See also: IRC log
<allanj> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-low-vision-a11y-tf/2017Jul/0093.html
<allanj> brb
<laura> Scribe List: https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/Scribe_List
<allanj> scribe: Jim
<allanj> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-low-vision-a11y-tf/2017Jul/0093.html
<allanj> sr: seems to meet all use cases
<allanj> lc: it covers more than the origanal
<shawn> scribe: shawn
ja: can live with either one
sr: agree
<laura> +1
lc: agree
<erich> +1
<allanj> *Popup Interference:* Except where popup presentation is controlled by the
<allanj> user agent, all of the following are true when popup content is visible:
<allanj> · *Trigger*: Popup content does not obscure any part of its
<allanj> triggering content.
<allanj> · *Hover:* If a popup is triggered via pointer hover, then the
<allanj> pointer may be moved onto the popup content without loss of visibility.
<allanj> · *Focus:* Popup content remains visible while any of its components,
<allanj> including the trigger, have focus.
<allanj> Where we define popup as " becomes visible only on pointer hover or focus”.
<allanj> +1
<JohnRochford> +1
<laura> +1
<erich> +1
<steverep> +1
RESOLUTION: Accept Popup Interference above
ja: ready to go to AG
lc: maybe issue with @@
sr: put in what was trying to cover the original use cases
ja: comment out the other stuff.
I'll update the other wiki info
... html will work to comment out
sr will try to take care of GitHub
ja: will get to AG for this coming survey & telecon
Friday survey
<allanj> close item 1
<allanj> close item 1
<allanj> Resized:
<allanj> Content can be resized up to 200% without loss of content or functionality;
<allanj> Changes Reflected:
<allanj> User changes to letter spacing, line spacing, font family, and color are reflected in the printed content.
ja: pushback on 200% because not
all browsers do it, printing sale different from zoom
content
... testing with font size 2em in CSS and worked well
... change to: if user changes font size to up to 2em, it will
print OK
... author has control if works with author's print style
sheet
... (also true on display)
slh: want to include all the other things in adapting text, e.g., line height
ja: already there
slh: ah right
... use similar wording from adapting text?
sr: what damages printing?
slh: example of print CSS set text box size
<allanj> ja: not being able to add to 100, truncated text
slh: increased text size not fit
ja: author css not adding to 100
and get truncated text
... padding, margins, etc adds up to 112
... printing cuts off content
... fixed box positions - some fixed and some not
... end up with overlapping text not readable
... up to 2ems - not scale/zoom
... example only printed some of the content
... want to print recipes, etc. for offline
... examples here:
<allanj> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/low-vision-a11y-tf/wiki/Printing_Customized_Text#Examples
ja: one example truncated 'cause body width was 640px
lc: link examples in GitHub issue
ja: many things that author can do to break -- or make work -- the printing
<erich> need to drop, folks, but feel free to delegate relevant actions for this SC to me, as I believe I'm still listed SC mgr... Have a good week!
<allanj> User changes to font-size, letter spacing, line spacing, font family, and color are reflected don't result in loss of content when printed
<allanj> User changes to font-size up to 2em, letter spacing, line spacing, font family, and color are reflected don't result in loss of content when printed
slh: up to 2em
... overlapping covered by lose of content?
ja: yeah
<allanj> User changes to font-size up to 2em, letter spacing, line spacing, font family, and color are reflected in the printed version and don't result in loss of content.
<JohnRochford> How about "User changes to font-size (up to 2em), letter spacing, line spacing, font family, and color are reflected in the printed version, and don't result in loss of content."
<allanj> slh: if the user can't change it then its irrelevant
slh: if users can't change it, then it's irrelevant
jr: talking about user CSS?
ja: yes
slh: looks good to me
lc: push back on "user changes"
@@: drop the word user?
<JohnRochford> How about, "Changes to font-size (up to 2em), letter spacing, line spacing, font family, and color are reflected in the printed version, and don't result in loss of content."
slh: defers to y'all who have been working more closely with AG!
lc: better, then they'll ask about amount
slh: use #s from adapting text?
lc: can for spacing, not have family or color
ja: can do all in user CSS, some in browser
<allanj> sr: concerns about mobile printing, ability to change font characteristics, etc. can't change font stuff in mobile yet
lc: leave as is and see what they say?
slh: might as well add #s for spacing
<allanj> User changes to font-size up to 2em, letter spacing up to .12 font-size, line spacing up to 1.5 font size, font family, and color are reflected in the printed version and don't result in loss of content.
