Cognitive Accessibility Task Force

05 Jan 2015

See also: IRC log


+1.718.618.aaaa, +1.508.856.aabb, skeohane, +1.718.618.aacc, +1.508.856.aadd, Mary_Jo_Mueller, +1.718.618.aaee, Lisa_Seeman, JohnRochford, +44.289.442.aaff, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, Tony_Doran, Debbie_Dahl, janina, neilmilliken, Michael_Cooper, EA_Draffan


<Lisa_Seeman> agenda: this

<scribe> scribe: Rich

review of agenda, and quick recap of what we are doing

lisa: quick review of the agenda as a first agenda item
... we need to do a quick recap for the start of the year. they flow together

<Lisa_Seeman> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/cognitive-a11y-tf/wiki/Main_Page

lisa: we had redone the main page of the wiki. We are currently working on the gap analysis
... the first module is ready for first public working draft
... techniques need to go into a document and issues need to be ...

update on editors draft

lisa: do I need to clarify anything?
... ok
... a quick look at action items
... John and I were looking at people with cogntivive disabilities
... Tony and I were working on dyslexia techniques

<Lisa_Seeman> https://www.texthelp.com/media/39360/USDyslexiaAndWebAccess.PDF

lisa: Tony, you had sent some interesting links from your company
... John , can you put that link into the research document?

John: yes
... I am behind on some action items. … I am aware of it.

Lisa: you were creating techniques for the subgroup

susann: yes, I will start on that for the new year

<Lisa_Seeman> https://rawgit.com/w3c/wcag/coga-gap-analysis-2014-fpwd/coga/user-research.html

Lisa: so, we have 3 main things on the gap analysis: the research module
... I have sent reminders to the chairs of wcag and PF to publish this as a first working draft

Tony: The research by Peter Range is based on Erlend industries and that has fallen out of favor.
... … it was recommended that we don’t push that research out
... I am not in academia so I don’t know which is still valid for that community

Lisa: we need criteria for accepting research
... we can get in a lot of trouble when we publish techniques and people say that is no good
... We should put in acceptance criteria for research
... we were talking about the user research draft
... is there something else we need to do to invite PF to review this document?

janina: The next steps to be taken up by PF Wednesday.
... first public working drafts don’’t have to be perfect
... we need to get this out before Michael goes on holilday jan 21 through February 1

<MichaelC> https://w3c.github.io/wcag/coga/user-research.html

michael: I have sent out a new URI for the editors draft
... this is a better URI for sharing
... we will ask the working groups to review this

janina: we expect people to read the document and provide comments so expect people to send comments that we process
... this is a bit of a formal process

<scribe> chair: Lisa

janina: there a wide range of responses that need to be managed

lisa: I am very excited for comments
... the more the better as it means people are interested

update on techniques

<janina> ezakim, mute me

lisa: so, the techniques document is one of two things we are working on
... we are working on techniques and issue papers
... we are asking user research what kind of techniques
... we will mark some as not having enough research
... Tony is working on dyslexic

<Lisa_Seeman> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/cognitive-a11y-tf/wiki/Techniques_and_Strategies_For_The_Cognitive_and_Learning_Disabilities_Accessibility_Task_Force_%28COGA%29

lisa: EAD did some great techniques on ephasia
... the contents of the link need to be updated
... I started on updating it and found there was a lot of redundancy in the work effort
... you can’t just cut, copy, and paste as that is error prone

<Lisa_Seeman> https://rawgit.com/w3c/wcag/coga-gap-analysis-2014-fpwd/coga/CogaTechniques.html

lisa: I made a draft on github

rich: are you going to have editing directly on the github site as well?

lisa: michael can give people editing rights

rich: does this allow you to edit on the web or your local machine?

michael: there is a bit of cost of doing business if you download it to your machine and edit it there and do the push.

<Tony_Doran> we need to recommend an editor. if someone uses word it will completely mess the HTML up.

lisa: if people want to put it into the wiki and then put it in github later then fine

ack Tony:

Tony: we should recommend an editor

michael: you should an editor that messes up with white space

<Tony_Doran> has the call dropped?

<Tony_Doran> or is it just me?

<Tony_Doran> Gonna redial in

Michael: I can see how that works …
... normally people with direct editing capability are actual designated editors

lisa: we have Neil, Tony, and Susann, that are all working on techniques

Susann: I will learn github if necessary

<Tony_Doran> I need to learn git too....

<ead> ditto from E.A.

Neil: I have not had my time to get my head around push pull process
... If we decide to have a separate repository ...

Michael: Let’s talk about planning before our next meeting wrt. a scratch and less scratch space repository
... Let me see what I can come up with

<Tony_Doran> ++GoogleDocs - love it.

Michael, Google Docs are hard for us to get a conversion to our format

<Tony_Doran> Templates are a great idea

Lisa: we can publish the HTML template

<Lisa_Seeman> action lisa to put teplate for techniques onto the main page of the wiki

<trackbot> Created ACTION-75 - Put teplate for techniques onto the main page of the wiki [on Lisa Seeman - due 2015-01-12].

