SVG Working Group Teleconference -- 24 Aug 2008

<heycam> trackbot, start telcon

<trackbot> Date: 24 August 2008

<heycam> Meeting: SVG Working Group Nuremberg F2F Day 4

Test suite

<ed> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/track/products/4

<heycam> ScribeNick: heycam

<scribe> Scribe: Cameron

http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/Group/track/products/11

no, it's this: http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/Group/track/products/13

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/status/test_status12T.html

ED: i don't think we should work on the actions that say to create a new test
... we can't get through all of the test suite actions before we want to republish it
... one of the main things we need to do is approve tests we think are finished
... anthony has the list of unapproved tests, we'll go through them one by one

trackbot, close ACTION-2167

<trackbot> ACTION-2167 Ensure lacuna values are specifically mentioned for all default attribute values closed

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/animate-elem-204-t.svg

ED: we should just approve ones that are reviewed

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/animate-elem-220-t.svg

<ed> ED: this could be automated, by using javascript to do the spline/calcmode calculations and using getCurrentTime and the getPresentationTrait method(s) and comparing the two

<ed> ...would be much nicer because it could be quicker and not require someone looking at the test for a long time

<ed> ...let's leave this as unapproved for now

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/animate-elem-221-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/animate-elem-222-t

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/animate-elem-222-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/animate-elem-225-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/animate-elem-226-t.svg

<scribe> ACTION: Cameron to reinstate the qname type and make animation attributeName="" use that type in the schema and the spec [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/08/24-svg-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2170 - Reinstate the qname type and make animation attributeName=\"\" use that type in the schema and the spec [on Cameron McCormack - due 2008-08-31].

<anthony> approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/animate-elem-61-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/animate-elem-63-t.svg

unreviewed

trackbot, close ACTION-2126

<trackbot> ACTION-2126 Make the change proposed in Issue2016 closed

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/animate-elem-86-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/conf-reader-201-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/fonts-elem-201-t.svg

http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS2/fonts.html#value-def-generic-family

not approved for now

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/fonts-glyph-202-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/interact-focus-208-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/interact-focus-209-t.svg

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/interact-pevents-01-t.svg

interact-focus-209-t approved

<ed> interact-pevents-01-t.svg should replace usage of on-attributes with xml-event handlers and also add pointer-events=boundingbox to the test

<ed> it's not a correct 1.2T test at the moment

<ed> ACTION: ed to fix the interact-pevents-01-t.svg test to replace usage of on-attributes with xml-event handlers and also add pointer-events=boundingbox to the test [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/08/24-svg-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2171 - Fix the interact-pevents-01-t.svg test to replace usage of on-attributes with xml-event handlers and also add pointer-events=boundingbox to the test [on Erik Dahlström - due 2008-08-31].

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/interact-pevents-03-t.svg

<ed> this is also using on-attributes

<ed> and letter-spacing

<ed> let's remove this test, and fix the interact-pevents-04-t.svg test because that's very similar

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/interact-pevents-04-t.svg

AG: can't fix the test to not use letter-spacing since <tspan>s can't have position attributes anyway in tiny

ED: we'll take out this test

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/linking-a-04-t.svg

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/linking-a-201-t.svg

<ed> linking-a-04-t.svg will be removed, replaced by linking-a-202-t.svg (same but removing the view element, and the middle subtest)

<ed> ACTION: ed to review linking-a-202-t.svg [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/08/24-svg-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2172 - Review linking-a-202-t.svg [on Erik Dahlström - due 2008-08-31].

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/linking-a-05-t.svg

<ed> ACTION: ed to review linking-a-203-t.svg [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/08/24-svg-minutes.html#action04]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2173 - Review linking-a-203-t.svg [on Erik Dahlström - due 2008-08-31].

<ed> linking-a-05-t.svg will be removed, replaced by linking-a-203-t.svg (same but removing the view element, and the middle subtest)

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/linking-a-201-t.svg

<anthony> approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/linking-uri-01-t.svg

<ed> ED: testing view elements specifically, not applicable to tiny - let's remove it

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/linking-uri-02-t.svg

<ed> ED: same as linking-uri-01-t, remove

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/media-audio-214-t.svg

<ed> approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/paint-stroke-203-t.svg

<ed> not approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/paint-stroke-206-t.svg

