josema: john and kevin will try to join later

Convene, agenda adjustments

josema: I will be chairing
... any additions to agenda ?
... [goes through the agenda]

Introductions - new people onboard?

josema: is this Tom's first call ?

<Tom> no it isn't

F2F Meeting debrief

<josema> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-egov-ig/2008Oct/0069

<Tom> unfortunately I couldn't be present in the F2F meeting, sorry for that...

josema: message sent to the list with minutes
... very broad, F2F big success because we finally scope it
... 12 areas identified where the group will work

josema: most of the topics on the first day was scoping the work
... next day was review in detail the more complicated issues and assign people to specific areas
... eGov must act as a channel between governments and other W3C groups
... if we hear of anything a gov needs, go and inform a group, conversely, see what W3C has to offer and tell this to govs

martin: we narrowed down the issues to detailled subjects upon whch we can start working upon
... will link to my document
... issue of authentification shared by many governments
... each provider offers its own authentication method
... main problem is getting a proper ID to each citizen
... and prevent identity fraud

<Tom> main problem seems to be conflict of interest between vendors. a semantic and technical interoperability solution should solve this

Review of the Topic Areas

<martin> http://www.forumstandaardisatie.nl/fileadmin/OVOS/Exploring_authentication__EN.pdf

<josema> topic areas

josema: check is something is missing from topic areas
... I found one missing over the WE
... "Multi-channel delivery"
... there already are volunteers to work on some topic areas
... others not present can also contribute
... go through all the topics ?

<Tom> why not

<Rachel> yes please

1. Semantic Interoperability

<martin> info on http://www.semic.eu/semic/

josema: semic: european repository of interoperability assets (XML schemas)
... used by governments in Europe
... make assets reusable by others

<Tom> that doesn't sound like semantic interoperability to me but rather sharing data structure

josema: it is difficult to involve semic.eu in the WG
... it is not possible for them to join W3C
... have them as invited experts ?
... they should bring semantic interoperability to the group.

martin: tom points out this is not semantic interoperability
... its supposed to become a base to semantic interoperability
... the project started as an XML clearing house
... the idea is now to collect assets and reuse them (or their methodology)

Tom: there are more interesting things going on in the legal field
... criminal records for instance
... it is important to go beyond structural information

martin: legal aspects are part of semic

tom: not noticeable in the member states
... look at the eJustice field
... criminal records are supported by european directives member states must exchange criminal record
... there is a need of exchanging the semantic of the criminal records, not just the structure
... can not be understood just by looking at the terms
... we must achieve compatibility with these records

josema: find people working on this and provide more information, build a use case around this example
... add it into our document as an example of things going on

tom: 2 important conferences on this issue, one tomorrow in Florence

<Tom> http://www.ittig.cnr.it/LawViaTheInternet/

<Tom> http://www.ictparliament.org/index.php?option=com_search&searchword=wor

<Owen> In the U.S. government the sharing of law enforcement/first responder data is a major thrust, through the National Information Exchange Model (NIEM): http://www.niem.gov/

2. Persistent URIs

josema: personnal experience: seems too technical for governments

<John> This is a topic very close to my heart - and an important one for the group - also for the W3C

josema: the W3C must speak in better terms to governments
... this about once something goes on the web it must be archived forever
... ie, internet archive
... John volunteered on this topic

3. Performance Data + Citizen Choice

josema: no one volunteered at F2F
... we had a long discussion, but we were not sure we were scoping the topic area enough
... we discussed some example, health in the UK

<Tom> also important for law cases (just had to release criminals since the original material could not be reproduced in appeal)

<Owen> US GPO's summary of results of its beta test of Handles is available at http://www.fdlp.gov/handles/index.html

josema: publishing gov information in a way the consumers can get it and use it in the way they want

<Tom> My remark refers to preservation of digital data.

josema: this can take place outside gov web sites

oscar: what is the perception of the data provided by govs to the users
... ie, if you have a child and several schools they can attend, how is data made available?
... The data must be incorporated into decision making of citizens.
... Information is also shared in C2C (citizen 2 citizen) communities
... citizen must also be able to shared their experience so as to improve gov services

<Owen> An article on US LOC's use of PURLs is available at http://lawprofessors.typepad.com/law_librarian_blog/2008/10/lc-thomas-imple.html

oscar: users can also created their own performance data, use the information in a specific way.

4. Data Sharing Policy Expression

josema:we discussed an example of the UK Ornance Survey
... where license has to be attached to data

<martin> my mobile went down, need to find an adapter

josema: once data is available in an open format, it could be necessary to attach a policy (licence) to the data
... ie, citizens can use the information for free, but a company that will use it for commercial purposes then it needs to pay
... 1) how is data available
... 2) how to attach the policy
... 3) verify that the organizations using the data are following the policies

5. Digital Preservation + Authenticity + Temporal Degradation

josema:... persistent URIs, but not only
... provenance problem also
... we reviewed how the paper world and digital worlds compare
... another example is how to release information that was once classified after a period of time has gone by

<Owen> With reference to data sharing policy, the draft XSD for the US FEA DRM contains elements such as <AccessControlProtocol>, <AvailabilityLevel>, and <ConfidentialityLevel>. http://xml.gov/draft/drm20060105.xsd

josema: and authentify the fact that data was not altered

oscar: digital preservation concerns archives
... check what the current solutions are, in particular data signatures
... engage with W3C groups to see what is available concerning digital signatures

josema: it is the Nat archives core business

benjamin: use case proposed was copying encrypted document on a large P2P network
... how to guarantee integrity over time
... I might contribute in that aspect

<John> Yup!

