Cognitive and Learning Disabilities Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

20 October 2022


Becca_Monteleone, julierawe, kirkwood, MichaelC, Rachael, Roy
Aaron, EA, Jennie, Kris Anne, Lisa, Rain, Rashmi
kirkwood, Rachael

Meeting minutes

WAI transition

<MichaelC> * MichaelC_ has quit (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)

MC: announcements went out W3C WAI updates

<MichaelC> https://www.w3.org/blog/2022/10/w3c-wai-updates-october-2022/

MC: Judy Brewer stepping back as WAI director
… I’m stepping up in some interim roles to keep WAI moving with KEvin White as well

MC: will continue WCAG 3 work and will see how evolves, Shawn Roy and Daniel will help fill gapes
… next 3 months up in air for legal transition

MC: hopefully in new year have strong plan moving forward

Collaborative tools https://docs.google.com/document/d/1odt2eWGeJT06S2xdW2H3ymTHOTa0QWkscNSEphNI1og/edit#heading=h.npvj74y3p2d9

RM: a lot of changes from MC
… on to collaboration tools
… took anction last week to speak to AG chairs and platform chairs to figure out CSC
… the timeline has been revised originally august, not tools meeting before january or february
… from AG won’t object to publishing
… compromise putting editors note in that would link to wikipage which will share
… challenges with tools, if we agree with wiki COGA will continue with formal feedback somewhere before December

RM: it is in an email as well

<Rachael> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/coga/wiki/Feedback_on_CTAUR#Previous_Feedback_on_Tools_and_Working_with_COGA

RM: would like to share a wiki page as a temporary holding page, not formal
… I’m sharing wiki page going through describing it

<Rachael> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1bxhXLpsqIy5p6zZHxlsSvjmhUjFqSFGCgE4eelRJxH8/edit#

<Rachael> Uncommon terminology causes difficulty (examples: IRC instead of chat; "push" and "fork" in Github)

RM: first doc is issues with tools, key points uncommon terms...

<Rachael> Remembering commands and processes. These should be as intuitive as possible and well documented in a location that can be easily found.

RM: second one

<Rachael> Learning any kind of code to use a tool presents a barrier. Github's reliance on HTML and Wiki's mark up presents barriers. Wiki and document style tools sometimes make it easier with editing tools

RM: third is learning code

<Rachael> Unexpected behaviors such as overriding the right click menu in some of these tools makes it hard for people to access expected behaviors such as spell check

RM: unexpected behaviors

<Rachael> In complex collaboration tools (example: Github), infrequent use combined with an intimidating platform makes adoption very difficult and creates a steep learning curve

RM: (going through wiki)

<Rachael> In Github, there does not seem to be a simple revision process

<Rachael> Reviewing pull requests that require both horizontal and vertical scrolling causes difficulty, the text does not wrap by default

<Rachael> Remembering passwords and getting through CAPTCHA causes issues

<Rachael> System-generated email is overwhelming and difficult to get through. Difficult to sort actionable items and items that need attention from everything else

<Rachael> In general, conversations need to occur in a single location. Tracking them across multiple locations is difficult.

<Rachael> Important to create a culture where people are comfortable asking for help but even more important to select tools that allow people to work independently.

RM: simple revision process, wrapping text, passwords, actionable items in email, tracking across multiple locations (continuing with wiki)

<Becca_Monteleone> +1 looks good to me!

+1 to placeholder

<Rachael> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2021Oct/att-0004/How_to_work_with_COGA_Presentation_TPAC2021.pdf

RM: … TPAC takeaways

<Rachael> Need a persistent place to follow along (lacking one source of truth) and a way to follow threads from multiple sources

RM: continuing with tool related points from wiki

<Rachael> Challenge: Keeping track of many kinds of interactions (IRC, wikis, Github content, Google Docs, Email, etc) - Need an agenda and documents ahead of time and a hub with all links and instructions

Very good

<Rachael> Challenge: Github - Finding Github comments is challenging for many people - Involves a lot of jargon and steps - Threads are hard to follow - Too many Github alerts

<Rachael> Challenge: Remembering acronyms and processes - Explain acronyms in agenda and share explanatory links

<Rachael> kirkwood: Suggest change to better clarify acronyms

in context Jk suggested

<Rachael> Challenge: Following long threads of conversation - Use clear subject lines and changing them when the content changes - Use clear headings and a short summary for longer content - Schedule meetings in calls and send a calendar invitation

RM: asking if other missing items?

