Pointer Events WG Voice Conference -- 03 Jun 2014

<scribe> ScribeNick: ArtB

<scribe> Scribe: Art

<smaug> and unstable

Tweak agenda

AB: since I submitted the draft agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pointer-events/2014AprJun/0063.html, a couple of topics appear to be have resolved themselves and thus we can drop them.
... any objections to dropping the "high-frequency mouse/touch" topic as proposed by Rick?

[ None ]

AB: any objections to dropping Bug 25758 (change width and height to double) as proposed by Jacob?

JR: I think we should talk about that bug

AB: ok
... during the AoB section I would like to briefly confirm the group's Plan of Record (PoR) aka The End Game. Any objections to that?

[ None ]

AB: during the AoB section, I would like to add a short process-related topic on the use of HG by the Touch Events CG http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-touchevents/2014Jun/0000.html. Any objections to adding that?

JR: no, that's ok

… want to add something else about a potential f2f meeting

AB: ok, we'll add that too
... any other change requests?

Bug 25758: Change PointerEvent width and height to double

AB: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pointer-events/2014AprJun/0053.html.

Discussion

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pointer-events/2014AprJun/0051.html.

RB: I think JR just wanted to see if anyone had any comments

JR: I thought adding tilt would be good but don't think so now

… we could always take that up later if needed

… I am talking to send some pen based companies

RB: you missed one thing on the constructor

<jrossi> ACTION: jacob to update pointerInit constructor [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/06/03-pointerevents-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-107 - Update pointerinit constructor [on Jacob Rossi - due 2014-06-10].

Testing

AB: First up is PR 324 https://github.com/w3c/web-platform-tests/pull/324/, f.ex. the status and merging. I think there is a proposal to merge now and then "pick up the pieces". Basically, what is the plan to complete the test suite.
... then how to handle additional PRs; who is going to do what; ...

JR: can we get consensus to merge PR324?

… then we can stage additional tests

… can't really work on other PRs until 324 is merged

… I would prefer to land 324

AV: all of the feedback is now on the PR

… feedback has been addressed

… we have other PRs but they depend on 324 thus it is now critical path for other work

… There are some other test cases that require 324 to land

… We can address any issues with 324 as new PRs

AB: anyone object to merging 324 as is?

RB: sounds good to me

<asir> Thank you Rick!

AB: ok, then we have a resolution

RESOLUTION: group agrees to merge PR324 as is

AV: please submit other PRs as soon as possible

JR: we have 2 more

AV: I think it's more like 3-4

JR: but they are smaller than 324

… think Scott wants to combine some tests

SG: there are TTWF tests

… need to look for overlaps

… so we don't get dups

… Might want fewer test files

JR: need a queue/list of things we need to test

… think we are mostly done

… only a few more things to test

AV: Scott, what are you going to contribute?

AB: perhaps Scott can reply to the list

<scribe> ACTION: Scott send a todo list re testing that needs to be done [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/06/03-pointerevents-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-108 - Send a todo list re testing that needs to be done [on Scott González - due 2014-06-10].

SG: yes, that's fine. I need to talk to DaveM.

AB: sounds good

<scribe> ACTION: Jacob run the merge for PR324 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/06/03-pointerevents-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-109 - Run the merge for pr324 [on Jacob Rossi - due 2014-06-10].

AV: the other tests pending are mostly touch-action related

AB: excellent

AV: is anyone else planning to submit tests?

AB: not me

CC: no

RB: no, although I'll review the touch-action tests

… I assume they will cover what we want

AV: we used your prior input Rick when we created the tests

RB: great

CR implementation status

AB: can we please do a quick round robin re the status of Chrome, Firefox, IE, Opera

RB: we have been reaching out to web sites

… expect touch-action on for chrome 36

JR: I need to do some more reach out

RB: nice to see this cooperation on touch-action

<rbyers> :-)

<rbyers> go ahead without me, be back shortly

OP: some patches are landing

… original plan was Metro but plan now is Android and other platforms

… not sure how many releases before PE is enabled

… we do have most of the code landed

JR: not much new to report; we have some bugs but they are minor

… I don't think we have any bugs that cause interop probs

RB: re touch-action hit testing and matching Blink with IE

… I have gotten some pushback re complexibility

… there is a relevant non-norm note in the spec

… Is anyone else interested in precices hit testing text in the spec?

… The hit test is done on the bound of the element

… If inline and exceeds bounds of its parent

[ JR reads the specific text ]

JR: I think we have some test cases for that

… I don't think this is going to be a big interop issue

RB: perhaps we should change note to MAY?

