Meeting minutes
reminder - SW CG meeting in 49 mins
meeting starting at https://
bengo: ok, let's start this off
<Grishka> +present
dmitriz: <intro>
grishka: Hi. Am interested in giving Social Media back to people
bengo: next topic: let's revisit the Saturday alternating meeting time
… the current time (7am PDT) is a bit early.
… So I was wondering if we could do like, a ranked choice voting on the Saturday time slot. Any objections?
grishka: no objections, later would be better
bengo: ok, let's do a ranked choice vote on the time slots (Sunday also available)
sl007: hey, Sunday would be even better
https://socialhub.activitypub.rocks/t/2021-05-07-socialcg-meeting/1697/2?u=bengo
grishka: that FEP has to do with confirming whether an item already exists in the collection before adding it
… I'd like to hear people's opinions on whether that's already needed, or just me
bengo: Send an Accept to a Follow if you want to, but you don’t have to
bengo: Do you feel blocked on implementing something?
grishka: It’s not Accept, it’s Add. Because you’re proposing to Add something to the Collection.
grishka: I’m thinking about updating the FEP with this requirement of the Add activity
bengo: Yes, update the FEP and notify us of changes
grishka: someone says it’s excessive to require the Add activity
<dmitriz> bengo: since the spec says SHOULD instead of MUST, seems like you're fine
bengo: What about your other use case of querying remote collection for containment
grishka: I need to read more
Dmitriz: Paging/sorting was not done well in LDP-PAGING.
dmitriz: It’s very under-specified.
dmitriz: That said, LDP did have a long discussion on adding an item only if it doesn’t exist
dmitriz: The initial proposal was to using If-Not-Modified HTTP headers
dmitriz: It was complicated for some implementations to normalize/canonicalize the items of the collection to understand if an item was present, and what the If-Not-Modfiied HTTP header value should be
dmitriz: The discussion was inconclusive.
bengo: Is that the approach you’d tak enow?
dmitriz: Not sure. Need to think about it
<dmitriz> bengo: one thing that's on my mind a lot is, with AP, should we even use HTTP headers? (vs stuff everything into the request body?)
<dmitriz> ... given that AP lends itself well to non-HTTP transports (websockets etc).
<dmitriz> ... so I'd be hesitant to use a header like If-Not-Modified
“HTTP Signatures” is mentioned only twice in AP TR
and not with normative languages
grishka: HTTP Signatures are used in more implementations. And are easier to implement and universally understood
grishka: For example, Pleroma doesn’t support JSON-LD at all. Only relies on HTTP Signatures
dmitriz: Funny thing is that HTTP Signatures is seeing more activity at IETF, and they’re in process of changing it
bengo: Linked Data Signatures WG forming https://
grishka: There is a 2-year old topic about these signatures
grishka: I have implemented Linked Data Signatures with unit tests
Grishka: Now I’m not touching them
sl007: In the last meeting we talked about finding out whether the impl would support Accept/Follow
<sl007> code examples https://
sl007: If you would have a think like Follow, for instance, you could be able o say which actions are supported for which groups of people
sl007: For example, is someone allowed to post a ‘Wall Post’.
sl007: So ‘as:Public’ would advertise that anyone can post to the Wall
sl007: Another example ‘partyCheckin’ saying who could Arrive and who could Leave
sl007: Specify which activity type, which object type, and which actors
grishka: It should be specified who can add something to a collection
grishka: Owner of a Collection should be able to do anything with it
bengo: This reminds me of Web ACLs in Solid
dmitriz: In general I think ActivityPub needs better Authorization/ACL specs applied to it
dmitriz: Can we map the existing solid-style ACL to this type of operation? I’m not sure
dmitriz: I’m campaigning to get Solid to adopt AP-style Follow. But we haven’t gotten to Access Control
sl007: The main reason this is useful. I want to know from an AP implementation: “Do you support groups"
sl007: or “Which actions do you support?"
sl007: e.g. if I invite someone to a group, in my implementation a group invite can result in an Accept/Reject. But in Mastodon it requires something else.
bengo: Have you implemented this?
sl007: Not yet, but we’re just starting to talk
bengo: I encourage you to either implement it or author an FEP for others to implement
Dmitriz: Someone describe OMI
dmitriz: OMI is “Open Metaverse Interoperability” group. https://
dmitriz: They want to standardize some of their social/identitiy protocols, and maybe adopt some social web existing work
sl007: I should translate my sketch to an FEP or implementation
sl007: My question is: Any opinions on what we should specify via Link relations
sl007: for example rel=“Inbox” link rel header to the AP inbox
sl007: In the HTML markup, should we specify that a link relation is an ActivityPub actor vs somethinge else
<dmitriz> (side note - welcome to paul & tim from the OMI community, to the call)
bengo: use https://
Sl007: Do any other implementations use friend of a friend link relations?
https://
dmitriz: Let’s talk about the issue trackers
dmitriz: bengo had brought up “Is there a single issue tracker for the SocialCG?”
<dmitriz> consensus: https://
dmitriz: Result seems to be these links
dmitriz: There’s a swing issue tracker, there’s an ActivityPub-specific one, there’s an ActivityStreams2 one
dmitriz: There are also Fediverse Enhancement Proposals mechanism
https://
<Loqi> [hyperledger] aries-rfcs: Hyperledger Aries is infrastructure for blockchain-rooted, peer-to-peer interactions
<dmitriz> bengo: I like how the Aries RFC process is structured
<dmitriz> ... might be worth looking at, for us, re the FEP process
<dmitriz> ... while we might not be able to update the Activity Pub spec, we can do a lot through FEPs/RFCs
grishka: IETF requires that two implementations interop with each other
dmitriz: Yes, w3dc
humbletim: What is redaktor?
sl007: It’s my activitypub-compliant CMS
humbletim: OMI is many different meta verse process collectively becoming aware that there’s an opportunity/need to collaborate
humbletim: It’s still formative, but that’s how I’m engaging with it
humbletim: ActivityPub is one of the things I’ve been looking at
humbletim: immerse.space has been using it as a thing for inter-world communications
humbletim: I’ve been trying to prove out some interop. But I’m not sure what to do next with it.
Dmitriz: Great question
Dmitriz: Good news is there’s a spec to use. Bad news is it’s kind of vague. Do you have access to source code?
humbletim: Yes, it is open source.
humbletim: https://
humbletim: https://
<dmitriz> and http://
<Loqi> [immers-space] immers-app: Deploy your own immer, the federated social media server for the metaverse
sl007: https://
<dmitriz> (that's a nice AP-express lib!)
humbletim: I’d like my POC to use a mongodb database. I’ve adapted it to use a pure JavaScript mogo emulation layer. I want to get it to be turnkey for people to play with, make interop easy
<dmitriz> everybody, go vote for your preference for alternate week SocialCG calls: https://