See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 27 March 2014
<glenn> getting coffee, brb
<plh> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-ac-members/2014JanMar/0069.html
<plh> http://www.w3.org/2014/03/timed-text-charter.html
<scribe> scribeNick: nigel
plh: Process: after 45 days
people who didn't rejoin the group will be automatically kicked
out. The 45 days start today.
... members need to go back to their AC rep and tell them to
rejoin - should allow simple one click reappointment
nigel: Section 6 of the charter
has a revised Decision Policy
... motivation is to clarify the situation especially as we
will have two modes of working.
plh: this allows for better
asynchronous decision making and has been adopted in other
groups too.
... that's why it says 'for 10 days decisions are provisional'.
We expect the WebVTT part of the group to work more
asynchronously.
nigel: Thanks for doing the new charter!
plh: I made one small edit to the
milestones - the TTML2 CR milestone is pushed back by one month
to take into account the August 'dead month'
... and the WebVTT milestones were pushed by 3 months.
<plh> http://www.w3.org/2014/03/ttml-diff.html
plh: this is the link to a diff from the AC review version of the charter.
pal: the plan so far for IMSC had
been for IMSC to reference TTML2. We still have a long list of
issues to resolve so it looks like it won't be ready when we
intended it to be ready, which
... means that IMSC would be delayed, according to the current
plan. THere are some users of IMSC that are really interested
in it in its current form,
... and there are other users that are interested in it in a
more extended form that would be dependent on TTML2.
... So I've been exploring a plan to deliver IMSC 1.0 based on
TTML1 and follow up with IMSC 2.0 to go alongside TTML2.
... IMSC 1.0 could go today and there are implementations to
demonstrate it. As TTML2 makes progress we'll work on IMSC 2.0
and publish that when it's ready.
... I've not heard any fundamental obstacles. The first step in
the plan is to see if there's any reason not to go ahead with
it.
... Then start the process by publishing IMSC 1.0 as a FPWD and
get started on it.
nigel: notes that the charter milestones didn't push IMSC to match the end point of TTML2
plh: agrees that he didn't
... I'm no longer allowed to touch the charter!
nigel: Decision to deliver IMSC as two versions, v2.0 to roughly match TTML2 in milestones.
pal: I'm assuming that we won't
get surprises in comments but maybe we will. I can start
working on tweaking the current ED to match the new
direction
... and to get the ED ready for a FPWD.
nigel: it would be good to have a summary document describing the publication approach for IMSC either to put on the wiki or publish as a note.
Action pal to draft a summary document on the wiki and post a link to it on the reflector
<trackbot> Created ACTION-277 - Draft a summary document on the wiki and post a link to it on the reflector [on Pierre-Anthony Lemieux - due 2014-04-03].
https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/34314/TPAC2014Planning/
nigel: if members could respond to this then that would be helpful.
glenn: I think there should be a f2f and quite liked the Monday and Friday schedule, which was the least disruptive with respect to other groups.
nigel: the poll closes on 1st May and we can make the decision in May.
action-274?
<trackbot> action-274 -- Nigel Megitt to Discuss with david singer possibilities for f2f before going ahead and adding ttwg to tpac agenda. -- due 2014-03-27 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/274
action-274: discussions have begun, still ongoing.
<trackbot> Notes added to action-274 Discuss with david singer possibilities for f2f before going ahead and adding ttwg to tpac agenda..
action-276?
<trackbot> action-276 -- Nigel Megitt to Request tracker default change to 'email' -- due 2014-03-27 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/276
plh: I will find the request and ping them.
action-215?
<trackbot> action-215 -- Glenn Adams to Specify special semantics for tts:{extent, origin} on content elements to map to new inline region feature -- due 2014-04-01 -- PENDINGREVIEW
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/215
issue-176?
<trackbot> issue-176 -- Adding support for extent and origin attributes on block elements -- pending review
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/176
<glenn> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml2/spec/ttml2.html
glenn: this is technical and
substantive - you can view it at the currently published ED
link
... the main changes are in the terminology section 2.2 to
define 'implied inline region' - there's already an 'inline
region'
... and in the section 7.1.4 and 7.1.5 on div and p, wording on
extent and origin creating an inline region.
