Meeting minutes
Agenda Review
Action Items
<gb> Found actions in w3c/i18n-actions: #69, #68, #67, #66, #65, #64, #53, #47, #43, #35, #33, #18, #16, #12, #11, #8, #7, #4
<addison> #69
<gb> Action 69 ask PLH to add a WG feature to the gh bot (on aphillips) due 2024-01-25
<addison> close #69
<gb> Closed action #69
<addison> #68
<gb> Action 68 follow up with florian about testing with kindle (on aphillips) due 2024-01-25
<addison> #67
<gb> Action 67 add some comments to CSS #8511 (on r12a) due 2024-01-23
<addison> close #67
<gb> Closed action #67
<addison> #66
<gb> Action 66 fix base direction vs. paragraph direction in string-meta (on aphillips) due 2024-01-18
<addison> #65
<gb> Action 65 contact Daniel and check the Ethiopic word boundary situation (on r12a) due 2023-12-26
addison: we can discuss #66 if we have time today
<addison> #64
<gb> Action 64 Make list of HTML issues for February 22 call with WHATWG (on aphillips, xfq)
<addison> #53
<gb> Action 53 come up with a set of information CSS want the i18n group to provide support for generic font families (on frivoal, fantasai) due 2023-11-01
<addison> #47
<gb> Action 47 make the CSSWG aware of Warichu (on frivoal) due 2023-10-04
<addison> #43
<gb> Action 43 pull together the list of win/mac/etc apis for setting base direction and/or language (on aphillips) due 2023-09-18
<addison> #35
<gb> Action 35 make the edits of CSS #5478 (on fantasai) due 2023-08-30
<addison> #33
<gb> Action 33 Close issues marked `close?` or bring to WG for further review (on aphillips)
<addison> #18
<gb> Action 18 Have informal explanation sessions about counter style translations with csswg members (on frivoal, fantasai) due 18 Jul 2023
<addison> #16
<gb> Action 16 Keep track of line-breaking in Korean for i18n-discuss#11 (on aphillips) due 1 Jan 2024
<addison> #12
<gb> Action 12 Upgrade/edit the explainer to address issues raised by google (on aphillips) due 18 Jul 2023
<addison> #11
<gb> Action 11 Triage all css properties to determine which are logical, physical, or na by default (on frivoal) due 18 Jul 2023
<addison> #8
<gb> Action 8 Follow up on the status of Canvas and formatted text (on aphillips) due 18 Jul 2023
<addison> #7
<gb> Action 7 Remind shepherds to tend to their awaiting comment resolutions (Evergreen) (on aphillips, xfq, himorin, r12a, bert-github) due 18 Jul 2023
<addison> #4
<gb> Action 4 Work with respec and bikeshed to provide the character markup template as easy-to-use markup (on r12a) due 27 Jul 2023
Info Share
r12a: Sid might work on this in March
addison: I'm gonna have a MessageFormat open house
… on Feb 20
… I'll post the details
r12a: I have a request for Bert
… we can raise an issue on IRC and it will go to GitHub issue list
… add a comment to a GitHub issue
… for action 23, add blah blah blah comment
Bert: that is possible
<Bert> gb, help note
<gb> Bert, the command "note #nn: text" or
<gb> … "note yyy#nn: text" or "note xxx/yyy#nn: text" tells
<gb> … me to add some text to GitHub issue nn in repository xxx/yyy.
<gb> … The colon(:) is optional. If you omit xxx or xxx/yyy, I will
<gb> … find the repository in my list of repositories.
<gb> … You can also use a URL: "note https://
<gb> … See also "gb, help use" for creating a list of repositories.
<gb> … Aliases: comment, note.
<gb> … Example: note #71: This is related to #70.
Bert: you have to explicitly name the issue or the number that you want to add the comment
r12a: oh, so you can already do it
Bert: you can, yes
<Bert> gb, help?
<gb> Bert, I am a bot to look up and create GitHub issues and
<gb> … action items. I am an instance of GHURLBot 0.3.
<gb> … Try "gb, help commands" or
<gb> … see https://
RADAR Review
<addison> https://
addison: Bitstring Status List v1.0
… another VC spec
… unless anyone objects I'll take this one
Pending Issue Review
<addison> https://
<gb> Issue 1815 Discuss i18n-glossary and Infra harmonization (by aphillips) [pending] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG] [s:infra]
addison: I had to revert exporting UTF-8
… because exporting it reminded us of why we didn't have it exported before
… if conflicts with a definition in Encoding
… so I created an issue in our repo to check
… WHATWG people believe that Infra should be used by everyone
… as we've discussed previously, that turns out not to work
<addison> w3c/
<gb> Issue 1813 I18N Considerations needed? (by aphillips) [pending] [needs-resolution] [s:vc-bitstring-status-list]
addison: for some people
addison: about #1813, they have an I18N Considerations section
<gb> Issue 1813 [not found]
addison: which points to another I18N Considerations section
<addison> w3c/
<gb> Issue 1812 Encoding of `statusListIndex` (by aphillips) [pending] [s:vc-bitstring-status-list] [non-I18N]
addison: @@
… let's close this
addison: it's not really an i18n issue
… maybe a little bit
… "expressed as a string" should be encoded a bit more clearly
… In particular, is the number decimal or hex?