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/script-handler-201-t.svg

<anthony> paint-stroke-206.svg not approved

<ed> script-handler-201-t.svg not approved

ED: i'm not happy with approving this test, where it tests functions/this-values etc.
... i'm not sure this aligns properly with XML Events and other users of XML Events (xhtml, xhtml+voice)
... we should remove our requirements from the spec on this, too
... and leave it until Core

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/publish/script.html#HandlerElement

RESOLUTION: remove the spec text about binding 'this' in <handler>s, and check what to say about the event handler being like a Function object

<ed> ACTION: ed to remove the 'this' keyword binding in the 'handler' element, and investigate if the execution of the handler content is actually like a Function object or if the contents are put in the global scope [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/08/24-svg-minutes.html#action05]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2174 - Remove the 'this' keyword binding in the 'handler' element, and investigate if the execution of the handler content is actually like a Function object or if the contents are put in the global scope [on Erik Dahlström - due 2008-08-31].

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/script-listener-203-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/script-listener-204-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-class-201-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-common-201-t-debug.svg

<ed> ED: remove that, we have struct-common-201-t.svg (but fix it since it has an error with duplicate xml:id attributes)

<ed> AG: I committed the fix for the non-debug version

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-common-201-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-cond-204-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-cond-209-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-cond-210-t.svg

approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-discard-203-t.svg

<ed> ACTION: ed to figure out what's bork-bork-borken with the right red rect in struct-discard-203-t.svg [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/08/24-svg-minutes.html#action06]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2175 - Figure out what's bork-bork-borken with the right red rect in struct-discard-203-t.svg [on Erik Dahlström - due 2008-08-31].

<ed> ED: not approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-svg-204-t.svg

<ed> ED: was "in error" before

<ed> CM: changed that to unsupported, so the test should be changed

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-svg-205-t.svg

<ed> ED: remove this test

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-use-06-t.svg

<ed> changed to be using green rects, and remove style attributes

ED: we'll remove struct-use-06 and replace it with a fixed up one in the 2** series

AG: found that struct-use-05 was not a tiny test for various reasons, and is now fixed up and called struct-use-207-t

<ed> struct-use-06-t is now struct-use-206-t

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-use-07-t.svg

<ed> remove style attributes, remove widht and height on the use element

<ed> remove test and replace it with a fixedup struct-use-208-t

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-use-208-t.svg

<ed> approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-use-08-t.svg

<ed> uses width and height on the use element, lacks pass criteria

<ed> remove struct-use-08-t.svg, replace it with struct-use-209-t.svg

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-use-209-t.svg

<ed> the resource still uses width and height on 'use'

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-use-209-t.svg

<ed> sorry, http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/images/struct-use-209-t-cycles.svg

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/styling-inherit-02-t.svg

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/struct-use-209-t.svg was approved

<anthony> styling-inherit-02 was already approved

<anthony> but wasn't accepted

<anthony> watermark was commented out as well

<anthony> so we should just change it to accepted

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/text-align-203-t.svg

<ed> trying to test tspans with different text-anchor values, but that's only useful when there's x and y on tspan

<ed> so let's remove the test, since it's already covered by text-align-01-t.svg anyway

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/text-area-202-t.svg

<ed> pass criteria?

<anthony> tests that http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/text-area-208-t.svg

<ed> AE will work on adding pass criteria to text-area-202-t, let's come back to it later

<ed> same as text-area-202, needs clear pass criteria

<ed> AE: uses percentage font-sizes

<ed> ...actually that was changed, so it's not anymore

<ed> approved after the pass criteria were clarified

trackbot, close ACTION-2160

<trackbot> ACTION-2160 Make the publication script be able to generate a single page version closed

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/text-area-211-t.svg

<ed> AE: finished the pass criteria on text-area-202-t.svg, marking as accepted

<ed> ED: text-area-211 also needs clear pass criteria

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/text-area-212-t.svg

<ed> AE: will do pass criteria for 211 and 212

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/text-area-223-t.svg

<ed> trackbot, close ACTION-2169

<trackbot> ACTION-2169 Take out current element traversal interface and a reference to the Element Traversal spec closed

<ed> 223 is going to be unapproved still, let's revisit it for core (ISSUE-2041)

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/text-fonts-203-t.svg

<ed> leave it for now, needs to have the svgfont to be correct

<ed> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/text-area-211-t.svg

<ed> AE: [reads new pass criteria]

<ed> ok, let's approve it

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/text-intro-06-t.svg

<ed> approved

<anthony> http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/udom-conform-201-t.svg