<allanj> User changes to font-size (up to 2em), letter spacing (up to .12 font-size), line spacing (up to 1.5 font size), font family, and color are reflected in the printed version and don't result in loss of content.
<allanj> Changes to font-size (up to 2em), letter spacing (up to .12 font-size), line spacing (up to 1.5 font size), font family, and color are reflected in the printed version and don't result in loss of content.
lc: concerned it will open up adapting text SC
<JohnRochford> Changes to font-size (up to 2em), letter spacing (up to .12 font-size), line spacing (up to 1.5 font size), font family, and color are reflected in the printed version and do not result in loss of content.
<JohnRochford> I have to go. The last version I published gets rid of the contraction.
sr: don't want to leave anything out, yet share laura's concern
<JohnRochford> ciao
ar: adding more than adapting text and adding it has to print
sr: if pass adaptingtext, what can author do to block it?
slh: screw up print CSS
sr: css and javascript print events
<allanj> laura's concern - reopening adapting text
slh: asked earlier if can just add to adapting text -- but that opens up same issue
ja: to new draft, add comments about adapting text and printing
<allanj> slh: fine with not opening adapting text. put printing as a separate SC. then combine after august deadline
slh: maybe try for separate SCs for now. and then maybe they'll get combined later
lc: yes
ja: yes
sr: yes
<allanj> sr: acknowledge up front that this is the strategy
<allanj> slh: leave out font family and color.
slh: font family got taken out 'cause too hard to test and covered by spacing. so take out of here, too?
sr: one way to state it. another
reason - adapting text about user making changes, and how users
can mess that up. notihgn stopping user from making front
family change, only that would break the content change is the
sizing, and that is sufficiently covered by spacing.
... with this one... example: make bunch of style changes,
author writes on-print event that redoes the styles, then will
override
slh: then author messed it up
sr: should be used when authors change layout for better print view
ja: for not when print CSS
sr: print CSS better way, but some use javascript
slh: fine to do things like not print ads, byt still need to not have lose of content from user changes
<allanj> perhaps add printing to the exiting Editor's note in Adapting text -- The Working Group seeks to include overriding text color, background color, font-family, and priniting as part of this SC, but is not yet able to identify a way to do so that is sufficiently testable.
slh: prefer to get clear SC
accedpted now - then later munge if want
... if can get an SC accepted now, it's stronger than Editors
note
ja: keep it simple for now
<allanj> ja: keep it simple. just print without loss of content
<laura> +1
<allanj> ... leave out all other modifications (font-size, family, spacing, color,)
slh: hummmm
ja: gets foot in door
slh: i guess OK in big picture of
all the tangential issues :)
... as steve says, communicate that approach is to get the
basics requiremetn in now w/o opeing worms, and after August
look at it in big picture and *may* be combined (w.g., with
adapting text)
ja: without loss of content means they can't have print that srips out ads, nav, etc. we don't want that!
slh: .... loss of intended included content :(
lc: essential content
<allanj> Users can print essential content without loss of content
<allanj> slh: totally fine for authors to choose what is and is not printed. what they intend to print is not messed up
<allanj> lc: content can be printed without loss of essential information
<laura> If content can printed, it has no loss of essential information.
<allanj> +1
Content that is printed hs not loss of information
<allanj> slh: content that is printed has no loss of essential information
Content that is printed has no loss of information
slh: ?
<allanj> slh: essential information can be printed with no loss of content
slh: don't want out clause that cant print essential info at all
<allanj> define "no loss of content" in description - truncated or overlapping text
<allanj> lc: +1
+1
<allanj> sr: +1
RESOLUTION: send to AG: "essential information can be printed with no loss of content"
ja: will edit GitHUb
<allanj> jim to edit github and update description
and let erich know next steps
slh: thanks, all!
<allanj> slh: we have open issues on requirements.... lower priority than SCs. slh can't get to until after TPAC anyway
<allanj> ja: we also have tasks for updated understanding docs.
<allanj> AG wants understanding docs ready for Last Call
<allanj> lc: working on testing adapting text
<laura> Starting to work on Adapting Text Testing: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1LRsAtLReBL6LnbvJQ4biQ1ER1fKbh8MDWnHqbsW7B1o
<allanj> lc: looking for pdf docs to test
<allanj> pdf testing is 2nd tab on spreadsheet.
<laura> bye
<allanj> trackbot, end meeting
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