<scribe> scribe: Laura
<Zakim> daniel-montalvo, you wanted to ask about overall panning issues and mic noises
Kevin: background - This is the video for Hannah
script called for actor who uses a screen reader. The actor is blind but does not use a screen reader
as a result - when she is acting out it doesn't look like she's using a screen reader. not sure what we can do with this.
Shadi: maybe we can send old perspectives video to see how a person who uses a screen reader interacts with their phone.
Shawn: not sure that video is salvageable. We can use Hannah as a low vision user.
Shadi: Are there any alternatives?
Summary: probably not salvagable. Clearly not using a screen reader. We'll have a discussion on what options we can take.
Kevin: script called for someone using an ergonomic keyboard - actor was using a keyboard
Shadi: it didn't look right. A person would probably be using a switch device other than a keyboard
Kevin: there were only a couple
of shots of him using a keyboard.
... other lad also couldn't use a keyboard.
Brent: is there a way to flip over to a prop ... using a small bit of the video instead of using a longer clip.
because it never cut away from the actor I was overly focused on the actor.
Shawn: +1 to Brent's comments
Kevin: show far less of actor using the keyboard
Kartoffel Films: do we use digital props instead?
Kevin: we need to see how that works
Summary: use the parts of him hitting tab and return keys - show more of. Cut out the parts where he's not using the keyboard
Kevin: video for Marta
He put her hands to the signs - called co-active or hands on signing
Shadi: signing on the back or palms of the hands, etc.
<shawn> +1 that even if it's true, it's not common
<shawn> +1 that the thumbs up rubbed me wrong
suggestion cut out small section
<shawn> +1 to cut out that peice
Brent: I agree
as the scene went on ... he put his hand on her shoulder ... cut the rest because it was an uncommon type of tactile signing
Kevin: if we cut bits then we need to edit/redo voiceover.
<kevin> +1 to tangential
<slewth> +1 to tangential
Shawn: it is also tangential to how people use digital technology ... maybe we cut the whole scene
<krisanne> +1 to tangential
Summary: cut the whole scene where we talk about tactile signing
Kartoffel Films: we need exact shots because of tight turnaround
Shawn: anyone else notice the speed? Never seen anyone sign that slow in my life
Jade: go from slow to very fast speed
Shawn: the english is slow as well.
Kevin: is this particular to the the Marta?
Shawn: it was the main guy
Kevin: how much of an issue is this for everyone?
Kartoffel: we do have an option where he is speaking and signing simultaneously
same actor throughout the video
Shadi: use the other version
Summary: try to use the other version and see what we get
Kevin: Marta video she was signing and the voiceover was slowed to match the signing speed
Brent: that one wasn't quite AS noticable
Shawn: take a look and see if there are other clips that are faster
sign language is faster in real life
Summary: Kartoffel to see if they have a faster version of Marta
Shadi: wondering picture in picture if that is a style people prefer?
Is it even a discussion? I prefer switching and engaging ... captions make them big to see what captions are
rather than focusing on the person
switch back when we talk about the person
emphasizing on the technology
front view most of the shots - if we suddenly see the screen - changing perspectives
Kartoffel: the style was to have the person and props to the side. Going to digital props a lot then puts a lot of pressure on the props
Kevin: challenge switching to full screen is an issue for mobile
<Zakim> shawn, you wanted to note style for user stories versus others and to say with props, what can we do now and what what might we to note for possible future rejig ?
Shawn: ok for user stories for other we need more emphasis on digital props
what can we do now? what can we do for the future?
more robust digital propping/editing
<Jade> +1 to full screen
Kevin: preference picture in picture or full screen approach?
Sarah: agree with Shadi - cutting full screen between actor and the technology
definitely for non story videos not sure on user stories
Brent: I agree
went through user story videos first
went to non-story videos - knew you'd have more props - so focused on actors - I wasn't catching the point. I started to get a negative feel - actor was struggling
wasn't focused on the the tools they use
good in a way - I couldn't hear the message over watching these people
Shawn: agrees with Brent's perspective
Shadi: more variance helps - story videos too much people even though she was great was too much
I appreciate that it puts pressure on digital props
Kevin: Sophie video person using mobile
<shawn> +1 to Sophie laughing too much. really great at the beginning, and when talking about jokes and pictures. however, later talking about buying tickets and she's still laughing and laughing
Kevin: timing will not allow for massive shift
focus on non story videos
Shawn: change to full screen digital props was jarring for me... what are options?
Kartoffel: is there a reason there's an either or?