<ed> approved

<anthony> scribe: anthony

<scribe> scribeNick: anthony

Connection API

DS: We've communicated Ikivo and they've not shown strong support
... in the connection interface
... Given that there are alternatives with XHR and possible with HTML connection interface
... in the future

ED: And GetURL and PostURL

DS: And given the review comments we got
... even though it's implemented we think it's best to drop the connection interface

ED: It's not implemented widely

DS: But it's still implemented

AE: We've got an implementation but we understand for logistical reasons
... that we are ok with it being taken out

ED: You could get away with an implementation with raising exceptions
... it'd be silly

AE: We did talk about it being optional
... but we'd still have full QA for it

DS: And we don't want to have optional features

RESOLUTION: We will drop the Connection Interface

CM: Binary to String and String to Binary are useless with out connection
... too bad I wrote those tests

ED: We can drop, Connection Event
... and bits in the table in the interaction chapter
... should we remove global exception?
... would be good if we can decide what exception to use for denied error in timer

CM: I think we can get rid of that exception all together

RESOLUTION: We will drop Binary to String and String to Binary, Create Connection, Global Exception and the Exception on Create Timer

AE: JSR doesn't reference Global

ED: What about when we go to Core?

CM: If it's Object then you'd to cast it

ED: We could name what we have to something else

CM: Given that they don't implement it in Java
... I don't know if it's a binary incompatible change, not sure what the rules are

ED: If we named Global to an empty Window

DS: We can say plug Window in here

CM: So maybe we can try that

DS: Would it be a big change?

ED: Well no
... there's not much there

CM: I think it makes it more palatable so we can hook into the interface later

ED: I'm wondering if we can get away with an abstract view

CM: We could subset abstract view
... and take nothing out from it

ED: This looks like a big action

<shepazu> Zakim: remind me in 3 hours to oastarstarl

AE: That means we'd have to reference another spec
... I guess I don't understand what you're going to replace it with

<ed> http://www.w3.org/TR/DOM-Level-2-Views/views.html

<ed> it's a Recommendation

RESOLUTION: We will replace Global with Abstract View

<scribe> ACTION: Cameron to replace Global with Abstract View and add the reference [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/08/24-svg-minutes.html#action07]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2176 - Replace Global with Abstract View and add the reference [on Cameron McCormack - due 2008-08-31].

<scribe> ACTION: Erik to Binary to Drop the connection interface [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/08/24-svg-minutes.html#action08]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2177 - Binary to Drop the connection interface [on Erik Dahlström - due 2008-08-31].

Test Suite Review

DS: If it turns out that there is more interest in connection than we thought
... we could always make a module

ED: Yes that should be something outside of the SVG WG

http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/udom-dom-204-t.svg

DS: Yes there is the Network spec in Web Apps

ED: The last one is using Parse XML

Static Attribute

<heycam> http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/WD-SVG12-20041027/painting.html#static-property

DS: Looks like it wouldn't take much time to put in

ED: I don't think true and false are good values

AG: I don't think they are good either

CM: What about a different property name?
... buffer?

AE: Cache?
... we liked Static
... because it tells you what it's doing
... What about values Enable, Disable, Auto?

ED: We have shape rendering, image rendering
... can we add this to one of the already existing properties

DS: What about "rendering"
... with "static", "dynamic" and "auto"
... what about cached rendering?

AE: buffer-intent? cache-intent?

CM: I wouldn't mind buffered-rendering
... you're hinting for the speed

RESOLUTION: We will add buffered-rendering with values dynamic, static and auto

<scribe> ACTION: Emmons to Add buffered-rendering to the specification and create a test [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/08/24-svg-minutes.html#action09]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2178 - Add buffered-rendering to the specification and create a test [on Andrew Emmons - due 2008-08-31].

Test Suite Review

http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/udom-dom-204-t.svg

<ed> approved

http://dev.w3.org/SVG/profiles/1.2T/test/svg/udom-dom-205-t.svg

Timer Interface

CM: I'd like to move timer from the Global module to the SVG module
... the only thing in the Global Module is the timer interface
... I'd prefer to put it in SVG Module because it's the only way to create a timer is the SVG Global interface
... which is also in the SVG Module
... I think we have less of a right to create things in the DOM Module

RESOLUTION: We will move timer from Global to the SVG Module and remove the Global Module

<scribe> ACTION: Cameron to Move timer from Global to the SVG Module and remove the Global Module [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/08/24-svg-minutes.html#action10]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-2179 - Move timer from Global to the SVG Module and remove the Global Module [on Cameron McCormack - due 2008-08-31].