Silver Community Group Teleconference

06 Aug 2019


jeanne, KimD, JF, janina, CharlesHall, Chuck, shari, Jennison, MichaelC, johnkirkwood, Makoto, Lauriat, Rachael
Shawn, Jeanne


Functional user needs

SL: functional user needs for color contrast started last week

<Lauriat> Color contrast group in the migration outline: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1aCRXrtmnSSTso-6S_IO9GQ3AKTB4FYt9k92eT_1PWX4/edit#heading=h.6qr1ipbfmz1x

Jeanne: expert in color contrast Andrew Sommers joinining us

Andrew: mainly for Silver, stepping stones in 2.2 for some of the concepts
... it was suggested to me with research on perception Silver would be a better place for me

Charles: might be replaced with better research it is current standard, been trying to scope down
... fine balincing act we have been doing

Shawn: link is outline map, we've done a pass through all SC in WCAG grouped with similar guidance
... 4 color guidance being grouped together
... non text, visual presentation
... from grouping Chuck an dSybel being doing user neeeds trying to address user needs from groupings
... once set will describe tests on how to meet user needs
... fist distinguishing between colors for color blindness
... two different, one is los vision color blindness.
... the other is where color contrast has negative affect
... trigger headaches, distractionsk, etc

Andres: FAA standards, 15 to 1 is maximum

Andrew: FAA standards, 15 to 1 is maximum, age you have increased scatter due to glare, such as driving at night.
... very difficult to distinguish at night
... computer screens are generally ok, but some phones have 12x normal allumination of computer
... paper right by guy who did original ocntrast of WCAG 2.0 have exchanged emails
... have a much better idea on why contrast standards were chosen
... doesn't model human perception and designers have a difficult time with reasons
... have a personal perspective on topic
... The reason set a standard for distinguishing colors. Bulk of issue 8% of males have red green color blindness
... rgb monitors CBD monitors don't use spectral colors therefore do not affect those with CBD
... red on computer monitor would appear black and vice versa
... algorythm will take aspect into account as apposed to setting contrast
... if red primary is substantial part of brighter of two colors that would create an issue for prognopia (sp?)
... a substantial amount of red . is only 21 percent of luiminance

SL: right now we are on a higher level

Andrew: contrast of red is important

Charles: because of complexity of where color contrast should go we abondon. Or Andrew to join Cybel and I to craft new needs and methods

SL: i like option 2

Charles: even if history of current luminance formula for people with CBD. There needs to be a broader scope than color vision deficiencey

<KimD> +1 to the current contrast addressing more than color perception issues

Charles: do we need to base on RGB devices and those that are not

Andrew: p3, srbg, adobe rgb, all use same methods

Andew: really only one that has factor, someone with pragnopia missing blue cones won't have any real defiecit as long as luminance. The rare blue cone monochromats fix their viewing is to set monitor to monontone

<CharlesHall> so, it sounds like we don’t need to group methods to specific output color spaces.

Andew: any of existing color spaces have red primary

SL: rabit hole to have difficult type of guidance depending on hardware


Charles: SRGB should be default

SL: how to move forward, I'd like to do is hammer out functional user needs on color contrast in both space where more helps and less helps. if you are willing i'd like to help how totst how well someone has met these user needs to creat guidance

Charles: needs to be simple repeatable and testable with guidance from Alistair
... some ideas came out of paper can send to yhou


Charles: color contrast NASA has a great site on it. prohibited color contrast has been prohibited for 100s of years. the ones that are bad are really bad

<CharlesHall> those comments attributed to Charles are actually Andrew Somers

SL: from what you have looked at with those that help

Andrew: everything is in a range

yes oops just realized

not sure how to correct

<jeanne> The link to the Color Contrast Discussion https://drive.google.com/open?id=12AfVx_KyNaw7Dj-OZlWFs6riJGBQGOuxmUeBY5Spgq4

Andrew: font color fails when get to body text
... we perceive much lower contrast due to size and anti-aliasing

Jeanne: what i have done is dropped a link in IRC as we have discussion about different SC we are working on we're going to have a separate accompanying paper
... like to wrap this up and back to work on functional need to identify with color contrast. invite you to help Chuck and Cybel to work as a group

Charles: share email and can take off line

SL: getting back to functional user needs around contrast. i see three I have split into two categories
... where less contrast helps where people find it distracting, headaches disorientation
... in guideline in outline about staying in a particular range
... any other functional user needs affected by contrast