... there's a matching change in the styling definition of
tts:extent and tts:origin in 8.2.8 and 8.2.15 I added div and p
as elements that the style attribute applies to
... and added a paragraph on each of those sections.
... The follow ons are in section 9.3.2 which is empty at the
moment and I need to fill it in and discuss Implied Inline
Regions here.
... finally in Appendix D.1 I've added an editorial note to add
features for these.
... I applied this to both div and p though the original
proposal was for p only. Both are block level elements that can
generate regions so they should
... both have the opportunity to use implied inline
regions.
nigel: what's the order of precedence if both a region reference and an extent and origin are specified?
glenn: it's possible to have more
than one region already on a content element so this would map
the content to all the regions including the inline implied
region.
... I need to deal with those semantics in the tbs section
9.3.2. As a placeholder in the meantime I'll make an
action.
<glenn> action glenn to add EDNOTE to 9.3.2 with reminder to deal with case of having multiple inline regions possibly with additional reference to out-of-line region
<trackbot> Created ACTION-278 - Add ednote to 9.3.2 with reminder to deal with case of having multiple inline regions possibly with additional reference to out-of-line region [on Glenn Adams - due 2014-04-03].
glenn: I've added this to the change list document
<glenn> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml2/spec/ttml2-changes.html
nigel: you've also updated CP2 to a PENDING REVIEW state
glenn: and I added a Resolution section.
nigel: Jerry you own CP2 so please could you review?
https://www.w3.org/wiki/TTML/changeProposal002
issue-285?
<trackbot> issue-285 -- Align rendered rows within a region to each other, and the set to the region -- open
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/285
https://www.w3.org/wiki/TTML/changeProposal015#multiple_row_alignment_.28flex_box_in_CSS_mapping.29
nigel: I added use of the justify-content property and the mapping from multiRowAlign values
Issue-286?
<trackbot> Issue-286 -- Extend the background area behind rendered text to improve readability -- open
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/286
https://www.w3.org/wiki/TTML/changeProposal015#box-decoration-break
nigel: last week pierre asked: Are TTML 1 processors expected to ignore TTML 2 attributes that are in the same namespace at TTML 1? Is this the case in practice?
glenn: what the spec says and
what processors do and should do are separate questions.
... we'll probably need to put something in the conformance
section of TTML2 on this subject and we may need to add some
details to the abstract document type filtering mechanism
... that filters out foreign namespace. The normal behaviour
should be to ignore anything not understood as long as it can
still be parsed.
... A TTML1 doc with TTML2 features is not valid, strictly. But
a TTML2 doc would be fine - then how does a TTML1 processor
deal with that?
... We're not going to use a new namespace for TTML2 but extend
the existing one so we need something in the document itself
stating that it was
... authored with TTML2 features in mind. I believe there's a
proposal to add a version attribute e.g. ttp:version to do just
that. I haven't thought
... further than that.
... I will try to dig out the issue on this.
... this is Issue-276
http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/276
glenn: issue-203 is closed but also relevant. It added ttp:version to TTML2
issue-302?
<trackbot> issue-302 -- Should background of a span be height of text in line or computed lineHeight? -- raised
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/302
glenn: I did some testing on this
and verified that CSS behaviour results in backgrounds on spans
that do not extend to the height of the line box
... that seemed to be consistent across browsers. What I don't
recall is what I had implemented in the dfxp viewer because
this came up then.
... It's not very well defined in CSS, what the right answer
is. We do have the mapping to HTML/CSS issue. If we rely on CSS
to implement
... the formatting we're going to work out how to live with
this.
... notes that EBU-TT has already extended TTML to include
padding. This isn't particularly easy to use.
issue-303?
<trackbot> issue-303 -- Permit HTML-style <a> elements to contain href links -- raised
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/303
nigel: we don't have time to discuss this now!
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.138 of Date: 2013-04-25 13:59:11 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Found ScribeNick: nigel Inferring Scribes: nigel Present: glenn nigel pal plh jdsmith Frans_EBU Regrets: tmichel Found Date: 27 Mar 2014 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2014/03/27-tt-minutes.html People with action items:[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]