yes

do you have the url of the agenda?

<marc> Ah, thanks, that's very kind of you Ian!

<marc> The Agenda URL: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-emotion/2008Jan/0013.html

<marc> The "Cheat Sheet" for scribes: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/emotion/group/IRC-Cheat-Sheet.html

<felix> good moring

<felix> moring /morning

<marc> Scribe: Ian_Wilson

<marc> ScribeNick: ian

<Jianhua> Hi all, the skype seems not working at the moment, I cannot make the calling, I will keep trying

<marc> ok Jianhua, we'll try to type more then!"

<marc> next item

<marc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-emotion/2008Jan/0015.html

<marc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-emotion/2008Jan/0016.html

marc: says feedback for questionairre was good
... notes people from outside the group gave valuable feedback
... notes that results of questionairre are in general agreement
... notes that emotion categories and dimensions are agreed must haves

perhaps we say over 75% are definately in?

<bjoern> or over 70% (3 important ones @ 71%...)

ian: mentions that some items may be easy to impliment through the structure of XML

marc: these may require a detailed discussion that may be too in depth for now

<marc> a suggestion: we could draw a line at, e.g., 70%,

<marc> and suggest that those above 70% are "definitely in".

<marc> That gives us a list of 11 requirements,

<marc> and then people can discuss why the list should be changed.

<dyl_an> tt

<bjoern> agrees.

<dyl_an> tt

as an aside i will split the list into "meta data", "body data" and "link data"

<scribe> ACTION: ian to create list of "first cut" items to discuss and circulate due by tomorrow [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/31-emotion-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot-ng> Created ACTION-9 - Create list of \"first cut\" items to discuss and circulate due by tomorrow [on Ian Wilson - due 2008-02-07].

dylan: asks about confidence ratings, is there one meta or confidence ratings for each item

marc: we will discuss that later when we address each item

<marc> next item

<marc> owl example from bill

<marc> rdf example from ian

<marc> deep xml example from myriam

<marc> shallow xml example from bjoern

<marc> one key choice: how explicit?

<marc> beiing explicit would mean giving up on "simple cases should look simple"

ian: annotations and models have somewhat differing requirements

<Myriam> I thing it's better to use

<Myriam> simple cases in the fisrt step

marc: we want to stay with 1 format however

<Myriam> Deep structure is more flexible

marc: do we want to trade simplicity for explicitness?

<Myriam> but it's very difficult to constraint data type

<Myriam> it's eaisier with attribute

<Myriam> if you want use a range like [0, 1] it's better to use a flat structure

ian: how important is it that we can interoperate with other formats and other groups?

<Myriam> yes

dylan: agrees, that interoperation is crucial

<Myriam> the mapping will be more or less complex

dylan: thinks going to an ontology is a step too far and making a comitment to an ontology is too much

ian: agrees, thinks an ontology would be too concrete wheras xml is more abstract

<Myriam> perhaps, RDF is an intermediate between XML and OWL

<Myriam> it's possible to use like XML

<Myriam> but also to create an ontology

<Myriam> XML or RDF namespace are the same goal

<Myriam> the disambiguous of type

<Myriam> but some RDF namespaces are a norm

<Myriam> like DC

ian: rdf requires unambiguous namespaces and terms

<Myriam> yes

<Myriam> and XML accept qualified or unqualified terms

<Myriam> but we can f

<Myriam> force the utilisation of namespace

marc: wants to know if xml, rdf and owl can be sub classed?

<Myriam> yes for XML

<scribe> ACTION: ian to investigate sub classing in RDF due next friday [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/31-emotion-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot-ng> Created ACTION-10 - Investigate sub classing in RDF due next friday [on Ian Wilson - due 2008-02-07].

<Myriam> I think also for OWL because it's based on object programming

do we have a link for sub classing XML?

<Myriam> If you write a simpleType to restrict xsd:integer

<Myriam> to range [0,1]

<Myriam> we can also use xsd:restruction from a complexType

<Myriam> in XSD

cane you find an example?

can

<Myriam> yes

<bjoern> yes

<marc> is there an agreement that we want to be explicit?

yes

<bjoern> yes

<Myriam> in http://www.iut.univ-paris8.fr/~lamolle/EMOXG/emoxg-basetype.xsd

<Myriam> we can see basic type for EMOXG

Christian: says we dont want to be too explicit, only with core attributes

<Myriam> and in http://www.iut.univ-paris8.fr/~lamolle/EMOXG/emoXG0.1.xsd

<Myriam> we can see I extend or restrict basic type

<marc> Let's investigate how the various formalisms can deal with the "plug in" challenge

<Myriam> I think it exist 3 formalisms to "plug in"...

<Myriam> in XSD

<Myriam> can we use the same examples to compare the "plug-in"?

<Myriam> or the sub-classsing?

<scribe> ACTION: Myriam to investigate subclassing in XML due 2008-02-21 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/31-emotion-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot-ng> Sorry, couldn't find user - Myriam

<scribe> ACTION: Bill to investigate subclassing in OWL due 2008-02-21 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/31-emotion-minutes.html#action04]

<trackbot-ng> Created ACTION-11 - Investigate subclassing in OWL due 2008-02-21 [on Bill Jarrold - due 2008-02-07].

<marc> Let's note for the future: another question we will have to look at is how the language can be "plugged into" another language such as EARL or SMIL etc.

<marc> ACTION: Marc to describe the challenge of plugging in different categories etc. within the language - due 15 Feb [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/31-emotion-minutes.html#action05]

<trackbot-ng> Created ACTION-12 - describe the challenge of plugging in different categories etc. within the language [on Marc Schröder - due 2008-02-15].

<marc> next item

<marc> Next meeting should be the "late slot" (15:00 UTC); I suggest the week

<marc> of 25 February, day to be determined with Doodle.

all: agreed

<bjoern> all:agreed,2

<Dylan> Thanks everyone. Bye!

<bjoern> bye

<Myriam> bye

This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.133  of Date: 2008/01/18 18:48:51  
Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/

Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Found Scribe: Ian_Wilson
Found ScribeNick: ian

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Present: Bill_Jarold Ian_Wilson Marc_Schroeder Christian_Peter Dylan_Evans Jianhua_Tao Kostas_Karpousis Myriam_Lamolle Bjoern_Schuller Felix_Burkhardt
Regrets: Jean-Claude_Martin Enrico_Zovato Paolo_Baggia Eva_oliveira Catherine_Pelachaud
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-emotion/2008Jan/0013.html
Got date from IRC log name: 31 Jan 2008
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2008/01/31-emotion-minutes.html
People with action items: bill ian marc myriam

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<dbooth> Topic: Review of Amy's report