Cognitive and Learning Disabilities Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

09 January 2023


David-Swallow, Jennie, julierawe, JustineP, kirkwood, krisanne, Lisa, Rain
becca, shawn

Meeting minutes

<Lisa> agenda

do we have a call next week?

<Jennie> I am on vacation next week.

<kirkwood> -1

<Rain> -1

<David-Swallow> I can make it next week.

<krisanne> -1

<julierawe> -1

<Jennie> -1

+1 (UK)

scribe sign up https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/coga/wiki/Scribe_list

<Roy> 1. WAI-Adapt: Symbols Module has been published as Candidate Recommendation at:

<Roy> https://www.w3.org/TR/adapt-symbols/

<Roy> 2. W3C Alternative and Augmented Communication (AAC) Symbol Registry has been joint published by APA and BCI as W3C Registry at:

<Roy> https://www.w3.org/TR/aac-registry/

Thank you Roy we have meeting with Janina and Lionel

+1 from E.A. to keeping in touch

<Roy> public-adapt@w3.org

Personalisation task force now called WAI adapt

updates and actions https://docs.google.com/document/d/15HtPkkYx1CIl6bAwP2nsSZKhqTVbqcuMDRz5RmtmvXg/edit#heading=h.1bvszq5s0esc

Lisa mentioned the aims that includes updating Content Usable - so subgroups set up in order to action this aim - run down of subgroup info to date...

Mental Health Rashmi not attending - literary review nearly finished - please still let us know about other papers - analysis will lead to an issue paper and suggest changes - not many new patterns. Please let us know if others wish to join the mental health task force

<Lisa> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/coga/wiki/Subgroups

There is a rota for task force sub groups

Rain - structural review - card sort being analysed and results will be available next week. Next subgroup meeting should have revisions for proposed structure and Kiki will launch qualitative study - simple prototype of new structure.

Julie overview of Test subgroup on hold since draft tests have been presented at TPAC and need guidance on how the tests are taking place for WCAG 3 - Michelle asked to join as need feedback - Lisa added that hope end of week to publish something about protocols. Also Lisa has an action about survey information for protocols

This is all about how to integrate guidance into WCAG 3 includes clear language as well as tests and structures.

Jennie meeting with Shawn to merge work completed - will work with Julie for the next subgroup meeting.

Research Plan and strategy subgroup - looking at updating reseach but did not work as a group so Lisa asked David when he would be able to report back about partners - will try to complete the task now by end of January

Aaron not on call but doing mini lit review to check what is updated for technology - need to look at structure of issue papers.

Lisa said more community feed back needed from that group and requests from other group can be discussed later - please use the online page to update items

Image subgroup

<Lisa> topic, wcag

Lisa has received feedback from WCAG about a survey

<Lisa> survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/assertions-jan-2023/

WCAG want feedback on how they are treating protocols and Lisa is concerned that protocols will only be about voluntary types of conformance - so only at the higher level so those things that we want considered as a protocol may not considered - so may not have a procedural test.

Rain mentioned that she has mainly concentrated on the adaptive testing but feels we should document concerns if protocols are not going to be applicable to coga items. Please check the survey expecially if you have been closely involved

Lisa explained that when she discussed this with Rachael it appears that there will be different types of tests and protocols in the next version of WCAG and these may or may not be automated - This could mean that this may mean there is no strict conformance criteria so where something is not easily testable there may be an 'assertion' - undertaking a process and how it is defined rather than robust testing at base level.

John is concerned about the idea of standards and protocols versus processes and procedures... need to check where the standards will be applied - at what level

Julie also worried that this needs addressing

<kirkwood> +1 to Jennie

Jennie was concerned that there is no 'plain language' version of what they are actually asking in the survey - is this only relevant to coga related assertions. need to expand what is the base level of conformance because of the cost of testing for certain things.. .need to have a certain priority for coga related items to go into .. Other problem is that if too many things are included they may not be adhered to and this is a problem so need to prioritise.

Lisa suggested that may need to choose which ones a user may consider really important - so for instance a small company may not be able to cope with all assertions at a base line level.

Rachael joined the discussion and confirmed that the explanations were correct.

Lisa asked if there were other who could join the call next week? Holiday in USA

updates and actions https://docs.google.com/document/d/15HtPkkYx1CIl6bAwP2nsSZKhqTVbqcuMDRz5RmtmvXg/edit#heading=h.1bvszq5s0esc

Lisa also offered an orientation call to newcomers - Please send an email to Lisa - she might be able to do one on 10th Jan

<Lisa> close item 3

coga callander - do we like it, and can subgroup leaders update it. See https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-cognitive-a11y-tf/2023Jan/0005.html

Lisa has made a Google Calendar for subgroups - invitations can be sent out

<kirkwood> +1

<kirkwood> helpful medium

silver survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/assertions-jan-2023/

<David-Swallow> +1 saves me having to cobble my own together :)

<Lisa> close item 6

<Lisa> close item 7

swcag2ict not including content useable https://github.com/w3c/wcag2ict/issues

<Lisa> topic image subgroup

<julierawe> Deadline for the Silver survey is this Friday night, yes?

