<Rich> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-aria/2016Aug/0171.html

<Rich> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-aria-admin/2016Aug/0015.html

<Rich> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-aria-admin/2016Aug/0015.html

<scribe> Scribe: Stefan

Rich: CFC results of TF

<Rich> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-aria-admin/2016Aug/0011.html

Rich: we only got results of support
... no objections, Michael?

Michael: no

Rich: how is this staffed?

Michael: we are still wrking on that
... we needs people of all three WG's
... we ask people from small list of candidates

Janina: gona have to beat the bushes, no chair already known

Michalel: assuming charter goes throught thn group will have clear indication .. we are cooking things together at TPM

Janina: bunch of mails from seevral groups, will be clearer after the week-end

Matt: no overlaps with CSS please at TPAC
... could also be not on Monday

Rich: we are wrking to split things between different working groups

Matt: 30 min req. to get the ball rolling in that area

Rich: Thursday perhaps
... we reach decision to form up TF
... we have concerns how this will be staffed, this is quite "overcommitted"

Michael: CSS mappings is not a ARIA deliverable

Action 2107

<Rich> https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2107

<mck> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/action2107-aria-details/aria/aria.html

Matt: URL to branch with proposal
... I found some middle ground but not sure what is wanted in long run

<Rich> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/action2107-aria-details/aria/aria.html#aria-details

Rich: (reading it)

Matt: changed ws: 2nd paragraph int two
... changed intent (availability of decription, nav to it, visible etc,)
... simplified paragraphs basically
... name/description was broken up into separate units
... flattened into a string is useful
... next paragraph some acc apis is aout precedence of aria-details
... one reason for this is UAs are moving in direction to support both, in the long run we can remove the statement
... only reveal details and hide description ist the other way to go

Rich: I worry about that we have two descriptions both of them visible - which one to go?

Matt: aria-describedby is NOT only for description, it is multi-purpose, whereas aria-details is much more specifiic in terms of what is decribed
... both a re useful I can imagine both scenarios+

<Zakim> fesch, you wanted to say how can you ensure aria-details reference is visible and points to a different web page?

Fred: visible on page or different web page, is the different page visible, too?

+q

Rich: examples changed? Matt: no
... extended description, alternative drawing could also be possible

James: big tooltip with structural info also

Rich: tooltip never came up, but why is this not a description?

James. because it is structured

Rich: intent is we don't want to be stringified

James: we need also way to keyboard user to move to structured content

Rich: big discussion in API working group
... new key shortcuts are also topic for aria-details nav to

Matt: devil is in details for focus ,oving
... ARIA 2.0 discussion: do we have a diffeernt kind of key attribut on an element

Rich: yeah, ARIA 2
... we need meeting to discuss ARIA 2 items before TPAC

Matt: ACC API's : if group things limiting authors then we should decide so

RicH. it is more a browser limitation than a AT limitation, original concern was using certain relationships under covers and this will hold up everything

Rich: no normative text change, I'm ok with this

<fesch> +1

<Rich> +1

<janina_> +1

R+1

RESOLUTION: accept ed. change for action 2107

https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/1723

Rich: Joanie is not here

Michael: not able to anser fast if this was pulled in

Rich: (looking into it too)
... we move on

Testable Statements (Coordination) and test case Authoring

Rich: Shane was creating a wiki

Shane: I don't have this action item

Rich: all new 1.1 statements

Michel: I don't remember creating any new 1.1 testable statements

Shane: Joanie finished that after the meeting

<Rich> https://www.w3.org/wiki/ARIA_1.1_Testable_Statements#Overview

<Rich> https://www.w3.org/wiki/ARIA_1.1_Testable_Statements

Fred: we have pearl script that takes cntent from wiki and put it into jason blom or whatever
... we can tweak wiki pages and turn them into automated test pages

Rich: can you explain format

Fred: code is there but not testable staement

<fesch> https://www.w3.org/wiki/SVG_Accessibility/Testing/Test_Assertions_with_Tables

