Meeting minutes
<Joe_Humbert> Zakim agenda?
Draft Group Note update
julianmka: Summarized last week's small group meeting about moving the draft forward and showed Github Projects.
Joe_Humbert: Summarized recent changes to the working draft.
… If we want to publish formally in 2025, we should have the bulk of our work done by October.
Jon_Gibbins: At the small group, we also reviewed the Work Statement of this group. We are also reviewing that to show make sure the phases and timelines work for us going forward.
Link to Github Project: https://
ACTION: Ask JJ review whether TF members are properly connected to Github
julianmka: Showed Github Project and asked for volunteers to take on cards.
Conferences update
<Jon_Gibbins> There you go
<Jon_Gibbins> Sounds good. I did mentioned the work MATF is doing at a recent talk about the European Accessibility Act. It would be good to keep the group on the same page about what we can talk about and when, which I guess will come naturally / from the work statement.
julianmka: Summarized conversations about conferences & socializing WCAG2Mobile and demoed the Discussions feature in Github.
<Jon_Gibbins> Agreed
Joe_Humbert: Would be helpful to focus on the revision of the Work Statement.
<Jon_Gibbins> e.g. WCAG2ICT work statement is public
<Jon_Gibbins> https://
<Jon_Gibbins> This is ours currently
<Jon_Gibbins> https://
<Jon_Gibbins> (which is oooold)
Updated draft of Work Statement: https://
ACTION: Add agenda item for the Work Statement in the new year.
1.4.11 Non-text Contrast
<Joe_Humbert> w3c/
Joe_Humbert: Summarizes previous discussion on 1.4.11.
Joe_Humbert: Should we address Dark Mode as a separate item or as part of each relevant SC?
Illai: Include it in system settings.
Mick: Agree that we should call it out in system settings guidance but also on relevant SCs.
Joe_Humbert: Highlights conversation about the meaning of "user agent" in the native context (w3c/
<Mick> w3c/
Joe_Humbert: The definition of "user interface component" changed in a recent update to WCAG 2.2; we should find out what changed.
… after looking, perhaps there wasn't a change. We can't find a difference between 2.1 and 2.2 definitions.
Mick: Re: contrast on keyboard focus, we don't test for that internally due to complexity and difficulty.
… I don't think Deque does, either.
Jamie: Users can change the default keyboard focus indicator color, thickness, and other features in iOS. Android users don't have that option unless they're also using TalkBack with the external keyboard.
Joe_Humbert: For Android, that's not changing the keyboard focus but screen reader focus style.
Joe_Humbert: Speaking to Android keyboard focus, I know of an issue that was filed where Google closed it as won't fix.
Illai: We are covering focus indicators which isn't related to non-text contrast. Other SCs cover that.
<Mick> Deque testing methodology also don't test for visible focus color changes - although they focus their testing around switch control and state focus indicator that cannot be overridden (for iOS and Android).
julianmka: Seems to be agreement that this SC applies to native mobile, what would we need to address in notes as caveats?
Jon_Gibbins: Non-text contrast applies to keyboard at AA because Focus Appearance is AAA. While other SCs also relate to keyboard accessibility, Focus Appearance is separate from contrast requirements. Focus Appearance is more about how easily discernable focus style is.
… In my view, this SC (1.4.11) requires a certain level of contrast for keyboard focus indicator
Jamie: Could we add a note about the user customizing the focus indicator, do we consider dark mode, and do we need to address hover/focus states?
<Jon_Gibbins> Thanks everyone
ACTION: Consider Dark Mode in the bigger note about respecting system settings.