DS: Is that allowed?

<ChrisL> <animate keytimes="0s, 2.9s" attributeName="xlink:href" values="'../images/linkingCircle-f.svg#svgView(viewBox(120,200,40,40))';'../images/linkingCircle-f.svg#svgView(viewBox(64,227,72,72))'"

<ChrisL> sowe would then say that inside quotes, ; is not treated as a smil values list separator

<ChrisL> erik: you could use url escaping too

<ChrisL> so %3B would be the escape here

Cyril: Would first split list by ; and then evaluate.

DS: Quoting would be nicer... maybe something for SVG2.

ChrisL: Will still work on this.

<ChrisL> ok so I will make a new test, with percent escaping and check in the dom for animval

<ChrisL> action-2818?

<trackbot> ACTION-2818 -- Chris Lilley to investigate ISSUE-2341 and look for previous comments -- due 2010-07-13 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/actions/2818

Cyril: Propose to copy 1.2Tiny text.

ChrisL: Will do that if no one objects.

<ChrisL> this text http://www.w3.org/TR/SVGTiny12/animate.html#complexDistances

<ChrisL> action-2821?

<trackbot> ACTION-2821 -- Chris Lilley to update the references section for issue-2344 -- due 2010-07-13 -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/actions/2821

<ChrisL> cyril: need to update 'list of' in types section too

ChrisL: Changed and approved.

<ChrisL> issue is closed, commentor agrees

ED: Need actions for rest of items.

<ed> ISSUE-2364?

<trackbot> ISSUE-2364 -- SVG 1.1 may be ambiguous about the root element acting as a proximal event target -- raised

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2364

<shepazu> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2010Aug/0011.html

<shepazu> http://www.schepers.cc/svg/blendups/overlay/test/content.xhtml

<shepazu> http://www.schepers.cc/svg/blendups/overlay/test/overlap.xhtml

<ChrisL> (updated disposition of comments at http://www.w3.org/2010/09/SVG1.1SE-LastCall/dump.html )

DS: If you have an SVG plugin in HTML, and you click on a non-existent backround, should the event be passed through?

Cyril: Answer: It can refuse to handle the event and pass it back to the system, so the containing application will handle it.

<shepazu> http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG/interact.html#PointerEvents

<anthony> Scribe: Anthony

<scribe> ScribeNick: anthony

DS: Now all browsers are consistent for referenced content
... they violate the SVG spec

ED: The point about the reference object
... The behaviour would be hard to change
... and violate some security protocols

CC: Looking at overlap.xhtml
... when you click on inline
... on the bottom
... you get two events

DS: Look at the code
... it's a single event
... but two boxes
... on question is does the event bubble
... bubbles for an inline case

ED: It's never bubbled between documents

CC: I think the inline case is correctly implemented

DS: No
... it's not in FireFox

AG: Want it to be consistent

DS: Click the background
... which is incorrect

ED: I'd assume that the click goes through transparent areas

CC: We need to agree on behaviours and see if it's correct in the spec

DS: Need to look at use cases and interpretations
... so, the argument was raised that treading SVG like a <div> since it has dimensions if you clicked inside that <div>
... it dispatches the event

CC: Even with transparent background?

DS: Yes
... so question is have to establish what the default is
... and how do you change it

ED: We had something like FireFox
... but we asked to change it

CC: Have to be consistent with SVG in HTML and SVG in SVG

DS: We need to look at the spec
... currently, Opera and Webkit behave one way with inline SVG
... the SVG root does not intercept events
... it passes them through

CC: Nothing happens in the SVG context
... regards to this event

DS: SVG spec is moderately clear on this

<shepazu> http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG/interact.html#UIEventProcessing

CC: IE9 is doing as Opera is doing

DS: I would prefer that inline and referenced SVG behaved the same way

ED: Changing that now
... would be bad for SVG in general
... people have come to expect certain behaviour

All: [16.5 Read through Processing order for user interface events]

DS: Clarify that this section is about hit testing and not propagation

ED: Would be better if there was a graph here

DS: Problem with the section is it confuses hit testing, event propagation and order of processing

ED: It's trying to describe a flowchart or something

DS: Doesn't talk about things like selecting graphics elements
... when SVG was written we didn't talk about default view or window

ED: How would you change this?

