<MichaelC> * MichaelC_ has quit (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
MC: announcements went out W3C WAI updates
MC: Judy Brewer stepping back as WAI director
… I’m stepping up in some interim roles to keep WAI moving with KEvin White as well
MC: will continue WCAG 3 work and will see how evolves, Shawn Roy and Daniel will help fill gapes
… next 3 months up in air for legal transition
MC: hopefully in new year have strong plan moving forward
Collaborative tools https://
docs.google.com/ document/ d/ 1odt2eWGeJT06S2xdW2H3ymTHOTa0QWkscNSEphNI1og/ edit#heading=h.npvj74y3p2d9
RM: a lot of changes from MC
… on to collaboration tools
… took anction last week to speak to AG chairs and platform chairs to figure out CSC
… the timeline has been revised originally august, not tools meeting before january or february
… from AG won’t object to publishing
… compromise putting editors note in that would link to wikipage which will share
… challenges with tools, if we agree with wiki COGA will continue with formal feedback somewhere before December
RM: it is in an email as well
RM: would like to share a wiki page as a temporary holding page, not formal
… I’m sharing wiki page going through describing it
<Rachael> Uncommon terminology causes difficulty (examples: IRC instead of chat; "push" and "fork" in Github)
RM: first doc is issues with tools, key points uncommon terms...
<Rachael> Remembering commands and processes. These should be as intuitive as possible and well documented in a location that can be easily found.
RM: second one
<Rachael> Learning any kind of code to use a tool presents a barrier. Github's reliance on HTML and Wiki's mark up presents barriers. Wiki and document style tools sometimes make it easier with editing tools
RM: third is learning code
<Rachael> Unexpected behaviors such as overriding the right click menu in some of these tools makes it hard for people to access expected behaviors such as spell check
RM: unexpected behaviors
<Rachael> In complex collaboration tools (example: Github), infrequent use combined with an intimidating platform makes adoption very difficult and creates a steep learning curve
RM: (going through wiki)
<Rachael> In Github, there does not seem to be a simple revision process
<Rachael> Reviewing pull requests that require both horizontal and vertical scrolling causes difficulty, the text does not wrap by default
<Rachael> Remembering passwords and getting through CAPTCHA causes issues
<Rachael> System-generated email is overwhelming and difficult to get through. Difficult to sort actionable items and items that need attention from everything else
<Rachael> In general, conversations need to occur in a single location. Tracking them across multiple locations is difficult.
<Rachael> Important to create a culture where people are comfortable asking for help but even more important to select tools that allow people to work independently.
RM: simple revision process, wrapping text, passwords, actionable items in email, tracking across multiple locations (continuing with wiki)
<Becca_Monteleone> +1 looks good to me!
+1 to placeholder
RM: … TPAC takeaways
<Rachael> Need a persistent place to follow along (lacking one source of truth) and a way to follow threads from multiple sources
RM: continuing with tool related points from wiki
<Rachael> Challenge: Keeping track of many kinds of interactions (IRC, wikis, Github content, Google Docs, Email, etc) - Need an agenda and documents ahead of time and a hub with all links and instructions
<Rachael> Challenge: Github - Finding Github comments is challenging for many people - Involves a lot of jargon and steps - Threads are hard to follow - Too many Github alerts
<Rachael> Challenge: Remembering acronyms and processes - Explain acronyms in agenda and share explanatory links
<Rachael> kirkwood: Suggest change to better clarify acronyms
in context Jk suggested
<Rachael> Challenge: Following long threads of conversation - Use clear subject lines and changing them when the content changes - Use clear headings and a short summary for longer content - Schedule meetings in calls and send a calendar invitation
RM: asking if other missing items?
RM: showing current draft of editors note
RM: intent to gain wider review and solicit feedback on user needs, including collaboration tools, encouraging feedback
<Rachael> link to draft text: https://
RM: concerns with wording?
RM: this would be from at least a COGA perspective move forward
RM: we were working on collaboration tool feedback, should we walk through this, or is there another to work on feedback at this time?
Julie suggested changing the first paragraph to a bulleted list. Please +1 if you agree.
Kirkwood and Rachael +1
Discussion of Jennie Delisi comment on Issues using W3C Tools and Processes
Rachael: Chair hat off would it be easier to add comments directly to a Google doc that mimics the spec?
Kirkwood: Yes absolutely.
Abbey: Agreed. A lot of going back and forth. EAsy to get lost because it is not the actual spec.
Rachael: I will circle back with Jennie and Lisa.
Kirkwood: I think that is a good way forward.
<kirkwood> RM: whet do we feel about this process?
Updates with EO and any other urgent business
RM: i’ll put into a doc
JR: a handful met yesterday with EO went through comments on doc, next step is for me to submit github issues
JR: some of concerns were confusing description of reading dsabilities. biggest issue to untanglr
… another was dyscalcula.
… another Luis down syndrome where personal story doesn’t mention dyscalculie
<Rachael> Does everyone agree with moving this into GitHub issues?
JR: i sent an email last call need to know by today
Reminder send out survey for research papers https://
docs.google.com/ Rachael] forms/ d/ e/ 1FAIpQLSc4ugu4iWRlEQ84-NWJmaiwtVWkXD1mhdCxB6MMy8N_mT56Bg/ viewform
RM: anything else urgent?
RML: feel free to share on social media
<Rachael> reminder given.
Updates with task requests and actions https://
docs.google.com/ document/ d/ 15HtPkkYx1CIl6bAwP2nsSZKhqTVbqcuMDRz5RmtmvXg/ edit#
RM: update on tasks requests and actions
RM: mental health?
RM: structure review for content usable?
JR: Lisa had some concerns and sent alt version
JR: clear language holding pattern for EO feedback, waiting from feedback from TPAC, rain is getting some back in September
RM: we are in process at AG level doing that
RM: test plan and strategy?
RM: research plan strategy
RM: images moving forward
<Rachael> Working on clear language to come up with a test for at least one clear language criteria
survey is in process is my understanding
JR: got ready for TPAC ins September for clearl language
JR: eo update scripts, once update text part of things
RM: anonmyous perticipation on hold
RM: any topics
Any other topics or actions we need to discuss?
<Rachael> Kirkwood: Scripts have been a focus and are very important for us to look at because this is a strong characterization of what COGA does and who it serves. It is our responsibility to educate about this. We need a united, strong voice and strong feedback.
<Rachael> ...possibility that the issues for COGA can be minimized if these aren't characterized properly.
<Rachael> rrasagent, make minutes