See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 29 March 2012
<cyril> +Present: Nikos
<scribe> scribeNick: krit
cyril: I have an issue
heycam: I have an action for the
... not done yet
... action number: 3251
ed: what about smil time containers?
heycam: yes, let's take a look at
... I am happy about brians efforts
ed: any concerns?
shepazu: I suspect MS might have concerns but they are not here
heycam: I thing it is the full smil time container
cyril: he doesn't want elements but attributes
resolution: SVG 2.0 requirement: support SMIL time containers
cyril: we want the feature of smil time containers, but not necessarily the element iteself
heycam: "Consider adding a
'key()' keyword for animation triggers"
... You can just get a single character no a key. Not good defined
cyril: don't think that this is
... I discussed security issues with brian on accessKeys
... SVG integration of accessKeys might be modified to address security issues
ed: we should come up with a proposal that adresses security issues
resolution: SVG 2 requirement:Consider adding a 'key()' keyword for animation triggers and addressing security issues
krit: timelineBegin attribute on
<svg> element next?
... even for inner SVG elements?
cyril: we should not speack about
documents but time container
... we can start new time containers anywhere. We should talk about that after we have time container
... Oh, I think timlineBegin should only be on the document
<cyril> see syncBehavior to control the timeline of a time container
heycam: you might not want to wait for document load end to start animations
krit: I think it should be part of the time container
heycam: it might make sense to start animations on a time container before the content is fully loaded
cyril: I think we already have a resolution.
heycam: it was more about synchronizing media
cyril: i don't think so
... e.g if you have video and audio that could differ from the timeline of the document
... I agree with the request, we should define whne the timeLine begins
heycam: Well, I am fine with it
resolution: SVG2 will support a means for having SMIL animations start before their time container has fully loaded
heycam: The <discard> element
ed: to throw away elements based on animations. Good for big files on streaming
cyril: use case is still
... there might be issues on scripting the <discard> elements
... we should fix that
... have you implemented it?
ed: yes, opera implements the <discard> element
heycam: brian seems not to be opposed to it
ed: can we resolve requirements?
resolution: SVG 2 will have <discard> element to declaratively discard elements from the document tree
cyril: The 'playbackOrder' attribute on the<svg> element next
<cyril> If 'playbackOrder' is set to 'forwardOnly', the content will probably contain 'discard' elements or scripts that destroy resources, thus seeking back in the document's timeline may result in missing content.
heycam: more important for the UI controls
<cyril> Similarly the UA should disable any controls it may provide in the user interface for seeking backwards.
ed: not sure ahow important the
... a lot of shoulds and mays
cyril: should you revert the
... we could use plabackOrder also with scripts
heycam: it might be useful if UIs
have some build in controls
... does flash have it?
... you didn't implement this attribute yet?
ed: no, Opera either
... might only be useful for UIs
... not sure if the wording is so great either
<cyril> resolution: SVG 2 should support the playbackOrder attribute to inform UA to not display controls to seek backwards
ed: we have all the things
krit: At adobe we will most likely specialise on glyphs and fonts, discussion is still going on
ed: I don't want to sign up for
to many at this point
... I might sing up for a couple more
cyril: I haven't discussed it yet with colleagues
heycam: I have a bunch of
... most of them will be align with html5
cyril: We should do as much as
possible till april to publish first WD till July
... And then make a second round for missing requirments
heycam: july is the first
... and then straight to last call in january
shepazu: We should have as much
as possible but should go out with what we have
... the first WD should have the new things in it
... we focus on the new stuff
... people are more interessted in the new stuff than what SVG 1.1 has
<cyril> I think we need to do 3 things: freeze the commitments, start editing the spec to add the annotations for this first set of reqs and then start receiving proposals
<cyril> and evaluating them
resolution: Commitments on SVG parts we want to work on will be frozen by next week
shepazu: I send an email with the
conversation that I have with fantasai
... you all have read
... media fragment spec let you point to different parts of document you want
<ed> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2012JanMar/0189.html has some examples I cooked up, using ids for selecting parts of an svg "spritemap"
shepazu: think about a use
element can point to an element in SVG and just wants to show
... an CSS image would access that
... we had one use case in SVG for navigation
... fantasai proposes what a fragment is in SVG 2 and what to do when the UA points to that
<TabAtkins> Fantasai's point that SVG just needs to define what a hash *represents* is sufficient. We can take over from there. But defining it as representing "navigate/scale/whatever the viewport" isn't useful.
shepazu: what is the navigation behavior
<TabAtkins> And then you can say that the default behavior is to navigate to the referenced element.
ed: it should work in FF as well
<ed> it works in all browsers
heycam: one use viewBox on the target and two hide the other ones
heycam: most document just gone have a part of an image with an ID. There won't be an viewBox arround it
ed: what eric did works fin here.
<heycam> would like to know how this relates to <view> -- <view> is kind of indirect, so this would provide the same/similar functionality but be simpler?
<cyril> and #svgView()
shepazu: if we get auhtoring tools to support this than we are fine
<ed> this alternative uses <view> elements to define the viewboxes
heycam: you have to define a viewBox
<ed> ... and lacks the display:none things, which could be added of course, similarly to http://dahlström.net/tmp/sharp-icons/svg-icon-target.svg#chart
shepazu: currentyl the SVG 1.1
says that its simple goes to view port of the SVG anchetor of
... you just have the svg root
krit: I saw eriks solution some times, mostly for zooming
shepazu: eirks solution is a good interim solution
cyril: just want to confirm the next F2F meetings
<ed> Seattle, USA, 25-27 July, 2012
cyril: what is the next
... TPAC, SVG open?
shepazu: this is the last SVG
... would be good to have on f2f at SVG open
cyril: can you attend to TPAC and SVG open?
Tav: figure it out
krit: I was surprised about the SVG path stuff in Canvas
heycam: I think he wants to make sure that path or matrix work well or at least similar as the SVG one
shepazu: hixie asked SVG WG to
review it before he lands stuff
... but now he published it
... I think we should review what is there and send coments
shepazu: I suggest to mail the comments to the canvas mailing list, svg mailing list and hixie
<TabAtkins> Yes, please. "Publishing" does not in any way imply it's frozen (until implementations emerge).
The SVG stuff in Canvas so far: http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/the-canvas-element.html#path-objects
shepazu: SVG WG should be involved in how SVG error handling works
heycam: I will review it
shepazu: thats enought for
... can we start with these topics on next meeting minutes?
shepazu: next f2f over emails and telcom times on next meeting
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.136 of Date: 2011/05/12 12:01:43 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/resolution: SVG 2 should specify when timeline starts. (maybe by a timeLine attribute)/resolution: SVG2 will support a means for having SMIL animations start before their time container has fully loaded/ Succeeded: s/yes, think so/yes, opera implements the <discard> element/ Succeeded: s/ti/it/ Succeeded: s/<discard> elements to discard/<discard> element to declaratively discard/ Succeeded: s/oper/Opera/ Found ScribeNick: krit Inferring Scribes: krit WARNING: No "Present: ... " found! Possibly Present: Doug_Schepers IPcaller P0 P5 TabAtkins Tav cyril ed heycam joined krit nikos scribeNick shepazu svg trackbot You can indicate people for the Present list like this: <dbooth> Present: dbooth jonathan mary <dbooth> Present+ amy Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2012JanMar/0185.html Found Date: 29 Mar 2012 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2012/03/29-svg-minutes.html People with action items: WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]