Lisa: we want people to edit the techniques that are there now
... Any objections to moving it to github?

group: no objections

<Lisa_Seeman> https://rawgit.com/w3c/wcag/coga-gap-analysis-2014-fpwd/coga/CogaTechniques.html

Lisa: It was a very good exercise to take EAD work and merge with what we had

<Lisa_Seeman> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-cognitive-a11y-tf/2014Nov/0027.html

Lisa: I have some questions
... EAD you really tried to stick to the template more than necessary. You pretty much only had the techniques that we already had. The question that I then had was were the techniques that …

EAD: it was hard as splitting off the non-vocal groups. ephasia can be completely non-vocal. for safety sake I tended to do exactly what you said. Otherewise, the time would be significantly longer
... perhaps we need to look at some of the techniques for some of the other disabilities as they can be completely different.
... I was looking at this as a text based scenario with no verbal.
... with ephasia people are looking more at how people are saying things
... if you are watching a video, or they are communicating on site, or on a web page the techniques will vary
... the brain damage or developmental dyslexia is impacted by the amount of text and the way they see the text. So, there are some huge similarities

Lisa: Do you think you captured these from the the ephasia point of view.

EAD: We captured the main problems

Lisa: the second comment that comes to mind is where the techniqes … in the first section. Maybe we should put additional techniques where developers will run away in the second section.
... I don’t want to lose them

EAD: Do you want us to include more techniques?

Lisa: yes, even if they are very extreme.
... things an author can do so that the person at the other end can use it

: you start with a medical disability

EAD: I am looking at the techniques page. When you went to the table …

Lisa: the table is not in the techniques document

EAD: you could put the techniques into the table

Lisa: no, where you had tags in the table you would reference the technique.

EAD: in the original document you had the table at the top and the techniques at the bottom
... I left out pass and fail examples
... I think it stands ok. We need others looking at it.
... we need techniques and research that back up what we are saying
... For the ones we have that matched there are similarities

Lisa: from what I am thinking from your responses there may be issues papers around things that we are missing. … what if I am having a skype conversation with someone

EAD: One type of emphasia may understand but others may end up repeating
... users may not remember what happened due to short term member difficulties (such as due to age)

Lisa: she we be having something for how to make a video?
... vs. playing with content

EAD: someone with a comprehension difficulty can complicate the issue (such as someone with an IQ of 80)

John: I think we are talking about 2 different things - the player controls and the content
... there have been efforts by the BBC to create content that is accessible by the general population
... web trek - is commercial

EAD: I don’t see where these fit

Lisa: People need to be able to use their own player

EAD: for email, web content, contacts, having a thread style email …
... some want to be able to upload images that they made. These are for players, not the content

Lisa: We have stumbled on a really important techniques

<JohnRochford> Example of video player designed to be easy to use: http://icant.co.uk/easy-youtube/

Lisa: The author often chooses the player
... we are in the right place to do this
... We need to figure out how to do it as part of personalization
... then there is the content of the video
... how do you make this video content understandable?
... that might be an important issue paper

<Tony_Doran> That youtube player is cool!

Lisa: video for one person may not work for that of an other

<JohnRochford> WWAAC Web Browser E.A. mentioned: http://www.wwaac.eu/products/browser.asp

Lisa: there is personalization people can load

EAD: Steve Lee is not on and he has a lot of experience with Mavis that allows people to load their own videos, etc. into their own container. Steve will say that people will declare what their device and OS they are using.

Lisa: This is sounding like an issue paper

EAD: Steve has the experience developing software that can describe it

Lisa: are there guidelines on how to make the video?
... are focusing too much on text

EAD: many of the groups we are talking to have audio difficulties as well
... memcap have advised on how to make videos
... you are making a video for a particular group

<ead> https://www.mencap.org.uk/

Lisa: we don’t have to make content that is good for every developer out there
... we are at the capture stage

<Tony_Doran> Need to drop off. Sorry.

Lisa: Do you want to do additional techniques?

EAD: I want to review the existing techniques to see how a solution can evolve

Lisa: I will send the techniquest to the list as an HTML template

<janina> Bye, all!

Summary of Action Items

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Default Present: +1.718.618.aaaa, +1.508.856.aabb, skeohane, +1.718.618.aacc, +1.508.856.aadd, Mary_Jo_Mueller, +1.718.618.aaee, Lisa_Seeman, JohnRochford, +44.289.442.aaff, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, Tony_Doran, Debbie_Dahl, janina, neilmilliken, Michael_Cooper, EA_Draffan
Present: +1.718.618.aaaa +1.508.856.aabb skeohane +1.718.618.aacc +1.508.856.aadd Mary_Jo_Mueller +1.718.618.aaee Lisa_Seeman JohnRochford +44.289.442.aaff Rich_Schwerdtfeger Tony_Doran Debbie_Dahl janina neilmilliken Michael_Cooper EA_Draffan
Got date from IRC log name: 05 Jan 2015
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2015/01/05-coga-minutes.html
People with action items: 

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