See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 02 November 2011
ted leung: goal to get people interested in games together. there is already a community group. today we will get games issues and get more CG participation.
ted: ian: get a scribe sand end
... who is developing games? [few replied possibly]
marku: looking at games for ETS for education
ted: we develop everything from single player to massively multiplier games
ted: just acquired game engine company & die for browser games
<marie> W3C games CG: http://www.w3.org/community/games/
ted: how many interested in games
due to mobile: [some yes]
... a lot of interest in different approaches to game animation on web
... unfortunate conflict with game dev conf & TPAC
... join the games CG
marie: workshop late september
collocated with OnGameStart (sp?) conf
... one outcome was games CG
... tomorrow AM HTML5 games summit happening in SF at Zynga HQ
<tedleung> The Warsaw workshop was 1/2 day
francois daoust: want to highlight a few issues from workshop
francois: e.g. need joystick API,
now in progress
... adding joystick support to DOM events and also adding mouse lock:
francois: want platform hardware
detect to enable or disable WebGL graphics acceleration.
... platform detect has fingerprinting security issue. TBD
... web workers (background threads) useful for games, but cannot perform pass-by-reference, which is problem for passing large amounts of data (e.g. 3D environment model)
... could be a new item for web apps group.
... games group needs to drive requirements into WGs
... another example: orientation lock (w/o locking out user control)
doug s: people should review the document
ted: game developers have long
list of issues to make good games
... another issue: several ways to perform animation: not a clear model yet; lots of experimentation; probably have requirements to performance & testing groups.
ted: are games developers largely focusing on canvas2d & webgl?
doug: no, zynga not using canvas
ted: our developers would love to
do WebGL, but target is iOS devices. OpenGL not available to
web apps on iOS. Also, not available on IE9.
... even canvas 2D not targeted because lots of non-HTML5 browsers in market.
francois: no one mentioned SVG
marcos: problem with SVG - no tools
ted: same with canvas (no tools)
marcos: if Flash could output to SVG, it would be great
doug: SVG WG cognizant of this: SVG new version will have better doc & performance enhancements that might get it used more.
ted: we're looking for people to get input for games
marcos: are some requirements on
the web. hoping for more participation. already know the
issues. same as issues with Flash in the 80s-90s (tools, ease
of development, performance)
... audio APIs are a big problem. too much latency. chrome improving audio APIs
doug: also safari nightlies
marcos: personally think canvas
is a bad API. Using DIVs for games is weird.
... All the crucial bits there, but not designed around games development production cycle
... canvas issues: very low level, buffer manipulation, byte arrays from JS
<marie> don brutzman
don: web3D consortium. Declarative 3D group is collecting use cases and interested in game use cases
ted: join the games CG
<Kris> Declarative 3D CG: http://www.w3.org/community/declarative3d/
doug: best outcome of CG is driving requirements into standards groups.
mav: advice on influencing WGs: 1) Only work on gaps (2) File bugs
doug: yes and (3) write demos (4) write tests
sangwhan: It would be good to get feedback on browser bottlenecks. Recently wrote a game and uncovered lots of issues, even with browser src code access
ted: does w3c have perf tests for browsers
doug: not now: may come from web perf group or test group
marcos: web perf group looking at high rez timers
ted: is apple participating
marcos: not currently
... need to attract more participants
marku: what about accessible game guidelines?
ted: would be great for CG. Difficult for canvas.
marcos: relying on DOM events which are accessible.
<mhakkinen> accessible games guidelines http://gameaccess.medialt.no/guide.php
marcos: seen that mouse and keyboard games fail on iPad: brings up accessibility issues for all, not just those with disabilities
ted: goal of using web on iPad instead of iOS is: TTM & multiple targets (e.g. Android & Connected TVs)
Taisuke: Showing demo: am a
vendor of sw for feature phones.
... new W3C logo
... web is best game platform
Showing demo of educational platform using interpreted language and simple graphical display for kids to learn program.
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.136 of Date: 2011/05/12 12:01:43 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/Teleconference/Breakout Session/ FAILED: s/Marku/mhakkinen/ Succeeded: s/ansuke/aisuke/g No ScribeNick specified. Guessing ScribeNick: mav Inferring Scribes: mav WARNING: No "Topic:" lines found. WARNING: No "Present: ... " found! Possibly Present: Cathy JonathanJ JonathanJ1 Kangchan Kris Rossen Soonho Taisuke Vincent YUMA chsiao csmithpeters cyril don doug evanli francois fukuno games gang greg howard howard_ joined jun jun_ kojiishi manyoung marcos marie marku matthewy mav mhakkinen sangwhan shan shepazu si-wei stearns taohong ted tedleung trackbot vivien wcarr yu1 You can indicate people for the Present list like this: <dbooth> Present: dbooth jonathan mary <dbooth> Present+ amy WARNING: No meeting chair found! You should specify the meeting chair like this: <dbooth> Chair: dbooth Found Date: 02 Nov 2011 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2011/11/02-games-minutes.html People with action items: WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option. WARNING: No "Topic: ..." lines found! Resulting HTML may have an empty (invalid) <ol>...</ol>. Explanation: "Topic: ..." lines are used to indicate the start of new discussion topics or agenda items, such as: <dbooth> Topic: Review of Amy's report[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]