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14:34:44 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/11/18-xhtml-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/11/18-xhtml-irc ←
14:34:46 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs public ←
14:34:48 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be IA_XHTML2
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be IA_XHTML2 ←
14:34:48 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM scheduled to start in 11 minutes
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM scheduled to start in 11 minutes ←
14:34:49 <trackbot> Meeting: XHTML2 Working Group Teleconference
14:34:49 <trackbot> Date: 18 November 2009
14:40:47 <Steven> Chair: Steven
14:41:18 <Steven> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2009Nov/0005
14:41:26 <Steven> Steven has changed the topic to: Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2009Nov/0005
(No events recorded for 6 minutes)
Steven Pemberton: Steven has changed the topic to: Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2009Nov/0005 ←
14:41:39 <Steven> Regrets: Alessio, Tina
14:42:25 <Zakim> IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has now started
Zakim IRC Bot: IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has now started ←
14:42:26 <Zakim> +ShaneM
Zakim IRC Bot: +ShaneM ←
14:43:09 <Zakim> +mgylling
Zakim IRC Bot: +mgylling ←
14:43:10 <Zakim> -mgylling
Zakim IRC Bot: -mgylling ←
14:43:10 <Zakim> +mgylling
Zakim IRC Bot: +mgylling ←
14:46:20 <Steven> zakim, dial steven-617
Steven Pemberton: zakim, dial steven-617 ←
14:46:20 <Zakim> ok, Steven; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, Steven; the call is being made ←
14:46:21 <Zakim> +Steven
Zakim IRC Bot: +Steven ←
14:49:50 <Steven> Scribe: Steven
(Scribe set to Steven Pemberton)
14:49:55 <Steven> Steven: News on Oasis?
Steven Pemberton: News on Oasis? ←
14:49:58 <Steven> Markus: No
Markus Gylling: No ←
14:50:11 <Steven> Topic: Role module
14:50:31 <Steven> Steven: News?
Steven Pemberton: News? ←
14:50:44 <Steven> Markus: George and I attended a call last week with PF.
Markus Gylling: George and I attended a call last week with PF. ←
14:51:05 <Steven> ... we need role for distribution context
... we need role for distribution context ←
14:51:19 <Zakim> +Gregory_Rosmaita
Zakim IRC Bot: +Gregory_Rosmaita ←
14:51:53 <Steven> ... we're trying to figure out a role module into a state so that it is not locked to ARIA values
... we're trying to figure out a role module into a state so that it is not locked to ARIA values ←
14:51:56 <oedipus> synopsis of discussion: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2009Nov/0007.html
Gregory Rosmaita: synopsis of discussion: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2009Nov/0007.html ←
14:52:08 <oedipus> q+ to say that GJR sent an update
Gregory Rosmaita: q+ to say that GJR sent an update ←
14:52:13 <Steven> ... PF taking over the module wasn't discussed as I recall
... PF taking over the module wasn't discussed as I recall ←
14:52:25 <Steven> Gregory: I jest sent a note to the list.
Gregory Rosmaita: I just sent a note to the list. ←
14:52:31 <Steven> s/jest/just/
14:53:02 <Steven> ... raising that role is a PF responsibility
... raising that role is a PF responsibility ←
14:53:08 <Zakim> +MoZ
Zakim IRC Bot: +MoZ ←
14:53:14 <Steven> ... we are considering moving it to PF
... we are considering moving it to PF ←
14:53:24 <Steven> Steven: No decision yet?
Steven Pemberton: No decision yet? ←
14:53:27 <Steven> Gregory: No
Gregory Rosmaita: No ←
14:54:55 <Steven> Markus: SVG and SMIL3 use @role
Markus Gylling: SVG and SMIL3 use @role ←
14:55:14 <Steven> ... it's a generic mechanism that shouldn't be tied to accessibility
... it's a generic mechanism that shouldn't be tied to accessibility ←
14:55:29 <Steven> Gregory: role has generic use cases
Gregory Rosmaita: role has generic use cases ←
14:55:36 <Steven> Markus: Exactly
Markus Gylling: Exactly ←
14:55:55 <Steven> ... and it would be a shame if HTML5 locked it to ARIA
... and it would be a shame if HTML5 locked it to ARIA ←
14:56:10 <oedipus> ack me
Gregory Rosmaita: ack me ←
14:56:10 <Zakim> oedipus, you wanted to say that GJR sent an update
Zakim IRC Bot: oedipus, you wanted to say that GJR sent an update ←
14:56:24 <oedipus> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2009Nov/0007.html
Gregory Rosmaita: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2009Nov/0007.html ←
14:56:28 <Steven> Markus: Gregory's route is the best one
Markus Gylling: Gregory's route is the best one ←
14:56:40 <Steven> ... I would join PF to bring generic role forward in W3C
... I would join PF to bring generic role forward in W3C ←
14:57:50 <Steven> Steven: Will a decision be taken this year?
