Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference -- 30 Jun 2010

<trackbot> Date: 30 June 2010

yes

<DKA> ScribeNick: caribou

<DKA> Scribe: Dan

<DKA> http://www.w3.org/2010/06/23-swxg-minutes.html

<DKA> RESOLUTION: Approve last week's minutes.

<bblfish> phew got it

<DKA> Agreed to meet again on the 7th.

<cperey> regrets, I will not be available 7, 14, 21 of july

Final Report Action Update

<mischat> grrr i can't dial into the UK bristol number ...

Action Items

<cperey> I've received feedback from Paul

<cperey> oops!

<cperey> I disconnected myself so Henry better go first

Dan: Gap analysis...

Henry: is there a detailed description of that?

<tinkster> mischat: Bristol and Nice numbers for Zakim haven't been working for a few weeks!

<mischat> thanks toby

Henry: I can make something up in this space
... is there a bit more details about what you mean?

<cperey> yes, several gaps

Dan: gaps where no standards exist yet

<cperey> that is the gap analysis which is most important

<cperey> there was also the task of identifying where there are standards but no agreement on which to use in which case

<rreck> me too

<rreck> are we meeting?

<DKA> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/UserStories

<DKA> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/OneLiners

<DKA> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/RequirementsAndUseCases

Henry: is there a method or procedure?

Christine: yes

<cperey> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/FinalReportElementsDiscussion

Christine: Dan has drafted an intro
... link your draft there, in part V.

<DKA> ACTION: Henry to take a stab at gap analysis and add to part V on the wiki link above. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/06/30-swxg-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-147 - Take a stab at gap analysis and add to part V on the wiki link above. [on Henry Story - due 2010-07-07].

??: we need a link to the map of technologies

<cperey> One could go through the inputs from all speakers (technology experts)

<danbri> ideally some kind of crafty visualisation needed... but quite hard!

Dan: gap between use cases and existing technologies

<bblfish> friend relations

<danbri> http://ostatus.org/ "OStatus lets people on different social networks follow each other. "

<bblfish> we came up with a ping protocol to make friends

<bblfish> let me find it

<danbri> ostatus = Activity Streams + PubSubHubbub + Salmon + Webfinger

<bblfish> http://esw.w3.org/Pingback

<cperey> Agreed

<cperey> perhaps we should go through the State of Social Web

<DKA> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/OneLiners

<DKA> ACTION: Dan to add material to report around OneLiners and Guest Speaker input. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/06/30-swxg-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Sorry, amibiguous username (more than one match) - Dan

<trackbot> Try using a different identifier, such as family name or username (eg. dappelqu, danbri)

Henry: we can find out if we missed use cases or technologies

<DKA> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/Business-considerations-section-draft

DKA: Business case. Christine?

Christine: in the wiki page

<cperey> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/Business-considerations-section-draft

<DKA> ACTION: Dan Appelquist to add material to report around OneLiners and Guest Speaker input. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/06/30-swxg-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Sorry, amibiguous username (more than one match) - Dan

<trackbot> Try using a different identifier, such as family name or username (eg. dappelqu, danbri)

<DKA> ACTION: Appelquist to add material to report around OneLiners and Guest Speaker input. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/06/30-swxg-minutes.html#action04]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-148 - Add material to report around OneLiners and Guest Speaker input. [on Daniel Appelquist - due 2010-07-07].

Christine: it covers the basis

DKA: complete?

<danbri> re " Observers have speculated that Facebook," ... is it possible to cite sources here?

<danbri> is it the same src as "Inside Facebook blog" cited for fig1?

Christine: suggests identity management services, content management services

<bblfish> are there any use cases for software providers?

<danbri> (thanks!)

Christine: things in the PDF not in wiki

<danbri> (no further comments from me right now)

http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/File:Chapter_VI_Business_Considerations.pdf

Christine: if we can't propose business opportunities, it will not be successful

<danbri> re Why matters? a few years ago MySpace was the giant. Then Orkut (from giant Google), who took over from Friendster, who grew big as SixDegrees.com faded into history. Just as in search, AltaVista once seemed unassailable. So assuming it is now Facebook forever isn't supported by history...

DKA: maybe we can get some people, e.g. FB to comment

Christine: if we don't have ability to maintain current business model, i.e. advertising, we need to combine with new ones

<danbri> re not preserving advertising ... danger of 'proving' (by analogy) that bittorrent could never exist, since the content businesses need advertising to survive

Christine: so identity management, profile management services....