Charles Hall: high contrast affects anxiety

SL: bullet of scope of exploration

CA: should go in exploration

SL: we have minimum but not maximum
... how people perceive things in context of perception

Andrew: maximum contrast will not be an issue on body text more on big blocks

SL: we have settled on functional user needs of color contrast

<Lauriat> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/task-forces/silver/wiki/Main_Page#Silver_Content

<Lauriat> Sample WCAG Success Criteria to evaluate the migration process

SL: this is a s series of those migrating thes are prioritzed ones, first is color contrast

Jeanne: audio description bruce has started that one lets llook at that

SL: should we start from working document?

<Lauriat> Audio Description working doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BJzDxztJhd_hRBQSO0UtWECmUegA-hwucedrayB9VEs/edit

SL: audio description working document from Wiki



when looking for document look on main page of Silver Wiki is the best way to find anything

<Lauriat> "Users cannot see or have trouble seeing need extra narration to understand the content of movies and multimedia."

SL: thank you for maintaining, Jeanne

<Lauriat> "Users who can see but need extra narration to understand the content of movies and multimedia."

CA: what about those who can see and can't understand

<Lauriat> Modality lists: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lEkht-bhkaPMzOojWpDjZhbnGeckiYLh-J4-ze7cGS0/edit#heading=h.jzdw2q3k2m16

SL: we do have proposed set modality as a reference point
... diffent kinds of modality to see if others apply in this case audio description
... think all fall into two buckets, cannot or have trouble seeing vide or media content and cannot or have gtrouble understanding video media content
... there are 3 SC in this grouping. audio descripton prerecording. providing transcript and providing audio descritpion
... this seems cleaner. Think we can call this one done
... next one skypiny sensory, is pause/stop/hide our next priority?

<Lauriat> Pause, Stop, Hide working doc: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JKn_SvyHwT6cpglkANJ0Lty74KtWLY7T2rmKyWUPtYM/edit#heading=h.cqt7i1cmeikb

Jeanne: will edit page in order to work on it. Pause,Stop,Hide

SL: we have two functional user needs noted

<Lauriat> 1. Visual equivalent of non-consensual sound. Visual motion can cause problems for people with vestibular impairments.

<Lauriat> 2. Users need to stop interruptions that distract them from their tasks.

SL: visual equivlent of nonconsensual sound. visual can cause proble with vestibular impairments. users must be able to stop distraction

<Lauriat> List of SCs grouped: Success Criterion 2.2.2 Pause, Stop, Hide, Success Criterion 2.2.4 Interruptions, Success Criterion 2.3.3 Animation from Interactions

SL: for this user need is to disable or avoid unwanted movement on the screen, vestibular impairments or distractions. as far as cognitive space we can group in many as overall space
... one user need and a whole bunch of needs

Jeanne: phrasing is not correct I'd like to ask Charles if you could assist redoing user needs so in correct language

<CharlesHall> Usage without photoreceptive or vestibular trigger

SL: disable or stop unwanted movement

<Lauriat> Rephrased draft: People who need to disable or avoid unwanted movement. (vestibular impairments, people who find the movement distracting, etc.)

SL: rephrased draft

Jeanne: will send an email to Shari to find research about 5 seconds being too long

<CharlesHall> the style note Jeanne made was in favor of functional needs statements versus disability first or person first language

SL: check the at least 5 seconds bit was a comment
... any other functional user needs that comes tom mind
... we've made it through prioritized 6
... we have done these with different addressing different groupings
... go through in the next week or two
... have at it and add comment on document

i agree with the 'have at it'

SL: why don't take all of the ones we need to build up and put in a list to send out to everyone. will also put in github
... will create list and link each to github and can claim it at either one
... both github and google doc

oops ;)

<jeanne> Meeting: Silver Content Subgroup

<jeanne> s/

<jeanne> //

<Lauriat> trackbot, end meeting

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

[End of minutes]

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Default Present: jeanne, KimD, JF, janina, CharlesHall, Chuck, shari, Jennison, MichaelC, johnkirkwood, Makoto, Lauriat, Rachael
Present: jeanne KimD JF janina CharlesHall Chuck shari Jennison MichaelC johnkirkwood Makoto Lauriat Rachael
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Found Date: 06 Aug 2019
People with action items: 

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