Steven Pemberton: Will a decision be taken this year? ←
14:57:55 <Steven> Gregory: I will push for it
Gregory Rosmaita: I will push for it ←
14:58:04 <Steven> ... @role is ready
... @role is ready ←
14:58:14 <Steven> ... small amount of work
... small amount of work ←
14:58:28 <Steven> Shane: We already completed last call
Shane McCarron: We already completed last call ←
15:01:10 <oedipus> q+ to say that for a non-modular language, there are a lot of HTML5 modules out there (canvas api, html5+rdfa, etc.)
Gregory Rosmaita: q+ to say that for a non-modular language, there are a lot of HTML5 modules out there (canvas api, html5+rdfa, etc.) ←
15:01:39 <Steven> ... wrt generic values, we need a way to define new non-prefixed values in CURIEs
... wrt generic values, we need a way to define new non-prefixed values in CURIEs ←
15:01:48 <Steven> ... we're discussing this in the RDFa TF
... we're discussing this in the RDFa TF ←
15:01:53 <oedipus> GJR needs to check on status of @profile in HTML5 -- was slated to be dropped, but 2 factions (accessibility and non-a11y) stronly support it
Gregory Rosmaita: GJR needs to check on status of @profile in HTML5 -- was slated to be dropped, but 2 factions (accessibility and non-a11y) stronly support it ←
15:02:16 <oedipus> ack me
Gregory Rosmaita: ack me ←
15:02:16 <Zakim> oedipus, you wanted to say that for a non-modular language, there are a lot of HTML5 modules out there (canvas api, html5+rdfa, etc.)
Zakim IRC Bot: oedipus, you wanted to say that for a non-modular language, there are a lot of HTML5 modules out there (canvas api, html5+rdfa, etc.) ←
15:03:39 <Steven> Gregory: 01for a non-modular language, there are a lot of HTML5 modules out there (canvas api, html5+rdfa, etc.)
Gregory Rosmaita: 01for a non-modular language, there are a lot of HTML5 modules out there (canvas api, html5+rdfa, etc.) ←
15:04:05 <Steven> Shane: APIs are different from syntax extensions
Shane McCarron: APIs are different from syntax extensions ←
15:04:09 <oedipus> agreed
Gregory Rosmaita: agreed ←
15:04:23 <Steven> ... HTML5+RDFa has not been agreed to be published yet
... HTML5+RDFa has not been agreed to be published yet ←
15:04:45 <Steven> ... the group doesn't agree that there is an extension mechanism
... the group doesn't agree that there is an extension mechanism ←
15:04:59 <Steven> Gregory: We need leadership from above, and we're not getting it
Gregory Rosmaita: We need leadership from above, and we're not getting it ←
15:06:13 <oedipus> markus, did you discuss Liam Quinn's "imaginary namespaces"?
Gregory Rosmaita: markus, did you discuss Liam Quinn's "imaginary namespaces"? ←
15:06:49 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/QA/2009/11/default_prefix_declaration.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=laconi
http://www.w3.org/QA/2009/11/default_prefix_declaration.html?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=laconi ←
15:07:42 <oedipus> Liam's proposal: http://www.balisage.net/Proceedings/vol3/html/Quin01/BalisageVol3-Quin01.html
Gregory Rosmaita: Liam's proposal: http://www.balisage.net/Proceedings/vol3/html/Quin01/BalisageVol3-Quin01.html ←
15:09:15 <Steven> Shane: The problem always boils down to javascript and cross site downloading
Shane McCarron: The problem always boils down to javascript and cross site downloading ←
15:09:27 <Steven> ... browsers would have to support it
... browsers would have to support it ←
15:10:37 <Steven> Topic: PERs
15:11:29 <oedipus> rock'n'roll!
Gregory Rosmaita: rock'n'roll! ←
created using i/SP: asked to adjust/scribenick: oedipus
(Scribe set to Gregory Rosmaita)
15:12:21 <oedipus> SP: asked to adjust wording on bits of replies, but main point from review, at transition call expect us to have shown that all the things that were changed in normative values actually running -- need to review which are really different
Steven Pemberton: asked to adjust wording on bits of replies, but main point from review, at transition call expect us to have shown that all the things that were changed in normative values actually running -- need to review which are really different ←
15:12:29 <oedipus> SM: what PERs are we discussing?