<bblfish> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=994DvSJZyww&feature=channel

Christine: we can probably ask someone from FB to read the document and comment

Henry: Metcalfe's law shows the value of a network
... you can calculate the value

Christine: I don't think all have a convertible value

<danbri> (are nodes people, or accounts?)

Henry: look at the big players and take their yearly budget
... add up together

<danbri> bblfish, http://www.wheredoesmymoneygo.org/dashboard/#/uk-bubble-chart/focus=02-02.1&year=2010-11 :)

Christine: I won't be doing that.

<Zakim> danbri, you wanted to note that some businesses *will* fail, in part due to new tech landscape

danbri: the tech landscape is moving very quickly
... nobody knows in advance
... the current businesses need Ads to continue
... if you look at the content industry, it's possible that decentralized system will cut down existing systems

<bblfish1> hi

christine: existing businesses can be damaged by social web?

<bblfish1> connection broke

<MacTed> seems not so much *businesses* but *business models*

danbri: yes. If there's success for OpenSocial, e.g., it could damage existing SN

<bblfish1> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metcalfe's_law

<danbri> for the various scenarios, q of what costs need covering

Henry: look at what's missing and you see the opportunities

<rreck> i agree social networking software to companies

Henry: e.g. selling SN software/maintainance to companies
... specific tools

<rreck> a SN oriented at trust/veracity

Henry: with lots of privacy rules
... it would be a big new opportunity. It's not just advertising

Christine: this paper focusses on consumer market, not enterprise

Henry: there are other markets

<rreck> research is a good one

<danbri> statusnet (evan p, one of our guests) are very much in area of corporate social networks

DKA: will take an action to balance that

danbri: anybody attending ???

DKA: may go

<bblfish1> so other markets: health care (doctor and patiens and hostpitals, etc..), research, business to buisness to customer, defense, law, … each of these are social networks that need to be open to other players - I think we also spoke of managment of catastrophes during the initial meeting.

<rreck> i would help reading/editing content if that helps, someone email me rreck@rrecktek.com

Christine: we could work on the section that Harry put together

<cperey> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/StateOfSocialWeb

<rreck> phone dying

<danbri> (sorry had to drop; the ostatus etc meeting looks very interesting, i'll try to make some technical submission to it remotely)

<rreck> thanks for all your efforts cperey

christine: I think Privacy should not be the key functionality of new social web
... would rather point to data portability
... look back at my paper

<cperey> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/SocialWebFrameworks2#Social_Graph_Management_Today

DKA: agree that privacy should not be the first thing

[probably not the first priority for businesses, but what about the users?]

DKA: go ahead and edit

<mischat> :)

<bblfish1> yes

<bblfish> data ownership is also wrong

<mischat> :)

<bblfish> control is more correct

<danbri> all these services have APIs lately; being able to get at the data is easy

<danbri> yes, it's about control

<bblfish> you can't own data

<bblfish> really

<danbri> which takes us towards dns imho, as profiles are tied to uris are tied to dns, typically

<DKA> Who can take an action to help flesh out http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/StateOfSocialWeb

<DKA> mischat?

EU directives use the terms data suject and data controller

<bblfish> I think speech act theory is the place to look

<mischat> DKA, I can, have been writing stuff in that space anyways

<mischat> can spend a day on it before next meeting

<mischat> am guessing this doc : http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/StateOfSocialWeb

<DKA> ACTION: mischa to add some material to http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/StateOfSocialWeb [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/06/30-swxg-minutes.html#action05]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-149 - Add some material to http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/StateOfSocialWeb [on Mischa Tuffield - due 2010-07-07].

<mischat> DKA, come on 5 more ;)

<mischat> ok

<bblfish> did you add a action for me?

<bblfish> well no

<bblfish> bye

<scribe> Scribe: carine

<mischat> DKA: am messing around with onesocialweb at the moment

- DRAFT -

Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference
30 Jun 2010

Attendees

Contents

Final Report Action Update

Action Items

Summary of Action Items

Scribe.perl diagnostic output

- DRAFT -

Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference 30 Jun 2010

Attendees

Contents

Final Report Action Update

Action Items

Summary of Action Items

Scribe.perl diagnostic output

Social Web Incubator Group Teleconference
30 Jun 2010