DS: Instead of processing order
... I would break it down to a section on hit testing

CC: Something has been hit? something not hit?

DS: Yes, if something hit. Go through and process actions
... If it has not been hit
... give a context menu

ED: Would be nice to have an SVG graph
... down the side
... that matches the text

AG: I agree, much easier to read and implement

ED: It's pretty clear what needs to be done

DS: So we are going to do this in SVG 1.1 Full 2nd edition

CC: We have this text in Tiny 1.2

DS: We pulled out the part on pseudo classes

CC: Has this other bit - 13.8 Event dispatching

ED: It's different
... but might need an errata on Tiny 1.2

<scribe> ACTION: Doug to Clarify section 16.5 Processing order for user interface events relating to problems in ISSUE-2364 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2834 - Clarify section 16.5 Processing order for user interface events relating to problems in ISSUE-2364 [on Doug Schepers - due 2010-09-10].

CC: What about key events?

DS: That's another matter
... that's why saying this is about hit testing is relevant

CC: That's a whole different discussion. But at some point someone should investigate this

DS: ED you're saying for security reasons, you're not going to allow events to pass through in an iFrame
... It's the same in object
... and if you change the one
... people would expect the other to change

ED: If you have an <img> element it's like a static image with no script and no events
... so it's the HTML you're getting events on

DS: Do you treat image and object the same?

ED: No
... I assume object, embed and iframe behave the same
... embed not so much
... object and iframe is mostly the same I think

CC: What about SVG <image>

ED: It's defined in the spec
... but should behave the way as <img>

DS: I understand why are you doing this
... but for content creation it's a pain
... say you have some SVG and you want to click through on the element and where there isn't SVG content you
... want to get to the HTML

ED: So you if you have transparency you get the HTML?
... Does the same thing happen for PNG?
... So we treat it the same

DS: I'm talking for object here

ED: Not sure we are talking about the same thing

DS: Look at my example
... We need to have a larger discussion about clicking through the transparent content would be a problem

AG: This would be a good thing to discuss at TPAC

CC: When the SVG is in the document it's behaviour is the same as a <div>

DS: I'm saying for the inline case
... Maybe this needs to happen during a telcon
... because we want all browsers to have the correct behaviour

ED: There might be use cases the other way
... not just having events go through

DS: I said you set pointerEvents to all
... as I suggested

ED: I just think this is something that goes beyond SVG content

CL: Could probably put that wording in the integration spec

DS: A quick test that mouse move on an empty SVG document intercepts i.e. the root dispatches the event
... All the modern browsers I tested
... this is contrary to ASV and seems to be contrary to the spec
... but is consistent with HTML

<scribe> ACTION: Doug to Add a table to the integration document about the embedded and inline SVG with regards to pointer events on the SVG root [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2835 - Add a table to the integration document about the embedded and inline SVG with regards to pointer events on the SVG root [on Doug Schepers - due 2010-09-10].

ISSUE-2363?

<trackbot> ISSUE-2363 -- Last Call Comment: Reconcile 'stroke' presentation attributes on <image> -- raised

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/issues/2363

ED: I think Cameron and me have responded to this on the list
... saying what we have now in the spec
... is a lot better than what was in previous 1.1 spec
... so in the previous 1.1 spec we had DTD to say what attributes where on each element
... so now have something that can be expanded and is more readable and made it more clear
... that presentation attributes can be specified anywhere
... even if they don't apply to the element it's specified on

CL: So specified and applied to are distinguished?