Shane McCarron: what PERs are we discussing? ←
15:12:35 <oedipus> SP: XHTML 1.1, Basic, and Print
Steven Pemberton: XHTML 1.1, Basic, and Print ←
15:13:00 <oedipus> SM: PER asked about most recently was M12n -- put others on hold because of M12n
Shane McCarron: PER asked about most recently was M12n -- put others on hold because of M12n ←
15:13:13 <oedipus> SP: already sent a message about M12n and the other 3 PERs
Steven Pemberton: already sent a message about M12n and the other 3 PERs ←
15:13:32 <oedipus> SM: normative changes -- modularization changes some modules -- those changes will affect other markup languages
Shane McCarron: normative changes -- modularization changes some modules -- those changes will affect other markup languages ←
15:13:53 <oedipus> SP: will they change the way the other markup languages operate -- could say yes due to "lang" and "target"
Steven Pemberton: will they change the way the other markup languages operate -- could say yes due to "lang" and "target" ←
15:14:04 <oedipus> SP: not sure what a sufficient demonstartion would be
Steven Pemberton: not sure what a sufficient demonstartion would be ←
15:14:23 <oedipus> SM: what tests? need to show content validates against schemas we publish
Shane McCarron: what tests? need to show content validates against schemas we publish ←
15:14:33 <oedipus> SM: fundamental question: what has changed?
Shane McCarron: fundamental question: what has changed? ←
15:15:01 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2009/ED-xhtml-modularization-20091007
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2009/ED-xhtml-modularization-20091007 ←
15:15:32 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/REC-xhtml-modularization-20081008
http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/REC-xhtml-modularization-20081008 ←
15:15:49 <oedipus> SP: can't find PER draft
Steven Pemberton: can't find PER draft ←
15:15:58 <oedipus> SM: may not have one so could keep in draft space
Shane McCarron: may not have one so could keep in draft space ←
15:16:05 <oedipus> SP: disposition of comments
Steven Pemberton: disposition of comments ←
15:16:36 <oedipus> SM: looking in spec -- draft that is up in TR space is the PER, just doesn't say so
Shane McCarron: looking in spec -- draft that is up in TR space is the PER, just doesn't say so ←
15:16:48 <oedipus> SM: need to diff-mark again to ascertain changes
Shane McCarron: need to diff-mark again to ascertain changes ←
15:16:50 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2009/ED-xhtml-modularization-20091007/
Steven Pemberton: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2009/ED-xhtml-modularization-20091007/ ←
15:17:21 <oedipus> i/SP: asked to adjust/scribenick: oedipus
15:17:44 <oedipus> SM: added datatype -- diff against last editor's draft, not last REC
Shane McCarron: added datatype -- diff against last editor's draft, not last REC ←
15:17:56 <oedipus> SP: previous editor's draft:
Steven Pemberton: previous editor's draft: ←
15:18:37 <ShaneM> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2009/ED-xhtml-modularization-20090930/
Shane McCarron: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2009/ED-xhtml-modularization-20090930/ ←
15:18:38 <oedipus> SM: 2009-09-30 draft
Shane McCarron: 2009-09-30 draft ←
15:19:14 <oedipus> SM: description of changes in "Status of Document" section
Shane McCarron: description of changes in "Status of Document" section ←
15:19:34 <oedipus> SP: name on FORM and IMG; USEMAP, etc.
Steven Pemberton: name on FORM and IMG; USEMAP, etc. ←
15:19:56 <oedipus> SM: take a spin through document to ensure no other changes not described in status of document
Shane McCarron: take a spin through document to ensure no other changes not described in status of document ←
15:20:16 <oedipus> SM: USEMAP not just on IMG -- should state in "Status" alos on INPUT and OBJECT
Shane McCarron: USEMAP not just on IMG -- should state in "Status" also on INPUT and OBJECT ←
15:20:21 <oedipus> s/alos/also
15:21:29 <oedipus> ACTION: Shane - ensure that all changes to PER are described in the "Status of Document" section
ACTION: Shane - ensure that all changes to PER are described in the "Status of Document" section ←
15:21:30 <trackbot> Created ACTION-103 - - ensure that all changes to PER are described in the "Status of Document" section [on Shane McCarron - due 2009-11-25].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-103 - - ensure that all changes to PER are described in the "Status of Document" section [on Shane McCarron - due 2009-11-25]. ←
15:21:54 <oedipus> SP: modules hard to test in traditional sense; if we publish it and show languages using modules correctly, should allay lingering fears
Steven Pemberton: modules hard to test in traditional sense; if we publish it and show languages using modules correctly, should allay lingering fears ←
15:22:46 <oedipus> SP: drum a few tests together in preperation for re-submission
Steven Pemberton: drum a few tests together in preperation for re-submission ←
15:22:58 <oedipus> SM: where to put tests?