<John> would be good to identify which W3C groups we should be talking to

josema: build agendas in future meetings with invited guests
... to interact with them, ie, XML data signatures

<John> that's a great idea

6. IPR Expression

josema: licence attached to the data itself as mentioned before is one example

<John> Are people familiar with ACAP: http://www.the-acap.org/

josema: martin mentionned the creative commons licence
... but this licence could be conflicting with the one used in the UK

<John> the licence and the technology (CC's use of RDFa) are very interesting

martin: yes, using creative commons restricts some rights granted with the licence used today
... this could be linked to the differences between common law and civil law

<kjetil> yeah, I can hear you

<kjetil> well, what I was going to say that what the license says and the technical aspects are different

<kjetil> so, the CC RDF/RDFa things could be used

<kjetil> even though one would need different URIs for the actual license permissions and restrictions

7. Identification + Authentication

martin: see the report that identifies some of the issues to be dealt with
... use this as a starting point

<josema> the report: http://www.forumstandaardisatie.nl/fileadmin/OVOS/Exploring_authentication__EN.pdf

martin: this is identified by the dutch gov as a serious problem

8. Data Aggregation

benjamin: data from different points of view, government, citizen
... how to get aggregated views of that data
... use case eVoting, statistics on specific information, eg: health

martin: also criminal records

benjamin: put there on temporal degradation

<Owen> Policy guidance for U.S. federal agencies on a common means of identification & authentication is provided at http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2004/08/20040827-8.html

9. Your Web Site is your API (eg. RDFa, sitemaps?)

benjamin: RDFa and sitemaps (XML schema used to make content easier to discover by search engines)

oscar: amount of data available in public organizations
... data is explosed in human readable format
... we want to promote the use of this information in machine readable format
... some experiences have already been done

martin: we are currently working in th NL on a search engine
... to verify that the information retrieved by citizen from a web site is correct
... [something about disclaimers on how information is retrieved on the internet]
... working on creating an RDF environment

10. What Data? How does the government decide?

<martin> A disclaimer on infomation found on government websites may in the future be legally binding

josema: 1) how does the gov decide what data should be made available
... in some countries like the US, there are laws in place stating this
... in other countries (eg. Spain) this does not exist
... 2) what's the best way to put the data out there
... need to convince some govs of the benefit it has of providing the data
... making a positive policy case to govs is difficult
... find examples of things working right now

<Tom> Also in the NL: except if security or other interests of the state are on stake. Of course data on individuals/businesses is not accessible either.

josema: DBPedia

owen: in the US, under the electronic freedom act amendment
... agencies must make available any record that are requested by one individual
... and of interest for at least 3 others
... agencies must make resonable efforts to share them in any format they are requested
... the application is clear: agencies must create and maintain a readily shareable format, such as XML
... if they do not do that they break the spirit of the law

josema: is the issue that they know how to publish in open formats but do not do it ?
... or that they do not know how to publish in open format

owen: several issues
... long in responding to requests, agencies claim they do not have the resources to make information available in a timely manner
... sometimes this is true due to security issues, in other cases, it is a design issu problem with their information systems

josema: propose some guidelines to them?

owen: they should start by publishing on their web site XML schemas for all their information collections
... so we can understand what data they have and build a registry bottom up
... once we have understood what information they have, we must then publish to what extent they are publishing said information
... and take actions if they are not offering enough information
... the data reference model is about sharing of data. I was a member of the WG that produced this model
... agencies must implement the DRM as XML Schema on their web sites
... but they pushed back against the use of this global schema
... they want to continue using their own formats

josema: can use this as a use case ?

owen: finalizing the DRM for XML schema would be an outstanding effort

<josema> ACTION owen to draft XML Schema for DRM as use case to use it for 10. What data?

<trackbot> Created ACTION-33 - Draft XML Schema for DRM as use case to use it for 10. What data? [on Owen Ambur - due 2008-11-05].

11. Participation in Social Media; what are the rules?

josema: all sorts of social media one can think of, and how all this is evolving on the web, ie. twitter
... blogs, are posters representing their agencies or not
... citizens discussing many issues amongst themselves
... UK and NZ example: a policy for the public servants

<josema> W3C workshop: http://www.w3.org/2008/09/msnws/

josema: Karen Myers suggested the workshop above
... John will draft a position paper on social networking
... so the Group could show the workshop we are finding issues

12. Temporal Data (Legislation/Legal (Law Reports), Geospatial)

benjamin: what to do with evolution of data?
... if should be possible to refer to specific revisions of a document
... and how link to that in a consistent manner

Assign people (+use cases) to areas

josema: do this by email
... deadline: by mid november topic areas should be fixed
... and at least one use case per area
... not something too detailed for the moment

Next Meeting

josema: next meeting 12 nov
... at 13:00 UTC

[ADJOURNED]