See also: IRC log
<dsinger> that's me
<dbaron> I may have to leave at the half hour today.
<dsinger> what IS a ??P42 number?
<Arron> I think that is Saloni
<glazou> uuuh ?
<scribe> ScribeNick: fantasai
Peter: Sent out charter list
yesterday.
... Got some feedback on Generated Content, Marquee
... Are there any modules people can't live without?
Jason: List coincides with AOL's direction
dbaron: A little upset that
flexbox was dropped
... We have two prefixed implementations
... don't know if they are interoperable
Peter: I'm concerned that people don't think we will get anything to REC
fantasai: CSS Namespaces will go to REC. Selectors should be able to get there
dbaron: Color
howcome: Media Queries
dbaron: we have two implementations of that, soon to be three
Peter: CSS2.1?
fantasai: I wouldn't expect that. Good chance we won't make it to REC.
Jason: Requirements for PR?
fantasai: complete test suite,
for each test 2 implementations that pass
... I think we'll have a better idea of where we are with the
test suite at the end of this year
... not in time for the charter
peter: anything else?
dsinger: I need to consult with people here at Apple wrt animations and transitions
and transformations
howcome: I think MultiCol is ready
fantasai: It needs work. Some
parts are underdefined. I have some comments on that, can
help
... We should be able to get it to CR soon, though
... And if we can get together resources for a test suite, to
REC within 2 years
peter: Anything we can't get to CR?
fantasai: Text and Text
Layout
... CR for those would be very ambitious... Paul and I don't
have time to work on them this year
<dsinger> I keep wanting to know, for each module, who the primary proponent is, and who responded to the survey saying that they could put resources on it...is that list available?
peter: Paged Media?
fantasai: CR this year
... HP is working on a test suite, so shouldn't have a problem
there
... Will need implementations. We should have implementations
for all features soon
... but the older drafts had many things underspecified, and we
fixed those up
<dbaron> I have a conflicting meeting now (hopefully only this week, although maybe next week too). I'll still be on IRC.
fantasai: so defects would be
what keeps us from REC there
... I think it needed some edits, not much. Paul won't be able
to work on it this year
... One of Mozilla's devs was interested in implementing. Not
sure where it's going to go, though.
Peter: Stuck in CR then
... GCPM?
howcome: I think it's useful
spec,
...
Peter: Fonts?
Jason: Good progress there. I
think we can get to CR pretty quickly.
... Our only concern is the nature of downloadable fonts.
... I don't think we're proposing anything else that is
controversial
howcome: You're putting Web Fonts back in the Fonts specification?
Jason: Yes.
howcome: The subset that's implemented or everything?
Jason: everything
Daniel: From discussion with
Chris Lilley, most font descriptors were unimplemented..
panose, etc.
... So only a subset, not everything, should be in the
spec
... Fonts spec will be edited by Chris Lilley, Jason, and John
Daggett
... Small overhead in getting both WG to agree on
publication
Jason: John and I would be
willing to split them back out if merging leads to a
roadblock
... I think font properties should be good to go
... Some issues came up in the design community about being
able to suppress synthesized fonts
... And being able to style different fonts differently
fantasai: You can use multiple fonts in the same elements because of what glyphs are available. That means you'd style individual glyphs differently
Peter cuts off technical conversation and redirects to charter
Peter: Expect CR?
<dsinger> this seems very detailed here, but I am not sure I agree with the question. it falsl into the case "doctor, it hurts when I do this" and the reply "don't do that, then" seems appealing
Jason: Yes
Peter: REC?
Jason: don't know
<dbaron> ok, my 9:30 was thankfully quite short... calling back in now.
Peter: Template Layout?
fantasai: I think CR might be possible, not sure about implementations.. but there remains a lot of work to be done in that spec
Bert: I think we can get to
CR
... But I haven't heard anybody talk about implementations
Peter: Tables?
<dsinger> dbaron: your (?) question where there was a mix of fonts with different intrinsic styles in a fallback list. but it can wait.
