Cognitive and Learning Disabilities Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

20 May 2021


LisaSeemanKest, JustineP, Rain, Fazio, krisannekinney, Roy, Albert, cweidner, !
John R, John k, EA, jennie
rain, JustineP


<LisaSeemanKest> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/coga/wiki/Scribe_list

<LisaSeemanKest> scribe: rain

<scribe> scribe: Rain

<LisaSeemanKest> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/coga/wiki/PlanningPage#Timelines_and_actions

LisaSeemanKest: Mental health group is a bit stuck

<Fazio> sorry that's my fault. I've been craazy busy

LisaSeemanKest: we have a few people from the group here, David, Albert, Justine
... can we move the schedule around and put emphasis on the mental health paper?

<JustineP> +1 works for me

<Albert> Yes

LisaSeemanKest: asking if a regular time for the half hour following this call would work
... the other participants have agreed that this time would work
... Monday may also be an option
... We don't have everyone on the call who is in the subgroup, but we do have the majority, so finding a time would be helpful because it is really hard to do
... Monday 12 Noon EST a time that could normally work?

Justine: yes, Monday is better than Thursday

David: that time works for him, too

cweidner: that time is good

Albert: 9am PST Monday works for me

LisaSeemanKest: 9am PST, 12pm EST on Mondays as a regular time. Still need to confirm with John Kirkwood
... asking Justine to confirm with John K.
... it will start as a weekly meeting. It can change to 2 weeks if actions need two weeks. The timing is up to the subgroup.

Fazio: plenty of work for a weekly meeting, but very hard for everyone to add in more weekly meetings.

LisaSeemanKest: please cc Rachael when reaching out to the subgroup and John K. She should know about it, but is on holiday. May not need to move the meeting for Rachael, but keep her informed.
... two action times for the Mental Health group right now:
... 1. reformatting the paper into more research module templates
... which means taking the paper that we've been working on, and starting to add information that we know about certain conditions.
... Some may be anecdotal and ideas. Some may be based on research. Doesn't mean shouldn't put it on. This is collecting. Need to say where it is coming from.
... Does someone want to start with a template where solid research and not necessarily backed up work can be included and used for more research?
... 2. action to start reaching out and finding more research, and connecting with the community

Fazio: not able to volunteer time right now, but has a ton of research around triggers for images, and search times.

LisaSeemanKest: asking David if we should make a page for people to collect more research.

Fazio: a repository of some type. A page might get overwhelming to go through.
... Looking for the Google drive right now and will pop in the link

<LisaSeemanKest> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1G9SJSiAT-SYDVNxBfwOe7A6VPqsmX4Ua0QT7-NrfQTA/edit#heading=h.uf4tmgrjcioj

<LisaSeemanKest> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/coga/wiki/index.php?title=Subgroups/Mental_Health&action=submit

LisaSeemanKest: we have two pages right now. The first one above, and the mental health sub page (second one above)

<LisaSeemanKest> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/coga/wiki/index.php?title=Subgroups/Mental_Health

<LisaSeemanKest> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/coga/wiki/Subgroups/Mental_Health

LisaSeemanKest: corrected links above.
... do we want a different document where we are just collecting research? What's easier?

Albert: I think it would be better to create a new page.

LisaSeemanKest: does everyone prefer Wiki or Google Docs?

<Albert> Google doc +1

cweidner: Google doc most easily navigable

Fazio: +1 to Google doc

<JustineP> 0 either way is fine with me

LisaSeemanKest: please start putting information into the Google doc. Doesn't have to be formatted well. Right now, looking for a summary, and the citation.
... Most important to just get things down.
... Even if it is just community experience. That is good information as well. But we need to cite it as such.
... If we get more people backing it up, then we can publish it. The advantage of publishing the research module, can get people commenting. Not strong data because not controlled, but it is some kind of data.
... the collection of anecdotal was also able to support the cognitive work
... asking for a volunteer to put together the page.

Albert: I'll volunteer. Rachael and I have already started collecting some papers. We can develop that into a document for our group. Will share the link to the Google doc by email later.

LisaSeemanKest: confirming that everyone can edit the page.

Albert: yes, I'll make sure everyone can edit it.

LisaSeemanKest: let's start off saying that this is the stage of collecting the research. Should we include the templates so that people will know what the template will be?

Albert: might be better to do that as a separate page. But not sure what the template looks like?

LisaSeemanKest: so the template will be a separate thing. But if you can get the page up for findings and information soonish, today if possible, that would be helpful.

<Albert> +!

LisaSeemanKest: I tried sending out the email for recruiting. But the feedback I got was that no one understood what I was talking about. They don't have the context because they are not web people.
... If you don't know about web accessibility, then the email doesn't make sense.

Albert: I had a similar experience. When I talk about web accessibility with clinical psychologists. Once I explained the mission and the work, it wasn't too difficult to explain that this was an important mission.
... I do know one neuropsychologist at USC who is also computer savvy. Can ask him if he is willing to join in.

