May 20th Teleconference Minutes

http://www.w3.org/2015/05/20-webfonts-minutes.html

   [1]W3C

      [1] http://www.w3.org/

                               - DRAFT -

                 WebFonts Working Group Teleconference

20 May 2015

   See also: [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2015/05/20-webfonts-irc

Attendees

   Present
          +1.408.927.aaaa, +1.650.214.aabb, [Microsoft], Vlad,
          jfkthame, +1.650.352.aacc, Ken_Lunde__Adobe_,
          kuettel+RSHeeter, Behdad, +1.650.253.aadd,
          +1.650.253.aaee

   Regrets
          John_Hudson, Chris_Lilley

   Chair
          SV_MEETING_CHAIR

   Scribe
          RSheeter

Contents

     * [3]Topics
         1. [4]action items
         2. [5]hmtx preprocessing
         3. [6]Action Items
         4. [7]CTS
     * [8]Summary of Action Items
     __________________________________________________________

   <trackbot> Date: 20 May 2015

   Khaled, did you get an invite to a hangout on your gmail?

action items

   <Vlad> [9]https://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/actions/open

      [9] https://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/actions/open

   <Vlad> New topic: CFF support in WOFF2

   <scribe> scribenick: RSheeter

   (discussion of ability to optimize cff)

   Vlad: if de-subroutinization allows better compression with
   brotli, would we have to re-sub on receiving end Jungshik: no,
   but memory use might be greater. Perhaps faster to use as well.
   ... summary, some parts can be just dumped during encoding to
   save bytes. Less constraints here (server/fast wkstn).
   ... impact on decoder is of greater concern. Eg the memory use
   cost in return for smaller compressed file.

   Ken: concur we should not re-subroutinize when decoding
   ... could be ~10% increase in filesize without re-sub. Also
   re-sub is *very* slow [potentially hours]. And lots of memory
   used.

   (looking for link to doc about gains from de-sub)

   <Vlad>
   [10]https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1jvJ3xUOg6rySiAtiXDv
   Af7Du43XytEBFJCr5YO12F7c/edit#gid=0

     [10] https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1jvJ3xUOg6rySiAtiXDvAf7Du43XytEBFJCr5YO12F7c/edit#gid=0

   Vlad: So 5-10% filesize reduction in output woff2 if we desub.
   Is it worth adding as a mandatory step? (at cost of larger
   decompressed file)

   Behdad: why Mandatory?

   jfkthame: we shouldn't make this mandatory

   <Ken_Lunde__Adobe_> I agree that desubroutinized CFFs should
   not be mandatory.

   Vlad: agree; doesn't have to be normative. Maybe add a note to
   spec that describes tradeoffs of doing this but don't
   recommend; just informative.

   Behdad: just note it in the spec

   action to vlad Add description of tradeoffs in cff
   preprocessing (desub, etc)

   <trackbot> Error finding 'to'. You can review and register
   nicknames at <[11]http://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/users>.

     [11] http://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/users

   action vlad Add description of tradeoffs in cff preprocessing
   (desub, etc)

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-175 - Add description of tradeoffs in
   cff preprocessing (desub, etc) [on Vladimir Levantovsky - due
   2015-05-27].

   Welcome mystery guest!

   <cosimolupo> sorry the sip phone is not working.. didn't mean
   to disturb, please go on.

hmtx preprocessing

   Behdad: if lsb is same as glyf we can drop it and save bytes.
   Easy to rebuild hmtx back from glyf. Low complexity.

   Vlad: won't somebody think of the swashes?!

   jfkthame: negative lsb would just be reflected in x-min of bbox

   Behdad: lsb allows you to move glyf without moving points.
   Usually lsb == x-min. If the same for all glyfs we can just
   drop it. Estimated 90%+ use same value.
   ... That is, of 10 fonts 9 will have *all* lsb == x-min.

   Vlad: seems easy; just need to know how to tell decoder it was
   dropped.

   (clarification that there is no per-table transform marker but
   we do have reserved bits that could be used for flags)

   Behdad: maybe we should test run htmx mangling over a test
   corpus

   Vlad: Can we test with Google Fonts? [yes]

   action rsheeter Test hmtx transformation over Google Fonts
   corpus (how many lsb == x-min for all glyfs, what savings)

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-176 - Test hmtx transformation over
   google fonts corpus (how many lsb == x-min for all glyfs, what
   savings) [on Roderick Sheeter - due 2015-05-27].

Action Items

   <Vlad> [12]https://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/actions/open

     [12] https://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/actions/open

   Vlad: Did you read my diff?

   close action-173

   <trackbot> Closed action-173.

   action-116

   <trackbot> action-116 -- David Kuettel to Decoder performance
   analysis on mobile devices -- due 2015-04-22 -- OPEN

   <trackbot> [13]http://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/actions/116

     [13] http://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/actions/116

   Vlad: summarize your findings

   Kuettel: Chrome instrumented. Got data. Compression team hard
   at work improving numbers. Caveat: environment not entirely
   controlled (wild users). WOFF1 could be optimistic in some
   cases.

   [we may have lost audio]

   unfortunately we have now disconnected Khaled :(

   Vlad: can we measure how smaller file vs slower decode might
   play out (eg are we ahead)?

   Kuettel: will ping Kenji

   (exploration of further testing, ways to get overall latency
   impact)

   action-148

   <trackbot> action-148 -- Vladimir Levantovsky to Review and
   edit the conformance test for extraneous data -- due 2015-05-06
   -- OPEN

   <trackbot> [14]http://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/actions/148

     [14] http://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/actions/148

   action-168

   <trackbot> action-168 -- Roderick Sheeter to Measure RAM usage
   for woff2 vs. woff1 -- due 2015-05-13 -- OPEN

   <trackbot> [15]http://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/actions/168

     [15] http://www.w3.org/Fonts/WG/track/actions/168

   Vlad: Everyone please review all normative statements to ensure
   they are testable

   Victory declared over action items

CTS

   [more or less out of time]

   Vlad: Ken want to come to Boston?

   Ken: bit difficult

   [next f2f after Boston will be ATypI. Come one, come all]

   Ken: Maybe David Lemon could come to atypi f2f

Summary of Action Items

   [End of minutes]
     __________________________________________________________


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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Found ScribeNick: RSheeter
Inferring Scribes: RSheeter
Default Present: +1.408.927.aaaa, +1.650.214.aabb, [Microsoft], Vlad, jf
kthame, +1.650.352.aacc, Ken_Lunde__Adobe_, kuettel+RSHeeter, Behdad, +1
.650.253.aadd, +1.650.253.aaee
Present: +1.408.927.aaaa +1.650.214.aabb [Microsoft] Vlad jfkthame +1.65
0.352.aacc Ken_Lunde__Adobe_ kuettel+RSHeeter Behdad +1.650.253.aadd +1.
650.253.aaee
Regrets: John_Hudson Chris_Lilley

WARNING: No meeting chair found!
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Found Date: 20 May 2015
Guessing minutes URL: [19]http://www.w3.org/2015/05/20-webfonts-minutes.
html
People with action items:

     [19] http://www.w3.org/2015/05/20-webfonts-minutes.html

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Received on Wednesday, 20 May 2015 21:06:21 UTC