… elsewhere we say hit testing is out of scope

JR: true; perhaps it isn't needed

… I don't like using 2119 words in Notes

RB: Elliott and Adam convinced me we should change our impl

… we're doing two hit tests now and want to do as few hit tests as possible

JR: are you replicating hit testing off thread?

RB: it's off thread now

… for compat need sites to opt in

… all hit testing is main thread

[ some details of IE and Blink hit testing missing ]

JR: I'm ok with removing that note

AB: I don't have anything to add

OP: I don't recall what Gecko does here

AB: so, create an Action for Jacob to remove the note; anyone that objects can do so on the list

<rbyers> Context from blink side here: https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/forum/#!topic/input-dev/En4Jr3ZunRw

<rbyers> A couple minor corrections: we currently do touch-action hit testing only main thread (and would like to collapse this special touch-action hit test into the normal one we're already doing).

<scribe> ACTION: jacob remove the hit testing note (bounding box) per agreement on 2-June-2014 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/06/03-pointerevents-minutes.html#action04]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-110 - Remove the hit testing note (bounding box) per agreement on 2-june-2014 [on Jacob Rossi - due 2014-06-10].

<rbyers> we do other hit-testing off-thread, but fall back to main thread if we can't be sure

Plan of Record (PoR) to get Pointer Events to REC

AB: just wanted to reiterate our plan to get Pointer Events spec to Recommendation. The basic plan we previously agreed is:
... Complete test suite;
... Do the interop testing; (if necessary, fix bugs and repeat)
... Create Implementation Report (IR)
... After we have 2 more implementations that pass each test, publish a Last Call WD with a link to the test suite and IR; include a clear note that in the absence of any major issues raised during the 3-week LC comment period, since we already have proven interoperability, we intend to skip Candidate Recommendation and the next publication will be Proposed Recommendation

JR: sounds right to me

AV: yes, sounds right

<smaug> sounds ok

<rbyers> sounds good

<Cathy> sounds good

AV: when is the right time to update references?

AB: which references are you concerned about?

AV: HTML spec is one

… need to update a few

AB: we should update refs right before LC

… I think we're going to be ok

Touch Events CG and use of HG

AB: I believe everyone in the Touch Events CG should now have write access to https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/webevents. As such, I will reply to http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-touchevents/2014Jun/0000.html the issue is resolved.
... did anyone else try?

JR: I didn't

RB: MikeSmith gave permissions to everyone in the CG

A Potential F2F Meeting

JR: Rick and I have been talking about some various problems

… not necessarily touch or pointer events specific

… We are planing to get together

… where we is Blink and IE

… we are meeting for some brain storming on June 23

<smaug> Yes, please ask mbrubeck__ to join the meeting

… expect that any proposals would be brought back to the appropriate group

<rbyers> Brainstorming notes here: https://docs.google.com/a/chromium.org/document/d/1C6P3Mhza1jdMJyP9G6fr7n7zcXrCmwih1o2xohFVEhc/edit

RB: this doc includes potential topics

… people should feel free to add topics

… interested in priorities and other items

… Sorry this is last minute

… Some of us are going to be in CA that week so we are going to go to Seattle to meet with Jacob and his team

AB: it's good to meet

… have you thought about announcing the meeting

RB: we just agreed to meet yesterday

… we can announce on the lists and ask people to contact us if they want to join

AB: please do announce

… Matt might be able to join since he lives in Seattle

JR: we might be able to use this meeting to help us understand what we want to do with respect to formal standardization

RB: we have a lot of items for potential work and need to discuss priorities

AB: ok, thanks the headsup

… can I get one of you to agree to send some hightlights and summary to the PEWG and TECG lists?

RB: yes, I'll do that

<jrossi> FYI - I've removed the touch-action hit testing note: https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/pointerevents/rev/5b06a2e374b7

<scribe> ACTION: rick send summary/highlights of Seattle meeting to the PEWG and TECG lists [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/06/03-pointerevents-minutes.html#action05]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-111 - Send summary/highlights of seattle meeting to the pewg and tecg lists [on Rick Byers - due 2014-06-10].

AoB

AB: no call on June 10
... please continue to address open actions, open bugs, etc.
... anything else?
... meeting adjourned

JR: one bug I fixed 24923 yesterday - please review and submit feedback

- DRAFT -

Pointer Events WG Voice Conference

03 Jun 2014

Attendees

Contents