Semantic Web Health Care and Life Sciences Interest Group Teleconference

26 Apr 2016

See also: IRC log


Tony_Mallia, Michael_Van_Der_Zel, EricP, Rob_Hausam, David_Booth, Thomas_Lukasik, Harold_Solbrig
David Booth


Prep for Montreal


dbooth: discuss Michael's slides this afternoon


Ken Lord's topic he wishes to discuss:


thomas: concerns about a FHIR-specific mapping language

dbooth: Objections to giving Ken a brief time slot in Monteal?

ShEx examples

harold: i put some ShEx examples on the site
... Some of grahame's examples do not match the spec.
... Also need to get eric to put these into the ShEx validators

<hsolbrig> https://github.com/w3c/hcls-fhir-rdf/tree/gh-pages/examples

dbooth: Next steps for ShEx examples?

harold: Need to work with grahame on references.

<hsolbrig> http://hl7-fhir.github.io/medicationexample1.ttl.html

<hsolbrig> http://hl7-fhir.github.io/allergyintolerance-example.ttl.html

FHIR References

<hsolbrig> https://github.com/w3c/hcls-fhir-rdf/blob/gh-pages/examples/AllergyIntolerance.shex

The JSON looks like this:


"patient": {

"reference": "Patient/example"



tony: In the shex, there should be one more level of reference. A fhir:Reference has a reference property and a display property: http://hl7-fhir.github.io/references.html

<hsolbrig> https://github.com/w3c/hcls-fhir-rdf/blob/gh-pages/examples/Reference.shex

<hsolbrig> Differences in Grahame's model -- sb. fhir:Reference.link <uri> vs. fhir:refernce

tony: we added a fhir:Reference.link <http://....> instead of grahame's fhir:reference <http://...> to point to the referenced object.

<ericP> <Condition xmlns="http://hl7.org/fhir"> <patient> <reference value="Patient/example"/> </patient> <asserter> <reference value="http://fhir.example/Patient/example"/> </asserter>

<ericP> </Condition>

<hsolbrig> Michael VDZ argues for leaving it on the top namespace

<hsolbrig> EricP: WHy do we have something different in RDF than in JSON XML

michael: Better to put it at the top level of the fhir: namespace, like grahame does it: fhir:reference .

<ericP> <Condition xmlns="http://hl7.org/fhir">

<ericP> <patient> <reference value="Patient/example"/> </patient>

eric: What if we use a relative URI?

<ericP> <asserter> <reference value="http://fhir.example/Patient/example"/> </asserter>

<ericP> </Condition>

eric: Is a FHIR processor expected to recognize http://fhir.example/Patient/example and Patient/example as referring to the same resource?
... Will it treat them as identical? Will it try to serialize them the same way?
... If there is an expectation that everything is resolved against the base, then those would be serialized the same way.

dbooth: Need to be able to round-trip
... Anything in double-quotes is a literal in RDF.

<hsolbrig> I have to leave - I've got another meeting. Will see you at the afternoon meeting today...

dbooth: because of the round-tripping requirement, I think we need to maintain the relative URIs
... Canonical FHIR JSON does not define a way to normalize references; therefore relative URIs need to stay relative and abs URIs need to stay abs.

ISSUE: Do we need a fhir:reference (name TBD) whose value is an RDF URI of the referent?

<trackbot> Created ISSUE-23 - Do we need a fhir:reference (name tbd) whose value is an rdf uri of the referent?. Please complete additional details at <http://www.w3.org/2014/HCLS/track/issues/23/edit>.

ISSUE: Must absolute and relative references be round tripped as is?

<trackbot> Created ISSUE-24 - Must absolute and relative references be round tripped as is?. Please complete additional details at <http://www.w3.org/2014/HCLS/track/issues/24/edit>.

eric: i.e., do we need to maintain the distinction between relative and absolute references?
... when round-tripping?

<scribe> ACTION: dbooth to ask Grahame and Lloyd [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/04/26-hcls-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-54 - Ask grahame and lloyd [on David Booth - due 2016-05-03].

5pm call

Who can make it? dbooth, harold, eric, rob

Michael's presentation in Montreal


michael: I don't know what the @base URI should be
... Might not have one if FHIR is being submitted
... Also fhir-net-api puts 'Component' in the names

dbooth: RDF does not have relative URIs, but certain RDF serializations do. in contrast, the FHIR model and FHIR JSON and FHIR XML do have relative URIs.

michael: rdfDotNet always generates xsd: prefix instead of xs: .

dbooth: We decided to standardize on using xs:

michael: Question about bundle reference. Should it just point to the referenced MedicationOrder object, instead of embedding it?

dbooth: how will it impact round tripping?

<mvdzel> bye have to go, will add some more examples to the slides and tty in Montreal


<hsolbrig> <PatientReference> { a [fhir:PatientReference]?, fhir:uri.id @<id>?, fhir:Reference.link @<Patient>?, fhir:Reference.reference @<uri>? }

<hsolbrig> <PatientReference> { a [fhir:PatientReference]?, fhir:Element.id @<id>?, fhir:Element.extension @<Extension>*, fhir:Reference.link @<Patient>?, fhir:Reference.reference @<string>? fhir:Reference.display @<string>? }

<ericP> http://piratepad.net/ericP

======== 5pm Teleconference ===========

FHIR References

# Grahame is generating:

fhir: AllergyIntolerance.patient [
... l <http://hl7.org/fhir/Patient/example>;
... Reference.reference [ fhir:value "Patient/example" ]


AGREED: Change fhir:reference to fhir:link to avoid confusion.

AGREED: We prefer fhir:link (at top level of FHIR namespace) instead of fhir:Reference.link, because fhir:Reference.link misrepresents itself as a property of fhir:Reference

# Grahame should be generating:

fhir: AllergyIntolerance.patient [
... link <http://hl7.org/fhir/Patient/example>;
... Reference.reference [ fhir:value "Patient/example" ]


harold: I like having a type arc on a reference, which is specific about the target type, such as fhir:PatientReference instead of a generic fhir:Reference .

AGREED: If we include a type arc on a reference (such as the object of fhir:AllergyIntolerance.patient) it should be specific to the target type, such as fhir:PatientReference instead of fhir:Reference

dbooth: Still need to decide whether the type arc on a reference should be required, optional or not used.


Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: dbooth to ask Grahame and Lloyd [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/04/26-hcls-minutes.html#action01]

Summary of Resolutions

[End of minutes]

Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.144 (CVS log)
$Date: 2016/04/26 22:14:09 $

Scribe.perl diagnostic output

[Delete this section before finalizing the minutes.]
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.144  of Date: 2015/11/17 08:39:34  
Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/

Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

No ScribeNick specified.  Guessing ScribeNick: dbooth
Inferring Scribes: dbooth
Present: Tony_Mallia Michael_Van_Der_Zel EricP Rob_Hausam David_Booth Thomas_Lukasik Harold_Solbrig
Found Date: 26 Apr 2016
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2016/04/26-hcls-minutes.html
People with action items: dbooth

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