<Fazio> I haven't had any time to put into it yet. Will starting in June thoough. I have a few good contacts in neuropsyche

<Albert> Dr. Trampush

<Albert> https://keck.usc.edu/faculty-search/joey-trampush/

LisaSeemanKest: will check him out
... from what I know, neurophychologists do a lot of work around ASD and ADD, neurocognitive function. This might not be right for him. But we can find out.

<Albert> USC: University of Southern California

LisaSeemanKest: hopefully we will be able to gather more information and continue. Moving along.

<cweidner> +1

LisaSeemanKest: I'm quite happy with that as moving the task force forward.
... How does the group feel? Is this the right next step?

JustineP: that seems right to me. Can try to pull in additional resources, but it seems we have a good start with representation.

Fazio: agreed

<Albert> +1


LisaSeemanKest: XAR user cases. David, any updates?

Fazio: still working on it. It is a lot to go through. We have some questions we need to answer.

LisaSeemanKest: asking if Rain, John and Albert have put in what want to into the inclusive working groups

Rain: I've put in what I want to

Albert: wants to add more information, will put in some time this weekend

LisaSeemanKest: we'll ask for the end of next week to wrap it up, and then review it on the call and pass it on to Jennie and group

Albert: yes, that is enough time

LisaSeemanKest: EA and Abby sent their content over to spoken presentations
... what about scheduling the silver subgroup?

Rain: will reach out to Jennie to see if can help schedule a time, since Jan's times were very limited

LisaSeemanKest: asking Rain to cc, since it has been about a month to schedule.
... Albert has excellent questions in the FAQ. Haven't seen people filling out the answers. Maybe we can leave it for 2-3 months and come back because then Albert may know more of the answers?

Albert: yes, it will take some time for me to understand everything and put down the answers. 2-3 months sounds good to me. I would appreciate it if anyone is able to come in and fill in some of the answers, that would be helpful.

<cweidner> +1

<cweidner> +q

<LisaSeemanKest> https://docs.google.com/document/d/10IB2vpDH5EE8Xp4_SbXEO7MA4fy0m9bQAZnUNpWE_WA/edit#heading=h.65or1vu400s6

LisaSeemanKest: so if anyone wants to fill in some of the answers. We did ask everyone last week. Document linekd above.

cweidner: maybe propose a 20 minute working session on a meeting to work on the FAQ
... that might help us leverage some of the more experienced members, by using existing time to answer the questions.

LisaSeemanKest: question about how high of a priority is the FAQ?
... we have set our priorities with mental health as priority one, making testable statements as priority 2 or 3. Straw poll on what priority FAQ goes into. Doesn't mean not important, just helps us pick the order.

<LisaSeemanKest> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1YH4YETBmAdhfL9p8FK5ATUiXDGibeJh66psQCSUAvLQ/edit#gid=788316971

LisaSeemanKest: using the worksheet, online version of the design guide is 1, 2 is testable sub statements, 3 is
... getting research online
... future is supporting more resources, personas, etc.

for next year, once we finish all the priority 3 things.

LisaSeemanKest: where do we want to put the FAQs?

Rain: how much outreach to bring new people in?

LisaSeemanKest: maybe two or three new people?

Albert: same question, how much recruiting are we doing? Putting FAQs near where we put recruiting priority would be most relevant.

<cweidner> +1

Albert: Also placing the document itself near the recruiting documents so that potential new members can reference it.

LisaSeemanKest: our new members, do any of you feel it is a priority for now because you are a bit lost in what we are trying to do?

<cweidner> +q

Albert: for me, I don't think this is super urgent. We don't even quite have a list of people that are reaching out to for recruiting.
... But would be good to have this eventually

cweidner: I agree with Albert, makes sense to prioritize this around recruiting.
... It would be helpful to get some answers to the FAQ plugged in for recruiting.

Albert: would like to propose that we do the 15 minute working session of filling in the document when we have our next orientation. I'll join during the orientation itself and write the answers during the orientation.

LisaSeemanKest: that would be fantastic. We can also separate the questions we have answers for and those we'd like to fill in, and then people can say which ones they need the most.

<LisaSeemanKest> next item

LisaSeemanKest: jumping ahead to the next item, a short one.
... We get some issues coming in. Sometimes they are more helpful than others. We need to write some kind of response.

<LisaSeemanKest> Thank you for your comments. We intended to review this issue before we

<LisaSeemanKest> publish an update.

<LisaSeemanKest> Could you point us in the direction of additional research?

LisaSeemanKest: Ones that are things we should review for the next version of the main document, I think we should verify. Tag with tag "review for next version" and then add a comment "Thank you for your comments, we intend to review this for the next version." And if relevant, also add a request for more research.


<LisaSeemanKest> +1

<cweidner> +1

<Albert> +1

<JustineP> +1

LisaSeemanKest: does anyone have any issues? Or can we go ahead and tag the issues and put in the response?

