W3C

- DRAFT -

ACT Rules Community Group Teleconference

07 Dec 2023

Attendees

Present
dan_tripp, CarlosD, Jean-Yves, Todd_, Wilco, MarkRogers, MiriamF, giacomo-petri
Regrets
Chair
SV_MEETING_CHAIR
Scribe
CarlosD

Contents


<MarkRogers> present

scribe+

Call for review https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues/461

<MiriamF> +

Jean-Yves: 2 one-week call for review, no two-week

Assigned issues https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues?page=1&q=is%3Aissue+is%3Aopen

Jean-Yves: working in the target size rule

CarlosD: not much

Wilco: task force work

MarkRogers: looking at the target size rule and how browsers handle it

dan_tripp: working on the label in name PRs
... and on #2075, that might be moved out of draft status

Todd_: not much

Update from the ACT Task Force https://github.com/w3c/wcag-act/pull/522/files

Wilco: 3 rules parked with the AGWG
... might be approved next week
... 3 more at the ARIA WG

<Wilco> https://w3c.github.io/wcag-act/act-rules-format.html

<Wilco> https://w3c.github.io/wcag-act/act-rules-format.html#Change_History

Wilco: working of the first working draft of the act rules format 1.1
... still other considerations, like updating the applicability section
... where objectivity requirements could change from a "must" to a "should"

Jean-Yves: Talk about ACT at CSUN accepted

Deprecate old website and redirect to WAI website https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues/2142

Jean-Yves: the old website is not updated but people are pointing to it
... we should deprecate it and redirect to the current website
... the few pages that are not on the WAI website should be moved to the CG page on the w3c site

Wilco: we could also leave it on github
... this is on my todo list for a long time
... but if someone wants to take this on please do

Add target size enhanced rule https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/1919

Jean-Yves: I've been working on this rule since TPAC
... the main issue for me is coming up with the definition of clickable area
... and the definition for target size enhanced also considers area occlusion which makes this further complicated
... also, CSS transformations makes getting the bounding box for an element that is fully visible, may result at a bounding box that is larger than the clickable area
... Mark suggested looking at hit testing from browsers
... and I've created a lot of tests in https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/1919

Wilco: is there a way to define a minimum area that we can agree upon?

Jean-Yves: There are some options we can look at, and that is a probable avenue

MarkRogers: I've been looking at the behaviour of clickable areas and they work differently with HTML elements and SVG

Jean-Yves: I considered discarding elements with transforms, but then we would end discarding everything that content authors change

Wilco: Can we capture the most common cases and start with those?

Jean-Yves: Agree with simplifying and capture what we can

Wilco: We can revisit this later

MarkRogers: another problem is actually knowing what is clickable

Jean-Yves: the applicability now is focusable widget, which are likely to be clickable

MarkRogers: it might be worth dropping the focusable requirement, since there are a lot of widgets that are not focusable

Jean-Yves: I'm hearing that we should discard elements that have a lot of changes from CSS and see if we can work within this simpler framework
... also, everyone have a look at the examples on the PR

Wilco: I see you are using buttons in some of the examples
... wouldn't it be easier to use links to avoid the browser styling of buttons

Jean-Yves: with links there was a mess with white-space around them, so I styled the buttons

MarkRogers: what happens on the target size rules with composite widgets, like comboboxes?

Jean-Yves: I'm not aware of specifics on this from the understanding documents

giacomo-petri: If labels are linked to the inputs are they target areas?

Jean-Yves: Yes, if they are equivalent, and the rule also considers this

giacomo-petri: But, how many users know they can click on a label?

Jean-Yves: Agree, but it should not be a reason for failing the SC

Wilco: About the controls, if a control is composed by sub-controls, that have distinct functions, then the sub-controls need to meet the target size

Jean-Yves: Thanks for the inputs... I'll further work on this now

https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/pull/1919

Required states can come from native elements [4e8ab6] https://github.com/act-rules/act-rules.github.io/issues/2138

Wilco: our rule has a false positive!
... the rule has an exception for when the role mimics the native behaviour

Jean-Yves: I'm not sure this is failing the rule because the checked attribute is setting the aria-checked attribute

<Jean-Yves> https://www.w3.org/TR/html-aam-1.0/#att-checked-absent

Wilco: that is an interesting way to read it

CarlosD: I think that is correct, the property is set

giacomo-petri: We need to reference the AAM in the rule

<Jean-Yves> https://www.w3.org/TR/html-aria/#el-input-checkbox

Wilco: We have multiple ways to read what it means for a property to be set. Do you need a definition for that?

Jean-Yves: We maybe do

<Jean-Yves> https://github.com/w3c/html-aam/issues/349 (applying to implicit roles)

Wilco: By reading it this way, do you fail a checkbox with a role button?
... we need to handle explicit and implicit semantics differently

Jean-Yves: A definition of explicitly set and another for implicitly set are needed

<Wilco> https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/API/ElementInternals

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

[End of minutes]

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Default Present: dan_tripp, CarlosD, Jean-Yves, Todd_, Wilco, MarkRogers, MiriamF, giacomo-petri
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