… it will be an i18n-tracker issue
Publish WD of timezone to TR
<addison> w3c/
<addison> https://
<addison> https://
<addison> https://
r12a: the www.org link used to always work for me on my Mac and it doesn't seem to be working anymore
addison: the note was published in 2011
… I'd like to obsolete the note and start having the ED to be the /TR version
r12a: we're not gonna create a new document altogether
addison: no
xfq: any particular update you'd like to do for the new version?
addison: Temporal hasn't landed at JS
… IETF sedate is still not quite landed
… so there's some time
… I'm not satisfied with all the text 100%
… nothing is sacred in this version yet, but I think it's complete enough that people could point back to it
… and we have issues with people like HTML
r12a: is there anything in the old version that hasn't migrated to the new version but should have done?
addison: everything in the old version is somewhere here
… maybe rewritten, but it's all here
r12a: there are a bunch of guidelines
… do we have all those still intact?
addison: they all fitted into mustard somewhere
addison: I can double check that
r12a: you probably need a 'History of this document' section as well
… to see what's changed
addison: OK
… Acknowledgements has a little bit of history
… I'll make another pass
… do you want to review it again?
JcK: I'll review it
… do you want me to just send you a note?
addison: yes, please
Prep for WHATWG Call
<addison> https://
<addison> w3c/i18n-activity#778
<gb> Issue 778 Validating internationalized mail addresses in (by himorin) [tracker] [s:html] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG]
<addison> w3c/i18n-activity#954
<gb> Issue 954 Fix #4562: add support for internationalized email addresses (by w3cbot) [tracker] [s:html] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG]
<addison> w3c/i18n-activity#955
<gb> Issue 955 Add &nnbsp; entity for U+202F (by w3cbot) [tracker] [s:html] [i:encoding] [spec-type-issue] [mlreq] [alreq] [hlreq] [amlreq] [afrlreq] [i:inline_features_punctuation] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG]
addison: #955 about adding new named entities to HTML
<gb> Issue 955 [not found]
addison: I want the EAI issue finished
… I believe we all think HTML wants to land is a string with an @ sign an possibly a dot
… maybe you're checking the right hand side for domain-ish
JcK: I would certainly rather have a relatively opaque syntax
<addison> w3c/i18n-activity#1575
<gb> Issue 1575 A tag to display date and/or time to the user in his preferred format. (by w3cbot) [tracker] [s:html] [t:loc_time] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG]
addison: #1575 is about displaying dates and times
<gb> Issue 1575 [not found]
addison: what I would like to see is that they provide the same kind of controls @@
… which is lang
… recreating that disaster is not something we would want to have happen
<addison> w3c/i18n-activity#1645
<gb> Issue 1645 : Time vs. duration (by w3cbot) [tracker] [s:html] [t:loc_time] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG]
addison: #1645 is sort of the same thing
<gb> Issue 1645 [not found]
addison: except that they want to allow people to enter durations
<addison> w3c/i18n-activity#1590
<gb> Issue 1590 For attributes which can contain a mix of languages, provide markup for language of parts (by w3cbot) [tracker] [s:html] [t:bidi_markup] [t:markup_elements_attributes] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG]
addison: @@hour cycle@@
addison: it's about providing markup and attributes for language
<addison> whatwg/
<gb> Issue 8280 For attributes which can contain a mix of languages, provide markup for language of parts (by ChasBelov) [i18n-tracker]
addison: what do we want to do here?
r12a: it's an issue
… the question is what the solution would be
… I can think of a couple of possibilities
… one is to allow more than one @@
… that's kind of complicated
… the other one would be to allow markup inside alt
… which is also probably not gonna fly
addison: solve corner cases
… because it's not very common that you need to have multiple alt
… @@2
… do we want to have a separate issue for that?
… separate issue for tagging attributes with a language
r12a: we actually solved the problem with XHTML 2
… but HTML5 doesn't have it
JcK: I remember discussion about a very similar set of issues
<addison> w3c/i18n-activity#1691
addison: we can discuss it with them
<gb> Issue 1691 "The directionality of an attribute of an HTML" seems weird? (by w3cbot) [tracker] [s:html] [t:bidi_markup] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG]
<addison> whatwg/
<gb> Issue 9146 "The directionality of an attribute of an HTML" seems weird? (by fantasai) [i18n-tracker]
addison: this one is from fantasai
… I haven't read it that deeply but it looks like something we might care about
<addison> w3c/i18n-activity#1697
<gb> Issue 1697 Specify expected behavior for when users change input field directionality (by w3cbot) [tracker] [s:html] [t:bidi_markup] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG]
addison: here's another one from last year
… which is about contenteditable
xfq: if the user changes the language of the input field, what will happen?
r12a: I don't think the issue is about input fields
… it's about how to control direction in elements that are set to contenteditable
<addison> w3c/i18n-activity#1743
<gb> Issue 1743 Disabled dates for input type=date (by w3cbot) [tracker] [s:html] [t:loc_time] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG]
r12a: the issue is about when you're typing text into contenteditable
… how do you manage direction then?
<addison> w3c/i18n-activity#1815
<gb> Issue 1815 Discuss i18n-glossary and Infra harmonization (by aphillips) [pending] [Agenda+I18N+WHATWG] [s:infra]
addison: I'll remind everyone that we have a TAG issue open
… because we recommend the polar opposite of what they do
… about UTF-16 code unit strings
… my recollection from the RDF conversation was they couldn't use Infra
… because thier definition is incompatible with things like XML
… so they don't want to take the definitions from Infra
… couple of challenges
… one is our glossary like all of our documents is not normative
… which is probably good, because we change it a lot
… but we do face things where people want to reference to our thing and it's not normative
… @@3
… I have nothing against Infra
… but I don't think it's complete for our needs
xfq: and sometimes our definition explains things more clearly
addison: we put a lot of effort in that
… we can discuss this with them in a phone call
… we have 66 issues against HTML
… i'm not tagging them all with agenda+
… we have only a vanishingly small number of needs-resolution issues and they're pretty old
… almost everything else is tracker
… and we might want to think about which of these we want to promote
AOB?
addison: anything else you guys want to do today?
[adjourned]