Fred: (explains first example)
... if it fails will be identified with FAIL
... important part is saying IF_GIVEN
... below that is table what we expect found by platform

Rich: can there be breaks or must it be one line in testable statement

Fred: space is fine, Returns probably also ...
... no wiki markup please

Rich: original one for ARIA .. testable statements .. bunch of properties

<Rich> https://www.w3.org/wiki/ARIA_1.1_Testable_Statements

Rich: aria-busy for example
... must have same structure as for SVG testable statements#

Fred: add normative requirement (aria-busy=true), I'm not sure that we have that as offerings

Matt: in this case that normative change won't drive a testable statement

Rich: can ou add comments?

Fred: actually pulls that out and put it in JSON

Rich: comments a re not parsed
... we can work with this
... we need testable statements for aria-busy
... what is if aria-busy is applied to Table etc.

<ShaneM> can we look at : https://www.w3.org/wiki/ARIA_1.1_Automated_Testing#Draft_ARIA_Test_Case_Format

Rich: does everybody undestands? OK.

Fred: multiple people cannot edit page at same time, it is a wiki

Rich: who does what? I'm gpoing to do that NOW :)

Fred: right now I'm going tompull out the PRE
... looks like the other stuff disappeared .. strange .. must check

Rich: let's assign things to people
... who wants to take 3.1 to 3.10?
... for things that have changed in ARIA 1.1
... Fed will get an action

<scribe> ACTION: Fred Esch write testable stements and testcases for 3.1 to 3.10 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/08/18-aria-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2109 - Esch write testable stements and testcases for 3.1 to 3.10 [on Fred Esch - due 2016-08-25].

<scribe> ACTION: Rich write testable stements and testcases for 3.10 to 3.22 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/08/18-aria-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2110 - Write testable stements and testcases for 3.10 to 3.22 [on Richard Schwerdtfeger - due 2016-08-25].

<scribe> ACTION: Fred Esch write testable stements and testcases for 4.1 to 4.14 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/08/18-aria-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2111 - Esch write testable stements and testcases for 4.1 to 4.14 [on Fred Esch - due 2016-08-25].

<scribe> ACTION: Fred Esch write testable stements and testcases for 4.15 to end of 4 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/08/18-aria-minutes.html#action04]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2112 - Esch write testable stements and testcases for 4.15 to end of 4 [on Fred Esch - due 2016-08-25].

Blockers for entering CR

Rich: I can not see any
... just some things with Alexander Surkov / James Craig

Michel: no blockers

Matt: no blockers, there was an action but was discussed in API call

Rich: I thing we are OK now
... we need relationships nailed down with Alex
... some people must still respond
... we got tget this wrapped up
... we now get started on this. Anything else?

Automation

<ShaneM> https://www.w3.org/wiki/ARIA_1.1_Automated_Testing#Draft_ARIA_Test_Case_Format

Shane: link goes to a fragment with test case formats
... support info requested in this format, so we care for EACH API mapping what is the bits we care about .. this info was in manual tests before .. useless for machines must e machine readable
... automation of result evaluation must be easier

Rich: will you define lotta stuff of table for an UIAutiomation table interface?

Shane: can you give example?

Rich: each of element mappings - can we do a hierarchy?

Shane: as long if something has an ID

Rich: do all elements need ID's?

Shane: yes.
... you can use CSS selectors for traverse, too

Rich: let's get a path out it, maybe a couple of pathers

p a lotShane: need working examples will help a lot

Shane: fake screen reader, gets info out of acc. tree each platform we want to automate, thats the basic idea

Rich: let's get started on

Ricjh: Fred, documenting this format is also important, do you have time for this?

Fred: yes

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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Found Scribe: Stefan
Inferring ScribeNick: Stefan
Present: MichaelC LJWatson Janina Rich_Schwerdtfeger JaEunJemmaKu fesch matt_King ShaneM
Found Date: 18 Aug 2016
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2016/08/18-aria-minutes.html
People with action items: 3.1 3.10 4.1 4.15 esch for fred rich stements testable testcases write

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