Meeting minutes
<JJ> Recap: w3c/
Underlying Layer
<JJ> Proposal: w3c/
<Zakim> quintinb, you wanted to say that we should mention thewre will be a cross platform definition
Joe_Humbert What is menat by the "... touch input and sensor data" part (not all captured
)
<shoobe01> Add to first sentence "...to enable functionality of higher layers" ???
<shoobe01> Or a new intro sentence to it all that explains the layer concept fully.
@Tanya - difficult to answer - I'm trying to classify the definitions for identifying the different responsibilities. Where do we draw the line? The reason to include it would be to makle the division of responsibilities clear, to avoid people saying that they are not responsible for "lower level" layers.
Joe_Humbert can we keep the first sentence and remove the second one
Joe_Humbert I think it's defining the layers in the note. It's referring to specific layers. I don't understand the deifference between platform software and operating system
<JJ> Poll: create definition for (Underlying) Layer referencing low-level input methods?
<Joe_Humbert> -1
<tayef> 0
<quintinb> -1
<rachaely> 0
<Tanya> -1
<shoobe01> +1
Tanya We can use the underlying layer in making a diagram of how we see things working together to separate and show interconnected layers, but include it as a separate definition will make it too complex
Joe_Humbert mayber it would be easier to re-write the note- is it the same note? Can we not just remove the term underlying layer. I think UL just tries to separate other layers from the system. We need to show what we mean by different layers
quintinb agrees with Joe_Humbert and Tanya
<JJ> Poll: clarify notes that reference "underlying layer" and create diagram to visualize layers in mobile environments?
<Joe_Humbert> +1
<quintinb> +1
<Tanya> +1
<RobW> +1
<tayef> +1
Joe_Humbert we need to run it by someone who knows this
Joe_Humbert I got you fam, I did AOSP
<Joe_Humbert> thanks quintinb
<shoobe01> 0
<rachaely> +1
(Compiled my own custom Android devices, professionally even)
Platform software
Joe_Humbert I think the first sentence in there is overly complicate and needs simplification. I'm not sure the amount of detail is required. It could be more general. Like the previous definition, there is actual some control that many layers have. Refer to the fact that harware is in control and provides services to other software
Tanya I think that Joe_Humbert's suggestion to simplifiy is good. The most important goal is to make it clear that platform software is something that cannot be changed* (quintin recommends OEM) - but if we include good examples of simplified definitions without the second sentence it may work better. We want to be clear what the platform software
is related to. For example Google's Material components are not platform software.
Joe_Humbert I don't like the terms "underlying software"
maybe firmware?
Tanya what they may mean is (ref: user agent) if we say web views are user agents, then the user agent will probably be running on the platform software running on hardware
Joe_Humbert Then what do we mean platform software running on underlying software - are they separate or not
<pauljadam> maybe platform software could be something like when you use Apple Pay and the software pops up to do that on your iPhone
Please double check - I'm typing "platform software" and by that time some says "underlying software" and then I get worried I'm messing it up
shoobe01 - aside from the s/h/ware layer being separate. The day to day computers are running on virtual machines.
<shoobe01> Correction to notes: "The day to day mobile software development environments are running on virtual machines, that emulate a hardware phone."
Joe_Humbert I thought the virtualisation can be said differently. I'm recommending making it simple. The biggest thing that throws me off is that platform s/ware refers to browsers for me, which is a user agent. I think platform software is operating systems. But web browsers and plugins are something else - maybe not user agents but not platform
software
<pauljadam> yeah like the Chrome app on iOS is not platform software right, it's an App that is also a user agent
RobW I would offer my thoughts: I don't think my understanding is correct, but how I do it - the user agent is part of the browser responsible for downloading and fetching content. If you download Chrome, that is software with a user agent, but Edge is platform software with a user agent. Safari on ios is... uh I got lost
scribe outofmemoryexception
<JJ> Poll: clarify Platform Software definition with notes and examples, keep definition as in WCAG2ICT?
<Joe_Humbert> -1
<quintinb> -1
<shoobe01> -1
<Tanya> -1
trying to scribe this has proved how confusing all this is
<tayef> 0
<rachaely> 0
<RobW> 0
<JJ> Conclusion: definition does need to be clarified
shoobe01 this seems a lot of this would be solved by the previous discussion. Let's define it more clearly. Or am I on the wrong page
<quintinb> +1 shoobe01
shoobe01 we need to simplyfiy the model for clarifying the layers which become the definitions, so we can say " these are UA's" - we are getting lost between responsibilities
User agent
<JJ> Poll: Use User Agent definition from WCAG to keep it only applicable to web content?
<rachaely> 0
<shoobe01> 0
<Joe_Humbert> My opinion: platform software = OSes, User agent = renders web content. Web browsers = non-platform software that use user agents
<Joe_Humbert> +1
<tayef> 0
0
<RobW> +1
Tanya Maybe there are some volenteers to try make some architectural diagrams
<Tanya> +1
Tanya I'll try - I just need something in writing to remind me what I'm diagramming
ACTION: quintinb and RobW will take a first attempt at diagram