Home Networking Task Force Teleconference -- 24 May 2011

<giuseppep> francois are you online?

<giuseppep> actions?

<giuseppep> issues?

<francois> Hi giuseppe, playing with RRSAgent? ;)

<trackbot> Date: 24 May 2011

<scribe> scribe: Kaz

<scribe> scribenick: kaz

<giuseppep> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Agenda_Telco_24th_May_2011

requirements document

giuseppep: how to structure?
... one proposal is from Jan
... Jean-Claude provided high-level ones
... while Russel gave rather specific ones

igarashi: agree with Jan
... details and high-level topics should be discussed separately

giugeppep: tx

Matt: use cases I proposed is application level

<giuseppep> ack

fd: adding actual scenario would be useful

<rberkoff> cant dial-in???

giuseppep: would be useful to better understanding

<rberkoff> no conf code was posted?

giuseppep: let's continue

giuseppe: (to Russel)
... we'll separate the use case document into two parts, generic part and specific part

definition section

giuseppep: people have different image for some terms
... is our description generic enough?
... opinion?

Clarke: application is a good term
... another for home network would be service

giuseppep: HTML5 type of definition of "document" might be confusing
... we could use "web application" as a term
... we need to clarify what "application" means

clarke: can try

fd: we prefer to use "application"
... rather than "document"
... I personally prefer "web application"
... if we use the same definition (as HTML5), it would be easy to map our use cases to HTML5

giuseppep: would suggest your definition to the ML and share your ideas with everybody

[ +1 w/ giuseppep ]

open actions

<giuseppep> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/products/2

<giuseppep> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Home_Network_TF_Discussions/ServiceMigration

<giuseppep> issue-7?

<trackbot> ISSUE-7 -- Use case: Service Migration -- open

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/7

giuseppep: Jean-Claude's use case
... "document" could describe "application"

<inserted> giuseppep: this originally included two pieces, and another part is issue-15

<giuseppep> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Home_Network_TF_Discussions/DocumentMigration

issue-15?

<trackbot> ISSUE-15 -- Document Migration -- raised

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/15

kaz: regarding issue-7, the description is confusing
... "music" is rather capability/feature
... "device" should be Audio, TV, music player, computer, etc.

giuseppep: agree the description is confusing

jan: two questions
... 1 is example implementations
... 2 is that this is similar to multi-screen use case

giuseppep: that's something "document migration" use case would capture

russell: same concern as Kaz
... device capability like camera, etc. is captured by this "service migration"?
... how is application captured?

giuseppep: "how" is not yet discussed

russell: services use documents

giuseppep: if your application use audio on some device which doesn't have audio capability, it doesn't work
... I proposed to JCD to rephrase the description

MattH: concrete scenario would be useful to me

<dcorvoysier> The way it is described, the web page itself seems to be transferred from one device to the other ...

[ yeah... ]

giuseppep: talking with radio could be one use case scenario

<francois> [ The definition of "application state" looks very application specific and difficult to generalize. ]

igarashi: relationship between 7 and 15
... now got it
... second question is that this is not migration, but just using multiple devices

giuseppep: "widget running on some device and an application on another device" might be what JCD is thinking

<inserted> ... how do you move state from device to device?

<Clarke> Migration seems to be service delivery with "multiple devices" with state

<Clarke> With a video, for example, you could retain the playback position

<giuseppep> ISSUE-16?

<trackbot> ISSUE-16 -- Web and Device Interworking -- raised

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/16

jan: (explains the use case)

[[

A personal device list available in the home is invoked on any web page and devices in the list can be used for consuming the contents on a web page, e.g. video clip on a page can be redirected to a TV or recorded on a network attached storage.

]]

<Zakim> kaz, you wanted to suggest "state transition from one device to another"

jan: you can see some example JavaScript scripts
... comments welcome

giuseppep: any comments?

-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-and-tv/2011May/0050.html Jan's message

giuseppep: people need some more time
... my comment is that more examples are needed

jan: ok

fd: difference between device and service?

giuseppep: some use case differentiate device and service

jan: different devices have different capability

fd: do you need list of devices?
... maybe we can say "this service and that service work on a device"

<mav_> that was clarke

clarke: don't think PCs care about "what capability is working on which device" but devices themselves do care
... "service" is more appropriate to "devices"

<francois> [yes, we could use both "device" and "service" in the use cases]

clarke: not sure we have to have one specific word
... a "device" contains something

<igarashi> +q

giuseppep: UPnP like definition?
... use cases from user perspective

MattH: user centric view vs. device centric view

jan: how can we use the terms with technical consistency

giuseppep: I can provide some initial idea, and you can provide comments

igarashi: using "device" might be good
... but how to handle "service" on the Internet?

giuseppep: it's important to have terms list to share people's views
... we'll use same terminology once we've got consensus

<inserted> UPnP Home Network UA

<giuseppep> ISSUE-17?

<trackbot> ISSUE-17 -- Use Case: DLNA/UPnP Home Network Enabled User-Agent (Browser) -- raised

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/issues/17

giuseppep: more generic use case description would be better

russell: reference to specific technology?
... can remove DLNA/UPnP

giuseppep: this will go back to the previous discussion
... you need some generic framework to let devices interact with each other

russell: ok. will restructure the description

<igarashi> +q

giuseppep: we've decided we'll split the use case documents into generic part and specific part, so you can say "we'd support this specific service"

jan: several possible scenarios

giuseppep: we could include both (1) list of generic use cases and (2) list of specific use cases

<giuseppep> ?

<inserted> ... you can generate another use case if you need

jan: will restructure my use case

igarashi: use cases should be use specific
... detailed procedure on each use case would be helpful for people to understand

+q to suggest we have optional "concrete scenario" which includes detailed procedure on each use case description

jan: if we adapt a specific use case, which includes user process steps, it would be fine

<giuseppep> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF

jan: btw, could you please send the conf code publicly?

giuseppep: it's available on the Wiki page

<giuseppep> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/HNTF/Telco

jan: need info on IRC channel etc. as well

giuseppep: also available on the Wiki page

[ adjourned ]

- DRAFT -

Home Networking Task Force Teleconference

24 May 2011

Attendees

Contents

requirements document

definition section

open actions

Summary of Action Items

Scribe.perl diagnostic output