<dbaron> dsinger, I wasn't on the phone then, so it wasn't my question...
fantasai: MS is not likely to have much time to work on it until after IE8 releases. They usually spend time on specs right after the release
dbaron: I'm also interested in
Tables.
... We'd probably want test suite drafts along with working
drafts
... since it's not about features as about refining
definitions
Peter: CSS Variables
Daniel: I think we should be able to get this to CR
<dsinger> safari and who else has this in implementation?
<dbaron> Bert, all that work on the old size algorithm was really only a small part of it...
Daniel: It does not seem to be that complex
Peter: Box Model
Bert: Box Model needs
implementations
... of vertical layout
... It's the same as CSS2.1 for horizontal
... So maybe CR
Peter: Extended Box Model
Bert: WD at most
Peter: CSSOM View
fantasai: Need to ask Anne. I would guess REC, but should ask him.
Peter: Values and Units
howcome: Kinda sitting there
dbaron: We agreed to add cycle(),
and it's not there.
... But I really do want to move this forward
... I would hope that we'd have an implementation within 2
years. Maybe not all of it. But there are a bunch of features
that I do want to implement.
Peter: So commitment to CR
... Grid Positioning?
fantasai: I suspect WD
Alex: I would hope for CR.
Peter: Lists?
<Arron> Probably WD
<Arron> maybe CR if the tests suite is done early
Peter: Generated Content?
fantasai: CR
Peter: Cascading and Inheritance
howcome: not much changes there. Can probably go to CR
dbaron: Anything new beyond 2.1?
howcome: I don't think so
dbaron: If there's nothing new, why bother?
Peter: If there's nothing beyond 2.1, why do we add this?
<Arron> Specificity had to change for CSS 3 selectors didn't it?
Arron, specificity is defined in Selectors
fantasai: Can point to 2.1
... if it's needed for references
Peter proposes to drop from list
That seems to be ok
Peter: Marquee?
Bert: We need to finish that
one
... We have to do that for the mobile profile
... CR certainly. REC, I'm not sure
... There are implementations in Mobile, not sure how good they
are
fantasai: I'd aim for CR. Dependency on 2.1 can hold that back
Peter: FlexBox?
dbaron: I'd like to at least get
working drafts out
... CR would be nice, but I'd say working drafts
Peter: Ok, I will go through list and come up with a new list that reflects what we think we can deliver
Dean Jackson: I think we can get Animations and Transitions to CR.
<dino> and Transforms
<plinss> http://www.w3.org/Style/CSS/Tracker/actions/44
dbaron: I think in some cases we
might have said that if we want to count 2 implementations they
have to pass the same test.. if we're going through the
"equivalent test" route
... where the implementations are passing two different
versions of the same test
... If we don't require that, then we need to review the
equivalent tests very carefully
RESOLUTION: adopt proposed wording for CR exit criteria
<dbaron> (assuming peter was in favor)
<dsinger> bye, thx, see you in late june
<plinss> Sorry, had a power failure here. Too many CPUs, not enough UPSes...
RRSAgent: make logs public
RRSAgent: make minutes
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.133 of Date: 2008/01/18 18:48:51 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/REC/CR/ Succeeded: s/dbaron/fantasai/ Found ScribeNick: fantasai Inferring Scribes: fantasai Default Present: dsinger, +1.760.741.aaaa, plinss, Daniel_Glazman, +47.21.64.aabb, David_Baron, +95380aacc, Bert, +1.703.265.aadd, jason_cranfordtea, howcome, fantasai, alex, dino Present: dsinger +1.760.741.aaaa plinss Daniel_Glazman +47.21.64.aabb David_Baron +95380aacc Bert +1.703.265.aadd jason_cranfordtea howcome fantasai alex dino WARNING: No meeting title found! You should specify the meeting title like this: <dbooth> Meeting: Weekly Baking Club Meeting WARNING: No meeting chair found! You should specify the meeting chair like this: <dbooth> Chair: dbooth Got date from IRC log name: 28 May 2008 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2008/05/28-css-minutes.html People with action items:[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]