W3C

– DRAFT –
WAI Curricula Task Force Teleconference

05 January 2021

Attendees

Present
Carlos, Howard, shadi, sloandr
Regrets
Sarah
Chair
Daniel
Scribe
Carlos

Meeting minutes

Selecting Scribe

<dmontalvo> https://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/wiki/WAI_Curricula/WAI_Curricula_Task_Force_Meetings

Rewording for "Recite related requirements"

dmontalvo: we've been cross posting several roles and responsibilities
… recite doesn't seem to communicate well
… according to multiple feedback
… what could be a good alternative?

sloandr: 'describe' is probably better
… 'recite' doesn't imply understanding

+1

shadi: is 'describe' a bit vague?

sloandr: developers need to understand if a requirement has been met
… 'describe' requires understanding

shadi: I really liked 'related'

Howard: 'relate' requires context. something is related to another
… something that shows the concept is understood works well for me

dmontalvo: 'describe' seems to be consensual

Rewording for "Topics to support the teaching sequence" was "Topics to achieve the learning outcomes"

dmontalvo: there was a comment that "topics" do not achieve anything by themselves
… I've changed it to "topics to support the teaching sequence" but that didn't work either

<sloandr> I had wondered about the phrase "develop the learning outcomes" as used in this resource from the University of Toronto: https://teaching.utoronto.ca/teaching-support/course-design/developing-learning-outcomes/what-are-learning-outcomes/

<sloandr> But then "develop" is ambiguous given the subject of this curriculum

<dmontalvo> https://deploy-preview-273--wai-curricula.netlify.app/curricula/developer-modules/page-structure/

sloandr: the Univ. of Toronto uses "topics do develop the learning outcomes"
… this implies a collaboration between teacher and learner

Howard: I think all of them could work

shadi: I'm in sync with Howard. I dislike the "teaching sequence"
… might there be an opportunity for active language
… "topics to help you develop your learning outcomes"

dmontalvo: we could move to "topics to develop the learning outcomes" without a following explanatory sentence

sloandr: will we have to change previously published curriculum?

dmontalvo: there are already several things that will need to be retrofitted
… this will be just another one

sloandr: we used "topics to teach"

dmontalvo: followed by an explanatory sentence

sloandr: I don't feel strongly enough about the need to change

dmontalvo: I'll think about the change
… we can roll back to what we had before
… which is equal to what we have in the foundations module

Howard: I have a little problem with developing
… we're not really learning developing the learning outcomes

dmontalvo: I'll think more about this

"Code" versus 'implement/apply coding techniques"

dmontalvo: several people suggested changing "code" to apply or implement coding techniques
… I'm wondering what is the added value of this change

sloandr: in a curriculum for web developers "code" has a very specific meaning
… while in other contexts it can be ambiguous
… in those contexts I would use "implement mechanisms to" instead of "code"
… but for this module it might not be needed

shadi: I like "applying coding techniques"

Howard: I see a problem with "code mechanisms"... it can be a noun

<shadi> [[code labels to identify menus provided on a page

<shadi> code menu structures as lists, sub-lists, and list items so that they have semantic meaning

<shadi> code menu styles so that menus appear and behave as required, for example on hover and focus

<shadi> code menus so that they resize depending on different viewport sizes

<shadi> code fly-out menus in a way that their state is communicated to people using different assistive technologies and adaptive strategies]]

Carlos: "applying coding techniques" seems to me to be programming oriented

shadi: it is... but programming accessibility

shadi: how would these examples be rewritten?

sloandr: the difficulty here is the use of "code" as a verb
… we could use "write code"

<shadi> +1 to "write code"

dmontalvo: the first example would become "write code for labels ..."

+1 to "write code"

Howard: I don't have a problem with "code"
… and I think varying language is fine

dmontalvo: we need to go back sentence by sentence and check what works

"demonstrate and explain" for all the introductory bullets?

<shadi> [[

<shadi> demonstrate how people with disabilities rely on headings, sections, and other structures to orient themselves and navigate within web pages

<shadi> demonstrate how people with disabilities rely on semantics in web page coding to identify page components and understand their meaning

<shadi> explain coding techniques to convey the structure and semantics in accessible content]]

dmontalvo: in the introduction of all modules, we have bullets that start with "demonstrate how" or "explain"
… some comments were made that we should be using "demonstrate and explain" in all bullets
… demonstrate can be perceived as only the practical aspects
… and explain just the theoretical aspects
… using both would clarify what the courses should do, or would it become too wordy?

sloandr: I like demonstrate to motivate the need, and explain to show how developers could achieve their goals
… having the distinct wording works very well

Howard: I don't think it needs changing

Carlos: I don't think it needs changing

shadi: I also like the way it is currently done

<shadi> https://deploy-preview-273--wai-curricula.netlify.app/curricula/#tips-on-teaching-accessibility

shadi: we're still working on the front page section
… the tips for teaching section
… where we present the need for both demonstrating and explaining

Next Steps

dmontalvo: I'll keep working in the coming days and I'll keep you posted
… we might have another intermediate survey to discuss significant changes, such as those that may result from the way we deal with the "code" issues. That is not certain yet
… it will be discussed with the chairs

Minutes manually created (not a transcript), formatted by scribe.perl version 127 (Wed Dec 30 17:39:58 2020 UTC).

Diagnostics

Succeeded: s/crossposting several resources/been cross posting several roles and responsibilities/

Succeeded: s/what could be a good alternative/what could be a good alternative?/

Succeeded: s/we might have another survey but that is not certain yet/we might have another intermediate survey to discuss significant changes, such as those that may result from the way we deal with the "code" issues. That is not certain yet/

Succeeded: s/dontalvo/dmontalvo/

Maybe present: dmontalvo