Shane McCarron: where to put tests? ←
15:23:10 <oedipus> SP: may need a mini-test suite to demonstrate
Steven Pemberton: may need a mini-test suite to demonstrate ←
15:23:41 <oedipus> SM: XHTML 1.1, Basic and Print -- these module changes will effect all of those
Shane McCarron: XHTML 1.1, Basic and Print -- these module changes will effect all of those ←
15:23:44 <oedipus> SP: correct
Steven Pemberton: correct ←
15:24:19 <oedipus> SM: don't know what means to demonstrate them -- test document for each markup language that uses specific features; have to ensure still works in browser that block features
Shane McCarron: don't know what means to demonstrate them -- test document for each markup language that uses specific features; have to ensure still works in browser that block features ←
15:24:44 <oedipus> SP: XHTML Print: IMAGEMAP doesn't have any effect; FORMs don't have an effect;
Steven Pemberton: XHTML Print: IMAGEMAP doesn't have any effect; FORMs don't have an effect; ←
15:25:00 <oedipus> SP: no real normative affect on Print -- only real change is schemas
Steven Pemberton: no real normative affect on Print -- only real change is schemas ←
15:25:45 <oedipus> SP: for XHTML Basic, changes same as for 1.1 -- any test file for Basic can be done for 1.1 with only change of DOCTYPE in HEAD
Steven Pemberton: for XHTML Basic, changes same as for 1.1 -- any test file for Basic can be done for 1.1 with only change of DOCTYPE in HEAD ←
15:26:26 <oedipus> ACTION: Steven - set up test document that can be used for XHTML Basic and XHTML 1.1 (same test file, different DOCTYPES)
ACTION: Steven - set up test document that can be used for XHTML Basic and XHTML 1.1 (same test file, different DOCTYPES) ←
15:26:26 <trackbot> Created ACTION-104 - - set up test document that can be used for XHTML Basic and XHTML 1.1 (same test file, different DOCTYPES) [on Steven Pemberton - due 2009-11-25].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-104 - - set up test document that can be used for XHTML Basic and XHTML 1.1 (same test file, different DOCTYPES) [on Steven Pemberton - due 2009-11-25]. ←
15:26:54 <oedipus> ACTION: Shane - adjust schema for XHTML Basic, 1.1, and Print
ACTION: Shane - adjust schema for XHTML Basic, 1.1, and Print ←
15:26:54 <trackbot> Created ACTION-105 - - adjust schema for XHTML Basic, 1.1, and Print [on Shane McCarron - due 2009-11-25].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-105 - - adjust schema for XHTML Basic, 1.1, and Print [on Shane McCarron - due 2009-11-25]. ←
15:27:27 <oedipus> topic: XHTML2 Draft
15:27:37 <oedipus> SP: need to review action items logged against draft
Steven Pemberton: need to review action items logged against draft ←
15:27:48 <oedipus> SM: i need to produce a note which i haven't yet done
Shane McCarron: i need to produce a note which i haven't yet done ←
15:27:59 <oedipus> [ADJOURNED]
[ADJOURNED] ←
15:28:03 <Zakim> -mgylling
Zakim IRC Bot: -mgylling ←
15:28:06 <Zakim> -ShaneM
Zakim IRC Bot: -ShaneM ←
15:28:08 <Zakim> -MoZ
Scribe problem: the name 'MoZ' does not match any of the 24 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Alessio Cartocci Alexander Graf Christina Bottomley Elias Torres Gerrie Shults Gregory Rosmaita John Kugelman Luca Mascaro Mark Birbeck Markus Gylling Masataka Yakura Michael Rawling Mohamed ZERGAOUI Richard Schwerdtfeger Roland Merrick Sebastian Schnitzenbaumer Shane McCarron Steven Pemberton Susan Borgrink Tina Holmboe Toshihiko Yamakami Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Zakim IRC Bot: -MoZ ←
15:28:17 <Zakim> -Gregory_Rosmaita
Zakim IRC Bot: -Gregory_Rosmaita ←
15:28:18 <Zakim> -Steven
Zakim IRC Bot: -Steven ←
15:28:19 <Zakim> IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has ended
Zakim IRC Bot: IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has ended ←
15:28:20 <Zakim> Attendees were ShaneM, mgylling, Steven, Gregory_Rosmaita, MoZ
Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were ShaneM, mgylling, Steven, Gregory_Rosmaita, MoZ ←
15:28:38 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
Steven Pemberton: rrsagent, make minutes ←
15:28:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/11/18-xhtml-minutes.html Steven
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/11/18-xhtml-minutes.html Steven ←
15:50:21 <Steven> Gregory, Oedipus?
(No events recorded for 21 minutes)
Steven Pemberton: Gregory, Oedipus? ←
15:50:35 <Steven> Did you mean to send that message to XHTML2 or WAI PF?
Steven Pemberton: Did you mean to send that message to XHTML2 or WAI PF? ←
17:39:40 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/wiki/HTML_Task_Force
(No events recorded for 109 minutes)
http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/wiki/HTML_Task_Force ←
Formatted by CommonScribe