Kevin: no
look to see where we can increase. The non story videos are more problematic.
Kartoffel: Can you flag which ones should be full screen?
Kevin: we can't redo digital props
Summary: broadly look at use of full screen props where appropriate to reduce the amount of idle time of people doing nothing
Sophie is an example
<shawn> shadi: it's not either-or -- more options to illustrate the point
Kevin: there's a collage of people starting the video - is this distracting or useful?
anyone else have a thought about this approach?
Brent: on this one for me - because there were 4 - that allowed me to focus on what was being said - i didn't focus on the collage but what was being said
It worked for me
Kris Anne: similar experience to Brent - it was more about representation of multiple people
<Jade> +1 all fine for me, no strong feelings about that
Summary: we're not change the collage - leave it as is.
<slewth> +1 all fine, no strong feelings
<Brent> Borders issue: https://github.com/w3c/wai-people-use-web-videos/issues/323
Kevin: is the narrative strong enough to hold watchers attention
Daniel: panning - sound can come from both left and right or center
some inconsistencies - either the mic or the person is moving
makes it difficult to listen to
do we want panning or not?
stereo spectrum needs consistency - if it's moving while the person is speaking it's very distracting
Kevin: has there been any thoughts in the panning
Kartoffel: no worries we'll adjust it
It's not the final - we need to clean the audio up
suggest no panning
Kevin: does anyone feel that panning is required?
Brent: I agree. Get rid of it
Summary: remove panning
Kevin: recorded both versions so we can use either
other countries do different things - we can use them interchangeably
<kevin> https://github.com/w3c/wai-people-use-web-videos/issues/328
do we want to take a position?
Kartoffel: we only did People with Disabilities
Jade: how is this handled other places on the WAI site
Shawn: years ago we were very strongly using people with disabilities - then during redesign we changed so we were more flexible
It's in the style guide
Shawn: see the issue - it's vehement - Sharron was strongly suggesting using "disabled people"
1 caveat - people have strongly held views on both sides
Shadi: I am really concerned about this discussion...
Kevin: we have options in this space - both are acceptable. Using both is something that we can do.
opener - how people with disabilities - closing - disabled people - do we need consistency?
Shawn: I think we can still use both in the text, along with an explanation.
Summary: We use people with disabilities throughout.
<shawn> https://www.w3.org/WAI/business-case/
Kris Anne: I like both in different situations
<Jade> +1 to Kris Anne!
Shadi: I agree with Kris Anne
Shawn: how do people feel about changing it everywhere, video, resource, etc.
Summary: shift to using digital technology instead of web
Kevin: I've gone through my list. Does anyone have anything else?
If so, raise as a github issue but we need it by midnight tonight
Kris Anne: Ian autism video - do you have video of him speaking his name?
Kartoffel: we do. We can change it
Kevin: there's nothing that's open for discussion - their comments were attached to the video.
<Zakim> shadi, you wanted to mention a good point Michelle raised on closed laptop
<Zakim> daniel-montalvo, you wanted to ask about one narration passage
Daniel: Perception video - wording issue
Adjusting these properties are individual from one person to the other
Kartoffel: I can't find it in perception video. It's in presentation video
If it's recorded we can't change it.
<Zakim> shawn, you wanted to say Bk6033_W3C_Visual_V1 "...light gray text on a white background are easier to use for people who are color blind." 01:53
<kevin> The full text from the script “Websites and apps that avoid text with low contrast, such as light gray text on a white background, are easier to use for people who are color blind.”
+1 to cut
<Jade> +1
<slewth> +1
Summary: if we can cut "light gray text on a white background" we should cut it.
Say instead "Websites and apps that avoid text with low contrast are easier to use"
Kartoffel: guy with keyboard - spasms - do we replace him using the keyboard with an iPad? No there was a long clip of him using the keyboard. We can focus on him using the tab key or return key.
This is scribe.perl Revision VERSION of 2020-12-31 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: Irssi_ISO8601_Log_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/Brent: /Summary: / Succeeded: s/idol/idle/ Succeeded: s/Boarders/Borders/ Succeeded: s/I think we can still use both./I think we can still use both in the text, along with an explanation./ Present: Daniel, Laura, shawn, Kevin, Shadi, Jade, Michele, Brent Found Scribe: Laura Inferring ScribeNick: Laura Found Date: 02 Dec 2022 People with action items: WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option. WARNING: IRC log location not specified! (You can ignore this warning if you do not want the generated minutes to contain a link to the original IRC log.)[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]