See also: IRC log
<scribe> scribe: clapierre
scribenic: clapierre
charles: gave recap of experiences in japan
Tzviya: next year ;you will all have to come.. it was amazing.
<tzviya> https://www.w3.org/blog/dpub/
deborah: a brief discussion on email conversation extended description...
charles that is #2
tzviya: daniel Weck is fighting
the good fight on that and is our best friend now.
... Rich thought summary details would work
... everyone thinks summary/details should work but we need to
flesh out the details and how we can link out a description
deborah: John F. is saying we don't care if its longdesc/describedat but we need something in HTML which describes this thing.
… I do think its worth continuing in that discussion, we need something in HTML that says this is an extended description
tzviya, next steps should be to reduce the list of options and present them to the rest of the group. but looks like this is being derailed in recent emails.
mia, details/summary is worth considering but not the final solution yet.
deborah: we have been making assumptions in describedAt that would have extended descriptions
…, sounds like: we would be happy to say yes we are right describedAt and is not a issue for DPUB, yes you can remove it from the spec which is ok but we still need a solution,
tzviya: well , its an ARIA issue, they will take it out of the spec.
…, this issue of external descriptions if it isn't part of the ARIA spec then who will take this up, but DPUB doesn't care we will use whatever they decide, we just need it.
deborah, ARIA was a fix while HTML is trying to do a better job about it.
mia, remembers looking at html spec and a bunch of things will be pulled in to HTML 5 from ARIA …
<scribe> ACTION: we will contribute to the email Tzviya will initiate on this topic in the mailing list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/11/06-DPUB-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Error finding 'we'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/track/users>.
deborah: it has been so long since we looked at it, no one knows where we are at…
Tzviya: agreed
deborah: it was almost done except…
<tzviya> http://w3c.github.io/dpub-accessibility/
charles: we haven't lost any work.
deborah: we went through what needs to be done, is what we lost
…, minutes were not that great.
…, I was to go through who had to do what but due to waiting too long and lack of minutes was now difficult to figure out.
tzviya: scanning this document shows some of this is dated (ie. DropCap) is being handled in CSS for example.
deborah: there is some work to get this up to date.. but not sure if this will be a duplication of labor.
tzviya: we can recreate this… Page Numbers with being able to access a specific page or is this to read the generated content?
mia: both and be able to get back to the specific page # in hard cover. (I will take this)
tzviya: dave Cramer on CSS side, look at ARIA minutes from the working group
http://www.w3.org/2015/10/28-aria-minutes.html
http://www.w3.org/2015/10/28-aria-minutes.html
deborah: we need pagination for get back to print and display in page.
http://w3c.github.io/dpub-accessibility/
… we don't want to remove DropCap because of the suggestion UAG and outreach, we know this is a CSS3 but we want to reach out to ATAG, issue is that people weren't using it or supporting it. Reason why its in this document is to reach out to everyone on how to use it correctly.
… needs polishing. we are fine
tzviya: browser support then people support to follow.
deborah: Notes, nothing needs to be doing
…, we are documenting things just for completeness.
…, positional location of text by Mia.
…, unclear if all use cases can be done in css.. but more work needed
…, Phonetic spelling 2issues : 1 UA, and WCAG, pronunciation lexicon exists but need to have this added. Spec needs to exist for phonetic spelling.
tzviya: what would you like to see.
deborah: either create a new spec or add phonetic spelling lexicon support
…, maybe expand HTML to expand to support phonetic pronunciation
…, comment needs to be added: either the existing system needs to be fixed, or something new has to come into existance.
…, specifically the pronunciation lexicon support for external document the chemistry department added a new lexicon that everyone can use for example
layout's influence on comprehension
…, all in the note… looks fine needs wordsmithing etc…
Deeply Nested Heading Levels Best Practices
…, Tzviya this was yours.and should be good
Semantically needed List-Head
…, we need this, but after listening to PF what will they say… "ARIA-Labelledby" is for
…, maybe that is the work?
tzviya: but that won't work for sighted users
mia: if you want some kind of clear associate that is visible, for comprehension but someone uses a tool that linearizes it you may not have a clear distinction. to this list/part of a list.
Deborah: I will take this one one.
Skippability
…, must also expose this for sighted users… looks pretty good.
Tzviya, this is a pretty big ask.
Assessments
Deborah: need to sit down with Mark Hakkenin
Tzviya: Mark is building a world in Web components but is only supported in one browser. its addressing great needs, we just don't know how it will work across other browsers.
…, chrome is the only browser which supports WC.
mia, chrome is the least popular in AT space due to major issues. (keyboard support etc..) there are major security issues as well...
charles: should we take it out?
deborah: we can't take it out.
mia: maybe its own section?
Tzviya: yes but we need Mark to fill this in. Or we will follow up with work on this.
Deborah: we should for assessments in the document.. it includes a whole lot of things … someone needs to talk to Mark and say that DPUB will follow up with him on our needs and will work together with him on a separate document. and then we will put a bullet saying that that a note with Mark will follow
Charles: I will take this on with Mark.
Escapability
deborah, there is no concept to get me out of this element to jump out of the table.
mia: this is also an issue for magnification users as well to get out of this. and they are scrolling forever.
deborah: I will take this one one and word smith this to clean up the use cases.
Diagrammar
deborah: does this belong? need to talk to George.
Tzviya: I will take this up with George.
Annotations
Deborah, there is no action items, there is an annotations WG.
…, are there major things that are missing.
mia: this is a good action item to look for anything missing
tzviya: what are our next steps with the WCAG rechartering etc..
deborah: 2 weeks from now is our last meeting before holidays.
…, get my stuff done in 2 weeks from now or will give everyone a heads up number of days
tzviya: next two weeks are insane so please ping me to remind me of my issues.
Deborah: lets move Diagrammer to the Appendix
…, maybe the issues with Mark H. ect can be moved into an appendix.
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.140 of Date: 2014-11-06 18:16:30 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/ARIA/DPUB/ Succeeded: s/Crammer/Cramer/ Found Scribe: clapierre Inferring ScribeNick: clapierre Present: TzviyaSiegman Charles_LaPierre MiaLipner DeborahKaplan WARNING: No meeting title found! You should specify the meeting title like this: <dbooth> Meeting: Weekly Baking Club Meeting WARNING: No meeting chair found! You should specify the meeting chair like this: <dbooth> Chair: dbooth Got date from IRC log name: 06 Nov 2015 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2015/11/06-DPUB-minutes.html People with action items: contribute we will WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]