See also: IRC log
<dezell> scribenick: manu
<lcastillo> Laurent Castillo
Ryladog: Been involved with a11y
in financial services industry for some time.
... Working in US Federal Govt. as contractor starting around
15 years ago. Worked for program office at dept. of treasury
agencies, IRS, FMS, etc.
... I've left govt., working in industry, working at JP Morgan
Chase in Q/A for financial services / accessibility. Been
involved in W3C standards for 14 years. Been involved in WCAG
and XML A11y Guidelines, Indie UI, PING (privacy Interest
group), now joining you guys.
dezell: One of the things this
group cares deeply about is UI / a11y concerns.
... This part of it is really important - one of the value-adds
for W3C specifically is a11y.
Ryladog: I think a lot of the things that we will be working on, anonymizying indidivudal, separating them from their data when doing a transaction, is probably the best thing we can do for privacy, security, and a11y.
<jheuer> Very welcome with these ambitions, Katie.
dezell: Review of agenda - we
have two task forces, we hope to hear from them.
... we also need to talk about roadmap today.
... We'd like these documents ready for FPWD close to the end
of January.
... Any other topics for today?
https://www.w3.org/2014/11/25-wpay-minutes.html
dezell: Anyone opposed to approving minutes from last week? (No opposition)
RESOLUTION: Web Payments IG Minutes from 25 November 2014 are approved for public publication.
http://www.w3.org/Payments/IG/track/actions/open
dezell: make sure to show "All actions"
trackbot, ACTION-17
<trackbot> ACTION-17 -- Stéphane Boyera to Run doodle poll to find different day for the web payments ig call. -- due 2014-11-21 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Payments/IG/track/actions/17
dezell: Stephane has done this,
we're still trying to make a decision?
... We'll keep ACTION-17 open.
trackbot, ACTION-20
<trackbot> ACTION-20 -- David Ezell to Set up doodle poll on times for telcons. -- due 2014-12-02 -- PENDINGREVIEW
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Payments/IG/track/actions/20
dezell: I did this
... We've had offline discussion about scheduling telecon -
we've asked people to tell us when they can come, it's a
self-selecting list. We're missing people from Pacific Coast
and Asia. We need them to tell us what times work for
them.
... I'll send an updated Doodle poll, it's going to have an
hour slot - every day of the week, every hour of the week. Then
you can tell us day /and/ time.
... Please be patient, we'll get this sorted soon.
trackbot, ACTION-22
<trackbot> ACTION-22 -- Manu Sporny to Figure out how this group can officially use github. -- due 2014-12-02 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/Payments/IG/track/actions/22
dezell: Manu, update?
manu: Yes, we've got almost all of this figured out. We need to figure out how to sync github to W3C servers, talking with systeam now about it.
<dezell> scribenick: dezell
manu: reporting on use case task
force.
... one meeting so far. We want to use GitHub for output
documents.
... trying to pull in the CG use cases, ISO20022 and ISO12812
as well as other sources.
<manu> https://www.w3.org/Payments/IG/wiki/Use_Cases_Task_Force
manu: CG transfer of ownership is held up by W3C bug in the commit process.
<manu> dezell: Just a couple of things - looks like you've got the IP stuff well in hand.
<manu> scribenick: manu
manu: yes, no known copyright concerns.
dezell: This is going to be one
of the main contributing activities to the roadmap
document.
... It's important if people are concerned about
speed/direction - use cases is one place where you can help us
speed things up. The meeting is Thursday at 9:30am ET.
erik: Is there a place where I
can upload ISO documents at W3C?
... We want to make sure that's member-only. Is there a way to
do that?
dezell: I asked Stephane about
this, yes there is a place that W3C staff can put stuff that's
safe. There's no place that they can put it that we can see it.
We don't have permission to turn over to entire
membership.
... That's where we are.
Erik: We could put this on
github, private repo, only grant to specific individuals.
... We could put this on github, private repo, only grant to
specific individuals.
dezell: We want TC-68 on board for that decision, good point.
<dezell> manu: we'll try to assign specific use cases to various members of the IG. We need volunteers.
dezell: Any other issues?
manu: I'm concerned about parallelizing the review of the use cases - we need people to review, please volunteer.
erik: We have four people that can help w/ ISO20022, 12812, and X9 use cases.
<scribe> scribenick: manu
dezell: A couple of issues came
up from outside - NASCAR/WAYF (payment button cornucopia
problem / Where are you from?)
... We have a few use cases that came in - NASCAR, WAYF,
push-payments, need to scope that out and make it a bit more
real. We really need help in the use cases exercise.
manu: NASCAR has to do with
having tons of payment buttons on a page.
... WAYF has to do with KYC/AML.
jheuer: I tried to be a bit more
provocative around User Payment Agent - added to the wiki
page.
