W3C

- DRAFT -

WCAG

05 Nov 2013

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
Joshue, Kathleen_Anderson, +1.617.766.aaaa, AWK, Bruce_Bailey, Michael_Cooper, Katie_Haritos-Shea, Marc_Johlic, James_Nurthen, David_MacDonald
Regrets
Chair
Joshue_O_Connor
Scribe
marcjohlic, AWK

Contents


<marcjohlic> scribe: marcjohlic

BB: Bruce will scribe the next meeting

<Peter_Thiessen> In another conference call at the moment but will be lurking in the background

<bbailey> New DOT Rules Make Flying Easier for Passengers with Disabilities (airline websites, airport kiosks, and seat strapping)

<bbailey> http://www.dot.gov/briefing-room/new-dot-rules-make-flying-easier-passengers-disabilities

<bbailey> Link in right-hand menu is to official docket

<Peter_Thiessen> right, thanks Joshue

<bbailey> Regulations.gov off-line at moment :-)

BB: DOT is adopting WCAG 2.0 A and AA for airline websites and kiosks.

Clarification - DOT is the agency

Continue techniques review https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/Techsreview15thOct2013/

<Joshue108> Using the aria-describedby property to provide a descriptive label for user interface controls

<Joshue108> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/ARIA1:_Using_the_aria-describedby_property_to_provide_a_descriptive_label_for_user_interface_controls

2. [Start here 5th Nov] Using the aria-describedby property to provide a descriptive label for user interface controls

<bbailey> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/Techsreview15thOct2013/results#x2652

<Joshue108> +q

<Joshue108> ack -q

<Joshue108> +q

<Joshue108> -q

<Joshue108> +q to say that there shouldn't be two IDs in the example

<Joshue108> -q

<AWK> http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria/states_and_properties#aria-describedby

JoC: James tested "Example 2: Using aria-describedby to associate instructions with form fields and it was announced twice

JN: When control was focused it read "a bit of instructions" twice

AWK: Vote to leave example as it is

RESOLUTION: Accepted as amended.

3. Update to Identifying required fields with the aria-required property

<Joshue108> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/ARIA2:_Identifying_required_fields_with_the_aria-required_property

<bbailey> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/Techsreview15thOct2013/results#x2663

<AWK> Scribe: AWK

JO: Kerstin's comment is trying to avoid redundancies

JN: The example itself is designed to avoid that problem

AWK: need to fix for/id association
... Should we add the reference to the hierarchy of labeling items?

"Per the WAI-ARIA specification, the aria-label text will override the text supplied within the link. As such the text supplied will be used instead of the link text by AT. Due to this it is recommended to start the text used in aria-label with the text used within the link. This will allow consistent communication between users."

(stolen from: http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_aria-label_for_link_purpose)

JO: looking at sailesh's survey comments.

<jamesn> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/WCAG20/WD-WCAG20-TECHS/H90.html

AWK: Looks like ARIA2 is for SC 3.3.2 and 1.3.1 and H90 is just 3.3.2

ISSUE: Should H90 reference 1.3.1 like ARIA2 does?

<trackbot> Created ISSUE-15 - Should h90 reference 1.3.1 like aria2 does?. Please complete additional details at <http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/track/issues/15/edit>.

<MichaelC> issue-15?

<trackbot> issue-15 -- Should h90 reference 1.3.1 like aria2 does? -- open

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/track/issues/15

ISSUE-?

RESOLUTION: Accepted as amended

5. Using the group role to identify related form controls

<Joshue108> Using the group role to identify related form controls

Kathy raises issue about role=group on td element

BB; also a little concerned about this

JO: ... What's the problem? The table has role=presentation

JN: This would be a bad idea without the role=presentation
... Suggests making example 2 a handful of divs instead of a layout table.

JO: good idea, no good reason to have the table.
... We would need to ask Sailesh to change the example for the live example to match

<bbailey> Question #5 from earlier survey and #3 from this weeks survey reference same technique.

<bbailey> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/Techsreview15thOct2013/results#x2659

<bbailey> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/Nov5_2013/results#x2663

<bbailey> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_the_group_role_to_identify_related_form_controls

We'll edit the example to remove the table and use divs, and ask Sailesh to modify live example.

<bbailey> Okay, I fixed the issue I flagged with typographical quotation marks

<Ryladog> +1 to what Michael is saying about AT

<Joshue108> +1 to Michaels suggestion

AWK: only outstanding issue is example two - we looked at all comments on current survey item.

ACTION Sailesh to modify example 2 and corresponding live example and text above it for http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_grouping_roles_to_identify_related_form_controls.

<trackbot> Created ACTION-229 - Modify example 2 and corresponding live example and text above it for http://www.w3.org/wai/gl/wiki/using_grouping_roles_to_identify_related_form_controls. [on Sailesh Panchang - due 2013-11-12].

Sailesh will need to change role="group" to role="radiogroup" also.

<marcjohlic> scribe: marcjohlic

<AWK> RESOLUTION: Accepted as amended pending ACTION-229 by Sailesh

7. ARIA-edit: F68: Failure of Success Criterion 1.3.1 and 4.1.2

<Joshue108> ARIA-edit: F68: Failure of Success Criterion 1.3.1 and 4.1.2

<Joshue108> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/ARIA-edit:_F68:_Failure_of_Success_Criterion_1.3.1_and_4.1.2_due_to_the_association_of_label_and_user_interface_controls_not_being_programmatically_determinable

<bbailey> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/Techsreview15thOct2013/results#x2659

<jamesn> http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG-TECHS/G167.html

AWK: Leave Example 3 as is - but should we add info on how to fix it?

DM: May get too confusing if we add the fix info - better to leave it as is.

JO: Suggest removing the last sentences on how to fix it - as the correct way is detailed elswhere

<jamesn> http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/REC-WCAG20-20081211/#programmaticallydetermineddef

<jamesn> does it matter?

JO: No objection to changing title to "determined"

<bbailey> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/Techsreview15thOct2013/results#x2661

JO: Discussed Sailesh's comment and removed "The name can be supplied with the title attribute, with a label element hidden with CSS, with aria-label, or with aria-labelledby." from Example 3.

DM: We're using lowercase and uppercase 't' in "the" in procedures - change all to lowercase.

AWK; Does "submit" button count as a label?

JO: I'd say no it does not count

JN: I believe it does count - depends on your term "label" - html vs generic

AWK: In Example 3, do we want to get rid of "Type your search here"

JO: In favor of keeping it

RESOLUTION: Failure accepted as amended

<AWK> Note: October 15 survey is finished.

Cognitive A11Y TF

<MichaelC> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/cognitive-a11y-tf/work-statement

<AWK> RESOLUTION: WCAG approved modified Cognitive a11y work statement

<AWK> NOTE: Next week November 5 survey to start, #1,2,4 need to be done

Summary of Action Items

[End of minutes]

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Default Present: Joshue, Kathleen_Anderson, +1.617.766.aaaa, AWK, Bruce_Bailey, Michael_Cooper, Katie_Haritos-Shea, Marc_Johlic, James_Nurthen, David_MacDonald
Present: Joshue Kathleen_Anderson +1.617.766.aaaa AWK Bruce_Bailey Michael_Cooper Katie_Haritos-Shea Marc_Johlic James_Nurthen David_MacDonald
Got date from IRC log name: 05 Nov 2013
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2013/11/05-wai-wcag-minutes.html
People with action items: 

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