Lisa discussing Image subgroup for Jennie to update

<Jennie> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1EM_-SftoDozDY0hnAcWdfIUf6ElqKlOWGLr23LqScCk/edit#heading=h.lodkgwy0xgag

<julierawe> Sorry, Lisa is correct: deadline is tomorrow night!

Rachael asked if feedback to the survey could be by 10th Jan evening USA time

<Rachael> Also, this survey is a quick first pass. A more detailed review of proposed documentation will be next week

Jennis sharing screen from 2022 images from designers.

Images are meant to be whole images for specific patterns and do not represent all patterns.

Please give feedback to the image subgroup - share in the next two days - submit by 11th Jan Rain and John Kirkwood are also part of the group

Main landing page - my Account page - several sections with photo card of account holder and three subsections, then a couple of other sections below the scroll on some screens but it depends on the device being used.

Julie asked is 'pay your bill online' usual language? she wondered which bill she was paying -

Rain said that the main goal was to find as clear language as possible. Main goal no to have anything that was wrong - so avoid somethins that might raise questions so perhaps not have the pay you bill section may need to happen in the example

Jennie wondered if there is a need to add 'pay insurance bill online'?

Julie felt it looked good but wondered what the 'plans' cover? Is the way it is broken out a realistic way of doing it.

<julierawe> "What your plan covers"?

Jennie said that the state health care plan in the designer's state worked in the way the example has been built.

Julie said that it is more about what the plan covers ... do I have multiple plans etc

<julierawe> "What's covered"?

Rain suggested that yes it is possible to have multiple or single plans. Maybe 'Your plan' covers may be better in English but does not work so well in translations

John also looking at it again and suggesting just keep it the plan covers - keep it simple

Lisa wanted a link to the sections that were below the scroll line, also more questions - FAQ type support not a pop up box or bot type support

EA +1 to Lisa comment about insurance as a health plan idea as this does not occur in all countries

Lisa suggested adding Company name and health insurance so that people know what is meant to be on it.

<David-Swallow> +1 to Lisa's comment, that was my first thought.

Abbey agreed with Lisa comment as she said it is hard to get 'health' insurance so this would make it simpler to navigate.

Lisa illustrated how different it would be in Israel and suggested there are often other things that might be on the site but really not sure what is needed on the page.

Julie added that what might be missing is the submission of a claim - so need separate paperwork. Need a get help section that might have an FAQ that supports getting approval for a claim etc.

<kirkwood> bringing up some very good issues

Lisa said the problem is not know what is covered by the various sites for health insurance.

Julie suggested just remove the pay bill section, keep it simple

<David-Swallow> Forgive me for being out of the loop, but what is the overall purpose of this illustration? Could we just make it reasonably generic that it might apply anywhere, rather than it completely accurate?

<kirkwood> +1

Jennie suggested perhaps change it to a car or house insurance and may make more sense internationally


<kirkwood> to moving away from health

Jennie went on to the second image - login page - sign up to an account

Julie added that the sign in to view the account - do we need all the words at the top

Jennie you can often view alot on the insurance site without being logged in so need to show where you are

Rain felt that there are words that might have translation challenges

<kirkwood> +1 to just “sign in”

<Lisa> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_ARC6QZLPE

Lisa feels that this screen is not clear and felt that it looks like the standard screen and perhaps there could be better choices for the other alternatives that are simpler. Shawn and Lisa have made some screen shots on better options that work versus those that do not work.

Samples include her health insurance site and has added a link

<Lisa> https://ecas.ec.europa.eu/cas/login?loginRequestId=ECAS_LR-59780900-AcjzOlWELwcOuCSfNvYCZyKMycsuK917PzIedlq4UvdLFXULghrI3zQbb0haKkddwQXb0L1KKzkpmmzwOVbFvGu-yntOf97TTHqug4NuE4zfrl-pPzToFyAG5lpjt7HJmPUs7X2nGN8eJZbL4mMsFUMls7c4MhrU6natykiTFBq7AFKSDU8nOafaSdv4IxzyT4qg6

<Rain> +1 this is great, Lisa

<Lisa> https://www.w3.org/TR/webauthn-2/

European Commission provides many different options for log in and Lisa feels this is the way to go.

Lisa suggests it works when the user can select what they have installed and everyone can find their own strategy - may be a combined use of devices

<julierawe> I have to join a different meeting—thank you, everyone!

<Jennie> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1EM_-SftoDozDY0hnAcWdfIUf6ElqKlOWGLr23LqScCk/edit#heading=h.lodkgwy0xgag

Jennie thanked the group for the feedback - need to discuss it with the designers but said that she really wanted everyone to get in touch with concerns

Lisa thanked everyone for all the work that has been achieved.

John thanked everyone for the feedback.

Minutes manually created (not a transcript), formatted by scribe.perl version 197 (Tue Nov 8 15:42:48 2022 UTC).


Active on IRC: David-Swallow, EA, Jennie, julierawe, JustineP, kirkwood, krisanne, Lisa, Rachael, Rain, Roy