... Had some discussion w/ Anders - invite everyone to take a
look at wiki page.
... please send in comments - promised on mailing list to
provide alternative approach.
... Tried to specify how much of the vertical stack we need to
solve vs. finding right spots for APIs/protocols where people
can hook into what we're doing.
... One thing we learned, around payments - there are many
established protocols/interfaces - many of them won't be
replaced (for good reason). So, I volunteered to try and do
that - show what the new stack looks like.
... We're going to have a call on Friday at 9:30am ET.
... We can talk it through there in more detail. Especially
wrt. the stack once I have the diagram in the wiki.
<dezell> https://www.w3.org/Payments/IG/wiki/Payment_Agent_Task_Force
dezell: I've had a chance to look
at this - looking at draft framework picture provided by
Stephane.
... I think this has a lot of the right boxes on it, but maybe
not in the right order.
... Stephane was concerned that people didn't understand it.
Are you trying to reorganize those components so people
can?
jheuer: I've tried to be a bit
more descriptive. I'd like to play w/ the elements, see what
sorts of visualizations fit best.
... I don't think there'll be only one picture. We need to find
one that tries to harmonize the vocabulary/view on
things.
... I think the technology/protocol stack view should
help.
... I'll make use of the picture - I'll try to do some stuff to
cover more aspects while trying to not make it complicated.
dezell: I suggest that you identify two different stacks - one for the website, the other for the local side. It might be a difficult to understand how the flows work wrt. this illustration.
jheuer: Yes, that'll be a
challenge, that's good. In our work, we've created the client
side - open/flexible - accommodates many flows.
... Good idea to talk about web-based counter-part being
described. I can only do so much here, I'll try to do that by
Friday.
Ryladog: We may want to identify where in this illustration that we're trying to target w/ our APIs.
jheuer: Yes, I need to do that - identify necessary interfaces. That's something I presented at the TPAC as the 'black box'-approach and needs to be a part of the story - I'll try to get a first draft done by Friday. We'll have discussions on that on Friday.
Ryladog: Can I join the Friday call?
jheuer: Yes, absolutely.
dezell: As you're thinking about
this - we have an API for the wallet, we have a fledgling API
for WebCrypto (not clear how it fits), we have a Secure Element
API, NFC API, etc.
... I'd like to see how all those APIs fit in.
Erik: Is there an implementation for Secure Element?
jheuer: I think Mozilla has one, maybe not completely according to the same spec.
dezell: Various phones have said they have a Secure Element for a while now - they've been there, they've done EMV/NFC, etc. If you have a chip contactless card, it has a SE on the card as well. The answer is that "it's already there", but the WebCrypto group is looking into the standard.
Erik: If you Google for SE, you don't get much out there. It's not in Webkit yet, so it's not in the browsers yet.
jheuer: The Secure Element discussion has always been mid-priority, we need to use it to be compatible w/ EMVco, etc.
dezell: The problem to date has been it's never been a standardized browser interface, but for example Android has had support for a while now. Everyone has done their own thing to date, no W3C standardized interface yet.
jheuer: One question, the API provided on Android phones is the OpenSIM - is there a relationship between W3C and SIM Alliance?
dezell: Don't know, but we can
find out.
... We need to coordinate closely w/ WebCrypto group.
Ryladog: Do you know if WebCrypto is looking at adding an extension stack wrt. HTML5 re: Payments Element... it could be several components?
dezell: I think they're going to
follow the lead of the NFC WG and WebApps WG - create a WebIDL
interface that can be incorporated into anyone's web browser,
implementation of that would be up to Mozilla/Blink/WebKit,
etc.
... NFC WG has a nice document on this stuff - doesn't have
payment, just for peer-to-peer NFC.
... Any other discussion on User Payment Agent?
jheuer: Any other changes to UPA agenda for Friday?
dezell: We should try to get
Virginie to join us.
... wrt. Web Crypto
<Ryladog> extension stack should be extension spec to HTML5
pat_adler: Can we have a discussion on layering on UPA meeting on Friday as well?
dezell: Anything else on UPA Task
Force?
... Other Task Force leaders aren't on the call today:
<dezell> https://www.w3.org/Payments/IG/wiki/Relevant_Conferences_for_the_IG
dezell: We have some dates on the
wiki...
... The long/short is that there is only one conference - NRS
in New York City. 2nd conference ... anyone on the call - does
anyone have plans to attend any conferences between now and end
of Feb.
Erik: I'm supposed to attend Web Payments and Smart Contracts by O'Reilly in Jan/Feb.