<krisannekinney> +1

next steps for mental health

<LisaSeemanKest> close item 3

Rain: is there a structured way we can help follow up on tracking the issues?

<LisaSeemanKest> https://github.com/w3c/coga/issues

LisaSeemanKest: we had a process, a spreadsheet. Right now, that process is overkill because all that's happening is just getting a few issues.

<Fazio> theres a link that shows all actions are assigned to you also

LisaSeemanKest: There may be enough new people that we should probably rediscuss the process.
... If something is tagged as discuss, then it will be discussed. Our next version if a year and a half away, so the bulk of revision will be from mental health and community outreach.
... Probably in about 8 months when we are rounding down what the new things look like, we'll go through these and find out how to put them in, and then reorganize as needed.

<Fazio> Link to track all W3C iactions assigned to you: http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/users/my

LisaSeemanKest: there is a subgroup with Justine and Lisa and Rachael. Just on to do list every now and then
... we can add this to the discussion for community outreach.
... Right now, new ideas, stick them on an issue, we'll tag them, and then we'll go through templates and response.

JustineP: until we get to the point where we have a process, I'm happy to check in weekly on github so that Lisa has support in tracking and responding.

LisaSeemanKest: make sure they get the tag and the response appropriately.

image sub group https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1WSveIdFrI62C_7Brteh_fyzWNuQZYrHTnp6eqrFJbp4/edit#slide=id.gdb437de6f1_0_93

LisaSeemanKest: Any time not sure, bring up the response on a call to discuss.
... image subgroup?

<JustineP> scribe: JustineP

Rain: <sharing wireframes> Lisa and I spoke about forcing flower shop example into illustrating all patterns. That was getting to be messy.
... After discussing, we will look at individual patterns and what information is in the document already. Will use illustrations to support that content, handling a couple of patterns at a time.
... Will put together wireframes one at a time and review with the group. Once group is comfortable with wireframes, we can send to the designer to clean up image while we continue work on other patterns.
... First slide discusses purpose of document. Second slide shows example of an illustration that was sent to Michael for feedback on implementation (do/don't example).
... Now creating a table of contents with each objective on its own slide. Using color to help with orientation. Links will be provided to image examples.
... Trying to send images over to designers to begin work. John was comfortable with menu and suggested the addition of color as a support. Two examples are in the slide deck.
... Other example is related to site hierarchy. Created a generic wireframe because the pattern is at a high level. User needs to understand site and page structure...created simple wireframe showing clear delineation of that structure.
... I can send out for feedback. Question will be does the illustration support the pattern? If not, why?
... That's the overview. Questions?

<cweidner> +q

Lisa: I have some thoughts. A long time ago, we had some pictures but were told that we couldn't use them due to permissions, etc.
... We have a page of example images at www.gov.uk that has a clear title with key topics directly underneath. Boxes used for organization.
... VA.gov has an example of block organization to support site navigation. Links clearly structured with appropriate amount of white space.
... This is an example of a good site. For objective 1 or 2, hierarchy is clear. Example of flower shop is a good example of consistency across a site. Should we ask what permissions we need to use screen shots of existing sites?

Rain: Both are good ideas. For our site, perhaps we can create our own images and also include examples of existing good images.
... happy to associate VA site to 4.2.1.

<cweidner> Have to drop all. Thank you!

Lisa: Thank you for all of your work!

Albert: Are we able to use a shared drive for collecting research on mental health?

Lisa: We don't have a shared drive currently.

Rain: I can take action item to investigate possible use of a shared drive.

Lisa: Would you check with Roy, Rain, to be sure we are approaching this properly?

Rain: Sure.

Lisa: It was somehow problematic when we last tried to use a shared drive.

Rain: Will look into it.

Albert: Sounds good. A shared drive would be helpful so that we can organize information.

Lisa: Rain, your first page...can we think about pages that time out and when you return, you can't recall what you were doing on the timed out page?
... as opposed to a page that reminds you what you were doing with an option to logon/resume the activity.
... is an example of complete confusion vs. knowing what's going on but perhaps being annoyed

<LisaSeemanKest> rssagent, publish minutes

<Rain> RRSAgent: generate minutes

<Rain> RRSAgent: publish minutes

<Rain> Zakim: end meeting

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

[End of minutes]

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$Date: 2021/05/20 15:13:42 $

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Default Present: LisaSeemanKest, JustineP, Rain, Fazio, krisannekinney, Roy, Albert, cweidner, !
Present: LisaSeemanKest, JustineP, Rain, Fazio, krisannekinney, Roy, Albert, cweidner, !
Regrets: John R, John k, EA, jennie
Found Scribe: rain
Inferring ScribeNick: Rain
Found Scribe: Rain
Inferring ScribeNick: Rain
Found Scribe: JustineP
Inferring ScribeNick: JustineP
Scribes: rain, JustineP
ScribeNicks: Rain, JustineP

WARNING: No meeting chair found!
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<dbooth> Chair: dbooth

Found Date: 20 May 2021
People with action items: 

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