Date: 12 June 2017
See also the Agenda and the IRC Log
Present: Tzviya Siegman, Garth Conboy, George Kerscher, Avneesh Singh, Nick Ruffilo, Kyrce Swenson, Dave Cramer, Rick Johnson, Charles LaPierre, jungamo, Matt Garrish, Chris Maden, Tim Cole, Peter Krautzberger, Brady Duga, Romain Deltour
Regrets: BillK, Luc Audrain, Vladimir Levantovsky, Alan Stearns, Leonard Rosenthol
Chair: Garth Conboy
Scribe(s): Nick Ruffilo
Garth Conboy: "Let's get started. We might be brief, depending on discussion of Face-2-face. We certainly have happy topics to discuss.
Garth Conboy: "I'd like to start with a sad topic. Pierre Danet passed away over the weekend, he unsuccessfully was battling disease. He was the involved in the IDPF, and the director of EDR labs, exec at Hachette. All-around good guy. Many on this call knew him. It's sad. Best wishes out to family. I'm not sure if anyone close would like to further comment."
Ivan Herman: "The reason we are here is that Pierre was extremely enthusiastic about W3C. I met him before this started, I met him at a meeting non-publishing related, but we owe quite a bit to him as to what we are doing now."
Tzviya Siegman: https://www.w3.org/2017/05/22-dpub-minutes.html
Garth Conboy: "Any objections to the minutes that were included for 3 weeks ago? Ok - Minutes approved. Now turned over to Ivan."
Ivan Herman: https://www.w3.org/publishing/groups/publ-wg/
Tzviya Siegman: https://www.w3.org/2004/01/pp-impl/100074/join
Ivan Herman: "There is little to say - the working group is up and running. We got the approval. Was announced Friday evening my time. We are up and running, we have a working group homepage. A number of you have already signed up to the working group. To be very clear, there is no automatic transfer of membership to the working group - so you'll have to do that. That includes invited experts. Writing the recommendations to do the work is needed now."
Tzviya Siegman: invited expert form: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/1/ieapp/
Garth Conboy: "I think there are a number of folks in this group that... do you want to talk about the shadow being promoted and the 3.5?"
Ivan Herman: "The biggest problem with the charter as we put it forward was that the scope section was considered too vague - a mix up of goals and very specific things that we are supposed to deliver. This became a problem for companies that have major patent portfolio. They think this W3C group is supposed to deliver IPR - they found it too vague, so that was the main reasons why we had delay. The way it was re-written, we did our best to keep the content the same but make the scope bar much tighter. Some of what was in scope is now in the "goal" section. Apart from these changes, the biggest change we have to realize is that we extended the charter from 2.5 years to 3 years which gives us more time. that gives us the testing and checking period, which was extended because it would take a lot of work. That's the set of main changes. Maybe one more thing - that came up during the review - which we will have to discuss, because it's new to W3c, there were questions if we would try to reinvent the wheel or rely on work that was already done and re-use as much as we can, so we had to reinforce that in the charter, and it something we will have to be watchful about when we begin the rework in the working group."
Garth Conboy: "Thank you - that was ideal. In the agenda I put a link to the draft version that was passed around. We did a quick call for objections to the folks who previously noted it. I just wanted to acknowledge the efforts of ivan all the way through, and later in the game getting the changes agreed, working with objectors, listening to Tzviya and I chime in - great work folks. And that leads us to the face-2-face. IT IS ON!"
Tzviya Siegman: https://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/June_2017_F2F
Garth Conboy: "This was announced with the charter, so it had guidelines. Thursday and Friday of next week. Is Leonard on the call? The planning document we used for group editing, is now on wiki. You can fill in email addresses so that access to the building can be arranged. If you don't want to put your email, notify leonard."
Tzviya Siegman: "Does anyone have food allergies, or special circumstances, please let us know."
Garth Conboy: "If there are issues on the agenda, let us know - Tzviya, Ivan and I are going to discuss it later this week. Please review the wiki and let us know. Do not make changes to the agenda - even though you have access, so that we have more control. There will be remote access to the meeting if you cannot be there in person. "
Tzviya Siegman: "If you need to have someone else run a session, please let us know. If you would LIKE to lead, let us know that as well. Some of us are traveling Monday, so hopefully we'll have everything covered. For this, I do anticipate that this group transitions into becoming ... We will transition this into the working group. We see tons of emails coming in of people joining the working group. For planning for the meeting, it's fine to use the interest group mailing list, or email the chairs directly, but post face-to-face, we'll move over to the working group mailing list. Ivan is probably going to correct some things."
Ivan Herman: "If you remember, we had a discussion a few weeks ago to see if there were any work items we would have to move to somewhere else. At the moment the idea is that this interest group will wind down. This may be the last interest group meeting, but it's not yet fully decided, as we need to wait for everyone to move to the working group. We want to keep this time slot for the working group weekly calls, which will begin after F2F. To keep this slot, there will be a different webex - unless this timeslot is really bad for people in the WG. We'll make a final decision later."
Garth Conboy: "We're meeting the 22nd and 23rd, it may be a bit much to do a call on the 26th, so the 3rd is a long-weekend for the US-based people, so we'll probably have a brief discussion in NY about when we'll start up, but it could be as late as the 10th."
Garth Conboy: "Any other business?"
Ivan Herman: "Just because it came up - one element that did come up during the charter discussion - we should try to find a way to have work done between the calls - emails, github, git issues. There are people who live elsewhere that should be able to discuss."
Nick: "What about slack or discord for chat/discussion/channels?"
Tzviya Siegman: https://discourse.wicg.io/c/dpub
Ivan Herman: "The general answer is - tools we feel comfortable with is fine. this is already a discourse running for w3c - on that one we have put up a separate channel or something for publishing. I have put a reference to that on the group homepage, so we could use that. For slack - i have less experience, my department uses it. As far as I can see, for me it looks like a nice "IRC" (which it is). The IRC we are using right now is at our disposal, we can use it anytime."
Ivan Herman: "All these things are there and we can decide what is best."
Dave: "Reminder: github issues are a lovely way to discuss things."
George Kerscher: "When we consider tools, we need to think about the accessibility of these things need to be analyzed."
Avneesh Singh: Slack is not 100% accessible
Chris Maden: Slack can be wired up to IRC and XMPP channels.
Peter Krautzberger: Slack can be connected with IRC.
Peter Krautzberger: cmaden2 :)
Avneesh Singh: +1 to Dave, we should have limited parallel channels
George Kerscher: "The whole issue of how to work effectively - we need to figure this out. My inbox is just horrible. Github seems to be generating emails and sorting through all those seems a thing."
Nick: "Discord might be accessible, but if Github is accessible, that might be the solution."
Ivan Herman: https://github.com/w3c/publ-wg/
Rick Johnson: Is this the URL? https://discordapp.com/ "Free Voice and Text Chat for Gamers"???
Ivan Herman: "The homepage is served from the git-hub repository. probably what will happen is the specific repository."
Laurent Le Meurs: +1 to get rid of emails; Slack seems to block access to history of messages for free accounts.
Garth Conboy: Dude!
Ivan Herman: "Coming back to what dave said, this repository could be and probably should be THE repository for all of our communications."
Garth Conboy: "Ok - we can discuss during F2F. Any other business?"
… "Look at the wiki - volunteer, point out areas we may have missed. Email would be great. Update attendance. Get food issues/emails to Leonard. And we'll see many of you in NY next week."