RM: showing current draft of editors note

RM: intent to gain wider review and solicit feedback on user needs, including collaboration tools, encouraging feedback

<Rachael> link to draft text: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BuiU126sZ1L0sq9aJsjXQh-3gvXonU5uYAqzYkGQjPw/edit

RM: concerns with wording?

RM: this would be from at least a COGA perspective move forward

Julie: comfortable

Avvey: yes


<Rachael> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1odt2eWGeJT06S2xdW2H3ymTHOTa0QWkscNSEphNI1og/edit#heading=h.npvj74y3p2d9

Vecca: yes

RM: we were working on collaboration tool feedback, should we walk through this, or is there another to work on feedback at this time?

<Becca_Monteleone> +1

Julie suggested changing the first paragraph to a bulleted list. Please +1 if you agree.

Kirkwood and Rachael +1

<kirkwood> +1

Discussion of Jennie Delisi comment on Issues using W3C Tools and Processes

Rachael: Chair hat off would it be easier to add comments directly to a Google doc that mimics the spec?

Kirkwood: Yes absolutely.

<Abbey_D> +1

Abbey: Agreed. A lot of going back and forth. EAsy to get lost because it is not the actual spec.

Rachael: I will circle back with Jennie and Lisa.

Kirkwood: I think that is a good way forward.

<kirkwood> RM: whet do we feel about this process?

Updates with EO and any other urgent business

RM: i’ll put into a doc

JR: a handful met yesterday with EO went through comments on doc, next step is for me to submit github issues

<julierawe> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1WIUsN_iZESQfwCqTUl6w_ukm7oNwTQTCfBZcBIQO7cE/edit#heading=h.setmoku5uplj

JR: some of concerns were confusing description of reading dsabilities. biggest issue to untanglr
… another was dyscalcula.
… another Luis down syndrome where personal story doesn’t mention dyscalculie

<Rachael> Does everyone agree with moving this into GitHub issues?

<Abbey_D> +1

<Becca_Monteleone> +1


<Rachael> +1

<julierawe> +1

JR: i sent an email last call need to know by today

Reminder send out survey for research papers https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSc4ugu4iWRlEQ84-NWJmaiwtVWkXD1mhdCxB6MMy8N_mT56Bg/viewform Rachael]

RM: anything else urgent?

RML: feel free to share on social media

<Rachael> reminder given.

Updates with task requests and actions https://docs.google.com/document/d/15HtPkkYx1CIl6bAwP2nsSZKhqTVbqcuMDRz5RmtmvXg/edit#

RM: update on tasks requests and actions

RM: mental health?

RM: structure review for content usable?

JR: Lisa had some concerns and sent alt version

JR: clear language holding pattern for EO feedback, waiting from feedback from TPAC, rain is getting some back in September

RM: we are in process at AG level doing that

RM: test plan and strategy?

RM: research plan strategy

RM: images moving forward

<Rachael> Working on clear language to come up with a test for at least one clear language criteria

Becca: complete

survey is in process is my understanding

JR: got ready for TPAC ins September for clearl language

JR: eo update scripts, once update text part of things

RM: anonmyous perticipation on hold

RM: any topics

Any other topics or actions we need to discuss?

<Rachael> Kirkwood: Scripts have been a focus and are very important for us to look at because this is a strong characterization of what COGA does and who it serves. It is our responsibility to educate about this. We need a united, strong voice and strong feedback.

<Rachael> ...possibility that the issues for COGA can be minimized if these aren't characterized properly.

<Rachael> rrasagent, make minutes

Minutes manually created (not a transcript), formatted by scribe.perl version 192 (Tue Jun 28 16:55:30 2022 UTC).


Succeeded: s/ligal/legal

Maybe present: Abbey, Avvey, Becca, JR, Julie, MC, RM, RML, Vecca