ED: Yes

CL: Therefore we should reject the comment
... because it's a no change required
... The issue was raised by Doug

<ed> http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG11/masking.html#ObjectAndGroupOpacityProperties

DS: Please show me where it's specified

ED: That's one example
... it clearly says applies to

<shepazu> http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG/struct.html#ImageElement

DS: However if you go to here
... And you click on the, presentation attributes, it lists it

CL: That's right
... exactly
... it doesn't apply to it

DS: I was talking to someone on IRC and they were trying to do this
... (stroke image element)
... and they go to the presentation attributes they can set on the element
... I think we should change the spec to things that have an effect on the element

CL: So it's currently done the other way
... for each property it says what it applies to
... this is an argument we've had since the entire life time on the SVG
... then others say somethings should be set only on an element only
... in some cases things would be disallowed because when children
... were placed in the element
... sometimes things apply

DS: Maybe it's the choice on how fine grain things are categorised

CL: This is going against a decision that was made 2 -3 years ago
... it's a huge change
... to be doing this

DS: Let's be clear
... we all agree it is confusing

CL: It could be confusing

ED: In some cases yes

DS: It has been proven to be confusing to some people
... including me

CL: Presentation attributes are in the form of properties

CC: As an implementer it reads well
... as an author
... it probably doesn't
... what matters at least someone can be confused

ED: What are you suggesting?

DS: Is it work the extra time to do this, to change it

CL: Change how?

DS: So, maybe in this case if we wanted to do the minimum work if it could some how be styled differently
... if it has an effect an element

ED: Yes, that would be nice
... make them bold
... if they applied to the element

CC: As long as it is editorial

CL: It will be editorial
... with all the presentation attributes it is a link which takes you to the definition

DS: How is this generated?

ED: It's generated from the XML, IDL

CL: Another thing we could do to make the spec better
... is to say the difference between applies to and specified on

CC: Adding the new sentence you said will help
... but changing the style and linking to that
... would at least give a hint that it's not that simple
... having it in bold would say would it apply
... it's precise and it's clear
... but it doesn't speak to most of the people

ED: My objection is don't we have that sentence somewhere?
... styling?
... I would not want to have two sentence that say two different things about the same topic

DS: There is a sentence here in styling
... two links away

ED: Specificity of 0 is in there 6.4

<shepazu> [[

<shepazu> For user agents that support CSS, the presentation attributes must be translated to corresponding CSS style rules according to rules described in Precedence of non-CSS presentational hints ([CSS2], section 6.4.4), with the additional clarification that the presentation attributes are conceptually inserted into a new author style sheet which is the first in the author style sheet collection. The presentation attributes thus will participate in the CSS2 cascade

<shepazu> ]]

CL: The section on presentation attributes could have it in there

DS: That would be two links away

<shepazu> http://www.w3.org/TR/SVG/intro.html#TermPresentationAttribute

DS: could have it here so that it's one link away
... Could say "Note not all presentation attributes specified on an element will apply to the element. For a list of elements that a property applies to see... blah"
... how hard would it be style them bold or normal?

ED: I think that would be a bit of work
... I don't think we have a list or things
... adding the sentences here would be less work

DS: In SVG 2. I would like us to re examine if we can have a stroke around the edge of an image?

CL: Wouldn't that be a border?

DS: Depends on if we allow padding around it and borders have different properties to borders

<scribe> ACTION: Chris to Include the above disclaimer about the applicability of presentation attributes on elements [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action04]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2836 - Include the above disclaimer about the applicability of presentation attributes on elements [on Chris Lilley - due 2010-09-10].

SVG 1.1 2nd Edition Candidate Recommendation

back from break

DS: First we need to agree on the set of tests that make up the SVG 1.1 2nd edition test suite

CL: Previously, the action of building the test suit generated all the files to do the testing

AG: I believe the reporting stuff is working

<scribe> ACTION: Anthony to Check if report generation for the test suite is working and report back [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action05]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2837 - Check if report generation for the test suite is working and report back [on Anthony Grasso - due 2010-09-10].

