See also: IRC log
<scribe> scribenick: masinter
<DanC> +1 approve http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2009/11/19-minutes
date: 3 December 2009
resolved: minutes of 19 November approved
<noah> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Dec/0004.html
<noah> Email from Larry: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Nov/0005.html
<noah> From Maceij: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Dec/0004.html
<noah> NM: I read Maceij's note as somewhat encouraging on the content
<noah> LM: I did send a message with the missing component
<noah> NM: Larry, do you want us in the TAG to do anything about this now.
will dial back in hit the wrong button on phone
anyway, brb
<noah> LM: Well, the proposal I made doesn't quite address Roy Fielding's concern that the term "URL" is used differently in HTML 5 than in the pertinent standards. Still we do at least move to a situation where the difference is explained.
I don't have anything I want the TAG to do
<noah> NM: OK
well, TAG members might want to follow the IRI evolution, but no action at this time
<noah> F2F agenda is at: http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2009/12/08-agenda
dc: review changes to agenda
... TLR is available, moved BOF report earlier
<DanC> I count 15 occurrences of "required reading"
discussion of reading list and material
discussion by DC of inviting Philippe and/or Ralph to observe and/or participate in TAG meeting
<Zakim> masinter, you wanted to ask whether there's any additional prep work besides reading that would be useful
dc: metadata as deployed, XMP, RDFa
discussion....
... Larry has an action to prepare a summary, not done
<noah> dc: any further thoughts on that?
<DanC> ACTION-337?
<trackbot> ACTION-337 -- Larry Masinter to frame the F2F agenda and preparation on metadata formats/representations -- due 2009-12-01 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/337
<noah> LM: Yeah, I'm late on preparing.
<DanC> ACTION-337 due 8 Dec
<trackbot> ACTION-337 frame the F2F agenda and preparation on metadata formats/representations due date now 8 Dec
<noah> LM: I'll have something concise for the meeting.
I'll send out some additional pointers but not "required reading"
close discussion of f2f agenda
<DanC> ACTION-323?
<trackbot> ACTION-323 -- Dan Connolly to as Thomas for a report form the security BOF -- due 2009-12-08 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/323
<DanC> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Dec/0025.html
<DanC> singer on UI issues
<DanC> ... http://www.w3.org/Security/wiki/Trusted_User_Interface
<DanC> reply from Zurko
<Zakim> masinter, you wanted to talk about IRI security issues and need for help
<noah> LM: Spoofing issues have come up as an issue that's exacerbated when you go to Unicode IRIs as opposed to ASCII URIs
<DanC> indeed "IDN Spoofing " is noted in http://www.w3.org/Security/wiki/Trusted_User_Interface ; I wonder if these "additional concerns" that LMM mentions are ack'd there.
<noah> LM: Many of the scripts that have different codes but look the same
<noah> LM: I'm hoping to avoid delays in moving IRI forward by getting some separate process for dealing with spoofing issues.
<noah> DC: Is the technical concern in the wiki similar to the concern you're discussing.
<noah> LM: Not sure, haven't looked at the wiki yet
<DanC> (sandro's WGs produce /TR/s from wiki pages by machine. i.e. the RIF WG and OWL WG)
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-iri/2009Nov/ see "Phishing in IRIs" mail
<DanC> tx
also see http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-iri/2009Nov/0013.html which points to IAB presentation http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/09nov/slides/plenaryt-1.pdf
The IAB concern here leads me to believe that the IRI document will need to at least point to how the issues are addressed
<DanC> see http://www.w3.org/Security/wiki/Main_Page
<DanC> http://www.w3.org/Security/wiki/Main_Page#Community_specifications
discussion of W3C & IETF concerns and membership of BOF etc.
discussion about how to insure progress on these issues
lm: I think this work is important and the TAG should be involved and we should ask tr for discussion about how we can be helpful.
<noah> +1 to what Larry is saying about security being a key driver/constraint on other architectural decisions.
<jar_> lm: security informs *all* architectural decisions. we should track, at least
dc: example: URIs should be opaque, but "same origin" means that lists.w3.org and w3.lists.org are very different.
jar: tracking is important, but at what point does tracking become getting involved.
discussion about extent of TAG involvement in security architecture issues
<DanC> I meant lists.w3.org vs w3.org/lists
jar: looking for criteria that would help us decide when to get involved
dc: different criteria for when we get involved: we're "attention" brokers; TAG attention causes others to pay attention
DC raises another item
<DanC> my msg today: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Dec/0031.html
dc: technical suggestion: look at WebIDL
DOM specs have had IDL languages in them, only losely related to IDL
dc: little details matter, though.
(discussion about document.all)
... probably 50 corner cases in the application of WebAPIs
... behavior reversed engineered through Opera, Mozilla, IE,
pointing to bugs with 50 page histories, etc.
<scribe> ... new mailing list created and discussion is active
dc: one concrete deliverable is "binary data API"
nm: data- attributes? putting binary data in the DOM? Interesting relationship to (missed)
dc: did binary data go over the wire, like in XMLHTTPRequest ?
<DanC> I think "missed" was XOM, though I'm not sure.
<DanC> MTOM
nm: the API you're going to see, make it possible to see binary data on either end, define text XML serialization, but allowed for other representations (e.g., in memory) could have a "on the wire" format (or in memory format) would allow delayed conversions or eliminate unnecessary ones.
dc: also message in web applications architecture -- making Ajax callable from Google?
<DanC> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Dec/0030.html
adjourn
resolved: adjourn
<DanC> action-215?
<trackbot> ACTION-215 -- Larry Masinter to send minutes of 3 Dec TAG teleconference to www-tag for review -- due 2009-12-07 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/215