Meeting minutes
<Detlev> regrets, down with a vius
get well soon Detlev
Drafts for 2.4.4, 2.4.6 and 2.5.3
<Detlev> thanks!
<Joe_Humbert> w3c/
Joe_Humbert summarises w3c/
No input needed unless you want more edits - issue will be closed soon
Nothing from me
<pauljadam> Apple says this about Voice Control:
<pauljadam> Match Voice Control labels to the visible text. If the Voice Control label is different from the visible text in your app (for example, “Leave call” instead of “End call”), users may be confused.
pauljadam also mentions Apple's "Nutritional labels" - they also don't mention using just using the first word. How much of the string is required is not exactly clear
pauljadam There are a lot of inconsitency in what should be in the label. We need to be cautious around what the normative wording that we don't contradict.
rachaely What about the existing note in WCAG where the label is in the front of the name. We need to keep that somewhere
<pauljadam> Should there be a note to say something about that Best practice being I'm important for Voice Control so they see the first word of the visible label text shown as the Name of the control when they do the Show Names command?
Jamie I appreciate the suggested change to the note, but I feel like it can be very confusing. For us to add on extra stuff we need to define what we mean as we add to confusion. We're not overwhelming people when they try to understand what we've said.
<pauljadam> All text shown on the focussed control = the label text so all that text must be contained in the accessible name.
Jamie we need to change the phasing
<pauljadam> There's no difference between primary visible label and presented text
<pauljadam> Also no definition of "primary visible label" and "presented text"
<Jamie> ^
<Jamie> change the *phrasing
pauljadam what is a "primary visible label" - is there a secondary visible label?
ACTION: Joe_Humbert to add some notes and Jamie to contribute to improving the wording on 2.5.3
<Jamie> thanks quintinb keeping me accountable
2.4.5 Multiple Ways
How many ways have we discussed this Joe_Humbert?
<Jamie> haha
301549!
<pauljadam> Basically an app needs a navigation to all pages and a search? and that would meet it? What else might meet it?
<pauljadam> Or they could have an index with links to all pages and then pages could have some links to navigate to related pages?
pauljadam what's the easiest way for apps to do this? Search? Map? Related?
<jamie1> present_
<pauljadam> Set of Pages is fine :)
<pauljadam> Set of Software does not make sense to me :)
jamie1 "if one of these was present then" type statements might help.
Set of View Fragments?
<pauljadam> A page within a set of Pages.
<Joe_Humbert> w3c/
<pauljadam> Tab bars don't always have a tab for every page in the app.
jamie1 not every set of content may be accessibile to everyone in every way - I feel like we can say that when an app has a search feature, this applies, and what's applicable in that context. When something exists, there is some feature that should exist as part of it. We need to give limited use cases that do apply in an effort to provide
guidance
<Zakim> julianmka, you wanted to raise the topic of chatbots / AI assistants
julianmka Surfacing functionality through chatbots / assistance via a proprietry service in an app.
julianmka calling out automation / assistants vs traditional FAQ should be helpful
I agree julianmka - just because you forced your square AI through a square hole of usability does not a solution make
I mean round hole
hdv I haven't seen anything around that in EN
Jamie I'm wondering for exceptions - trying to think about other places in WCAG when exceptions or specific applications happen - is it normative or in a note?
Is that part of "How to meet?" which is informative
ACTION: @Jamie to add a note
With reference to the right term for an interactive "thing"
We seem to be tending towards "Page"
2.4.7 Focus Visible
<Joe_Humbert> w3c/
<Joe_Humbert> close the queue
We need to be clear that platforms may provide certain visible focus elements via the platform itself, but we need to be cautious re: x platform that we're no so lenient that that becomes an excuse
<Joe_Humbert> rssagent, make minutes