AG: So the way the test suite generation scripts work is you have a list of tests and every component in the test suite
... is generated according to that list

DS: For all the tests we don't have results on, each implementer can run the tests and report back to us

<scribe> ACTION: Doug to Run the tests on Safari on Mac [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action06]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2838 - Run the tests on Safari on Mac [on Doug Schepers - due 2010-09-10].

<scribe> ACTION: Chris to Run the tests on Firefox on Windows [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action07]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2839 - Run the tests on Firefox on Windows [on Chris Lilley - due 2010-09-10].

<scribe> ACTION: Erik to Run the tests on Opera [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action08]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2840 - Run the tests on Opera [on Erik Dahlström - due 2010-09-10].

<scribe> ACTION: Cyril to Run the tests on GPac [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action09]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2841 - Run the tests on GPac [on Cyril Concolato - due 2010-09-10].

<scribe> ACTION: Tav to Run the tests on Inkscape [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action10]

<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - Tav

<scribe> ACTION: Tavmjong to Run the tests on Inkscape [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/03-svg-minutes.html#action11]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2842 - Run the tests on Inkscape [on Tavmjong Bah - due 2010-09-10].

Topics: Connectors

CL: So that was news to me that you could make a complex path going through a few points

TB: We have a sophisticated routing than what's proposed. But because the path between objects can be enhanced
... we wouldn't be losing anything that's already in inkscape

DS: [Demo's current connectors implementation]
... Connector goes from centroid to centroid

AG: This could be difficult to calculate
... particularly if you're clipping parts of an object out

CL: Why not the center of the bounding box?

DS: Different possible syntax for point
... if you're looking at the bounding box of the parent
... it'd be useful to allow a percentage of the parent bounding box
... A port has a specific role of point
... it is a child of a shape
... point is a non rendering element
... you can style it with a marker

CL: Effectively it's a zero length line

DS: Each node being linked to has a port that will be preferential to where connection is made
... it will always go to the nearest between two ports

TB: Can you specify
... the port?

DS: Yes
... I've got a sample implementation and done some work on this
... I want to know if we agree to work on this

CL: Do we agree that this is the direction we should go in?

CC: How would you add it, if you were to add it?
... a separate module?

DS: Yes
... I'd intend for it to be part of SVG 2
... we've had a level of requests for this

TB: We've had requests for this as well

DS: This is a common case I've seen again and again

ED: Not convinced yet

DS: This is does not add, drag and drop, it does not add routing

ED: Does it add any dependencies that you need to resolve?

DS: There are very well defined dependencies
... when a shape is moved
... the connection changes

ED: We have to track a lot of dependencies already
... the less we need to do the faster it will be
... the graph of dependencies grows
... you can do this in script
... just not convinced

DS: Yes, you're right
... it's a common use case that is not easy to do in script
... it doesn't establish the semantics and behaviour
... I think it is a compelling feature that makes SVG very attractive for use

CC: You could do the opposite
... and say this is a line
... and this is connector
... and then put a marker on it
... This could also be done with Cameron's constraints

DS: This is a subsection of constraints. Gives people a lot of power to build things in SVG
... getting the connector for free gives people something accessible
... and graphics like this will not be accessible without this

CC: Couldn't you do this with a line
... and give it a role of connector?

DS: Yes, but it doesn't give the author any reason to do this

ED: Why does it have to be in SVG?
... why not stand alone?
... in a completely different spec
... used in other languages

DS: What other languages?

ED: Connect this div to another div

DS: But that is not a visual language
... SVG is a visual language
... this would pretty much the highest thing we would have at this level

CC: There are two parts the rendering constraints and the semantics
... I think we can have either the semantics or the constraints

CL: So I think that he is arguing
... that use <path> instead of <connector>
... point is fine

ED: We should close for the day
... and continue discussion later

- DRAFT -

SVG Working Group Teleconference

03 Sep 2010

Attendees

Contents

SVG Vector Effects

SVG 1.1SE Last Call

SVG 1.1 2nd Edition Candidate Recommendation

Summary of Action Items

Scribe.perl diagnostic output