See also: IRC log
<scribe> scribe: Felix
<scribe> scribeNick: fsasaki
<scribe> ACTION: Everybody to look at input mode discussion (DROPPED) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/09/19-i18ncore-minutes.html#action01]
<scribe> ACTION: all to look at charmod resid test suite and gather feedback (PENDING) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/09/19-i18ncore-minutes.html#action02]
Felix: Chris Lilley asked for IRI tests for SVG tiny 1.2 , I thought of creating a mini-test suite
Francois: we have no bandwith for a full test suite. Is the scope of the SVG tiny tests clear?
Felix: no, so far only PC between Chris and me
<fyergeau> http://www.w3.org/TR/2006/CR-SVGMobile12-20060810/
<scribe> ACTION: Felix to write a mail about possibility for SVG tiny specific IRI tests to martin and the i18n core list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/09/19-i18ncore-minutes.html#action03]
<scribe> ACTION: Francois to build a current issues list on charmod norm (PENDING) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/09/19-i18ncore-minutes.html#action04]
<scribe> ACTION: Mary will make the updates discussed in Mandelieu on ws-i18n (PENDING) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/09/19-i18ncore-minutes.html#action05]
<scribe> ACTION: Francois to give input to wiki for the LTLI summary [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/09/19-i18ncore-minutes.html#action06]
Wiki
prepared by Richard, see
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2006Jul/0026.html
<scribe> ACTION: Richard to review XHTML Basic 1.1$B!!(Band XHTML$B!!(BModularization 1.1 (DROPPED) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/09/19-i18ncore-minutes.html#action07]
Richard: I think we are done with the ITS review, I need to double check
Richard: I wrote a long mail on
this yesterday, with about 7 questions
... some for XHTML people, some for CSS people
... we have to wait for some response from CSS
... basic idea: Martin and I believe that if you declare
override on the block-element, everything in that element
should be overriden
... currently, CSS 2.1 don't say that, and the current
implementations in browsers follow CSS 2.1
Francois: e.g. if you have a dir attribute at a <div> element, everything should be overriden?
Richard: currently there is no
override for CSS 2: if there is a <p> in the <div>,
nothing will happen
... in CSS 2.1, there will be an override for the <p> ,
but not for e.g. a <div> within the <div>
... e.g. text in a <p> in a <div> within a
<div> will not be reordered
Francois: sounds strange. Touches
many working groups
... very specialized subject for some people. We should try to
engage them, does Najib know about this?
Richard: no
... Paul Nelson got involved a bit
... what do you think what should happen?
Francois: I think everything in a
<div> should be overriden
... there could be reasons not to override everything
Felix: I would follow Richard's and Martin's proposal
Richard: having e.g. dir="rtl"
would cancel the override
... for an embedded element
Francois: having override on a
block element is not an interesting requirement
... it is only for small bits of text
Richard: I recently edited a
boiler template text for Hebrew / Arabic
... in that case, I really wanted to have the override
(discussion on use-cases for block-level override)
(Richard says that dealing with visualy ordered text is a use case)
Richard: the behavior of CSS 2.1 described at [Question 3 (CSS)] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-core/2006JulSep/0157.html is what current browsers do
Francois: does this relate to bidi-override inheritance?
Richard: we have to consider in
ITS what that means
... we say in ITS that RLO is inherited, but say that the
behavior depends on the implementation
... so we separated inheritance from behavior
Felix: in ITS, there is nothing about behavior, all is about inheritance of information - for all data categories
Francois: we should get more
people in this discussion
... Richard showed in his mail that specs and behaviors
contradict
... I think there is a bidi-list at Unicode, we should invite
people from that list
Richard: we could also blog on it, or discuss it on www-international
Francois: we might loose the
style people
... so we move out of of i18n-core, and go to
www-international
... what about Paul's reply to your mail?
Richard: I'm not sure what he is up to
Francois: inheritance in CSS means: if s.t. is inherited, the effect is the same as being specified at a specific element
Richard: for directionality, that means a new embedding level
Francois: yes.
... you could also say that directionality is not inherited,
but the effect "goes down"
Richard: you have 3 ways of
inheritance: ITS (no behavior, only inheritance of
information)
... behavior without inheritance, and inheritance together with
behavior
... what will happen without markup, with multiple lines of
text?
... is there some effect of newlines?
Francois: newlines in XML are just converted to spaces
Richard: what about plain text?
Francois: not aware of a specific handling
Richard: next step: I resend the mail to www-international and the style-list
Francois: copy the BIDI-unicode list
<scribe> ACTION: Richard to send his mail on bidi-override scope in CSS2 and CSS 2.1 to www-international and the style-list, and copy the BIDI-unicode list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/09/19-i18ncore-minutes.html#action08]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-core/2006JulSep/0134.html
Francois summarizes the mail
Richard: we have enough on the battle of early normalization
Francois: yes
... I sad it was a good idea
... we cannot have early Unicode normalization, so it is better
to have this
... I send my reply to Michael also to the list and wait a
week
<scribe> ACTION: Francois to send his reply on xml schema to the list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/09/19-i18ncore-minutes.html#action09]
Felix: possibility of reviewing
Voice Extensible Markup Language (VoiceXML) 2.1
... see http://www.w3.org/TR/2006/WD-voicexml21-20060915/
Francois: changes at
http://www.w3.org/TR/2006/WD-voicexml21-20060915/#sec-changes
... nothing i18n specific it seems