<scribe> ACTION: David Ezell to try to find date/location for next face-to-face. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/12/02-wpay-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> 'David' is an ambiguous username. Please try a different identifier, such as family name or username (e.g., dezell2, djackso3, mcdermittd).
dezell: Any thoughts on our next
meeting? We expect to have a draft of Roadmap document of FPWD
before the face-to-face.
... We want to have that - something solid to debate. Any other
thoughts on that?
manu: Are we going to have telecon access to the face-to-face?
dezell: Yes.
... Suggestions on how to engage w/ PST and Asia?
... We're east coast/asia based - we need to branch out.
Ryladog: Can we do a time that's good for PT/asia?
dezell: We need to know a time in
PT/Asia that we can target. We don't have good information on
when that time should be.
... We may have to host two telecons a week to accommodate
that.
<Zakim> manu, you wanted to suggest meeting approach.
manu: Maybe Dave Ezell can just tell us a time - try out a couple of alternative calls, see if we get any takers.
dezell: Ok, let's try something
like that.
... Anyone that hasn't filled out two doodle polls, please do
so... 10am seems like a good time for folks. We may move it to
0.5hour later.
... I want to talk w/ Stephane - we'll send out a notice.
pat_adler: Different topic - what about recruitment support? Looking at the Task Forces, same names on task forces - is there a coordinated list of organizations that we're trying to include?
dezell: We'd like more US,
European, Asian banks - China Union Pay, for example - these
things tend to move very slowly.
... We have to be careful to not put people on a hit
list....
pat_adler: Maybe we just want general areas - we want to do outreach - can we make recruitment efforts more individual? Get a little more bang for our buck - get resources behind certain organizations.
dezell: Keep in mind that we also want retailers... but we're in the shopping time of the year - we'll hear from them in January.
pat_adler: If we're looking at these themes - looking at face-to-face late Jan - not going to get lots of visibility/traction until after... retail and payment are critical. Is it plausible to shoot for early Feb for roadmap draft considering we might not be able to get people's attention over the latter part of the year.
dezell: I agree with you, Pat. We
did get SK Telecom this week, we have a steady influx of people
to the group, more and more joining - 3 per week, which is good
news, especially this time of year and our industry.
... I want to make sure we can articulate that to the W3C at
large, we want to keep making progress.
pat_adler: The people in the
group are going to be resource constrained - collectively in
messaging - the pipeline - can we understand the recruiting
pipeline? Roadmap/use case deliverables - as they come in, can
we get those people in?
... We want to make sure we're attractive to the people that
are not already W3C folks.
Erik: re: recruitment - lots in the pipeline, having US Fed involved would help.
pat_adler: We have lots of people w/ good contacts - lets put those contacts to work.
dezell: Ok, out of time today... any other business?
<dezell> ACTION: Erik to send a doodle poll on when to schedule a recruitment call. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/12/02-wpay-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-23 - Send a doodle poll on when to schedule a recruitment call. [on Erik Anderson - due 2014-12-09].
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.140 of Date: 2014-11-06 18:16:30 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/concerns?/concerns./ Succeeded: s/Scribename: Manu// Succeeded: s/Laurent Castillo// Succeeded: s/Ryladog is Katie Haritos-Shea// Succeeded: s/Anyone opposed to approving minutes from last week?/Anyone opposed to approving minutes from last week? (No opposition)/ Succeeded: s/Istvan is calling from the UK// Succeeded: s/np// Succeeded: s/dezell: You feel okay about that?/scribenick: manu/ Succeeded: s/Anyoen/Anyone/ Succeeded: s/Yes, I need to do that - identify necessary interfaces. That's something that needs to be a part of the story - I'll try to get that done by Friday. We'll have discussions on that on Friday/Yes, I need to do that - identify necessary interfaces. That's something I presented at the TPAC as the 'black box'-approach and needs to be a part of the story - I'll try to get a first draft done by Friday. We'll have discussions on that on Friday/ Succeeded: s/I think Mozilla has one, maybe not complete./I think Mozilla has one, maybe not completely according to the same spec./ Found ScribeNick: manu Found ScribeNick: dezell Found ScribeNick: manu Found ScribeNick: manu Inferring Scribes: manu, dezell Scribes: manu, dezell ScribeNicks: manu, dezell Default Present: Cyril, manu, Davd_Ezell, +1.312.322.aaaa, pat_adler, Erik, David_Jackson, joerg, Katie_Haritos-Shea, lcastillo, +44.207.356.aabb, Istvan Present: Cyril_Vignet David_Ezell Pat_Adler Erik_Anderson David_Jackson Joerg_Heuer Katie_Haritos-Shea Istvan_Lajtos Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-webpayments-ig/2014Nov/0031.html Got date from IRC log name: 02 Dec 2014 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2014/12/02-wpay-minutes.html People with action items: david erik ezell[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]