14:56:12 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/02/18-ldp-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/02/18-ldp-irc ←
14:56:14 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs public ←
14:56:16 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be LDP
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be LDP ←
14:56:16 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_LDP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 4 minutes
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see SW_LDP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 4 minutes ←
14:56:17 <trackbot> Meeting: Linked Data Platform (LDP) Working Group Teleconference
14:56:17 <trackbot> Date: 18 February 2013
14:58:30 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has now started
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_LDP()10:00AM has now started ←
14:58:36 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←
14:58:48 <AndyS> zakim, IPcaller is me
Andy Seaborne: zakim, IPcaller is me ←
14:58:48 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +AndyS; got it ←
14:59:29 <Zakim> +??P1
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P1 ←
14:59:40 <Zakim> +JohnArwe
Zakim IRC Bot: +JohnArwe ←
15:00:02 <Zakim> +Arnaud
Zakim IRC Bot: +Arnaud ←
15:01:34 <Zakim> +??P5
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P5 ←
15:01:54 <Ashok> zakim, ??P% is me
Ashok Malhotra: zakim, ??P% is me ←
15:01:54 <Zakim> sorry, Ashok, I do not recognize a party named '??P%'
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, Ashok, I do not recognize a party named '??P%' ←
15:02:15 <Ashok> zakim, ??P5 is me
Ashok Malhotra: zakim, ??P5 is me ←
15:02:15 <Zakim> +Ashok; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ashok; got it ←
15:02:41 <Zakim> + +44.208.573.aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: + +44.208.573.aaaa ←
15:04:05 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←
15:04:13 <Zakim> +SteveBattle
Zakim IRC Bot: +SteveBattle ←
15:04:18 <Zakim> +OpenLink_Software
Zakim IRC Bot: +OpenLink_Software ←
15:04:35 <Zakim> +Yves
Zakim IRC Bot: +Yves ←
15:04:37 <Arnaud> zakim, who's here/
Arnaud Le Hors: zakim, who's here/ ←
15:04:37 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who's here/', Arnaud
Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'who's here/', Arnaud ←
15:04:37 <TallTed> Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me ←
15:04:38 <Zakim> +TallTed; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +TallTed; got it ←
15:04:41 <TallTed> Zakim, mute me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, mute me ←
15:04:41 <Zakim> TallTed should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: TallTed should now be muted ←
15:04:49 <Arnaud> zakim, who's here?
Arnaud Le Hors: zakim, who's here? ←
15:04:49 <Zakim> On the phone I see AndyS, ??P1, JohnArwe, Arnaud, Ashok, +44.208.573.aaaa, [IPcaller], SteveBattle, TallTed (muted), Yves
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see AndyS, ??P1, JohnArwe, Arnaud, Ashok, +44.208.573.aaaa, [IPcaller], SteveBattle, TallTed (muted), Yves ←
15:04:52 <Zakim> On IRC I see krp, sergio, kalpa, roger, Ashok, JohnArwe, Zakim, RRSAgent, TallTed, AndyS, oberger, stevebattle, Yves, Arnaud, bblfish, jmvanel, jmv, trackbot, betehess, sandro,
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see krp, sergio, kalpa, roger, Ashok, JohnArwe, Zakim, RRSAgent, TallTed, AndyS, oberger, stevebattle, Yves, Arnaud, bblfish, jmvanel, jmv, trackbot, betehess, sandro, ←
15:04:52 <Zakim> ... ericP
Zakim IRC Bot: ... ericP ←
15:05:12 <sergio> Zakim, I am [IPcaller]
Sergio Fernández: Zakim, I am [IPcaller] ←
15:05:12 <Zakim> ok, sergio, I now associate you with [IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, sergio, I now associate you with [IPcaller] ←
15:05:22 <roger> zakam, I am aaaa
Roger Menday: zakam, I am aaaa ←
15:05:26 <Zakim> +bblfish
Zakim IRC Bot: +bblfish ←
15:05:33 <roger> zakim, I am aaaa
Roger Menday: zakim, I am aaaa ←
15:05:33 <Zakim> +roger; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +roger; got it ←
15:05:36 <Zakim> +EricP
Zakim IRC Bot: +EricP ←
15:05:45 <bblfish> hi
Henry Story: hi ←
15:05:53 <Arnaud> zakim, who's here?
Arnaud Le Hors: zakim, who's here? ←
15:05:53 <Zakim> On the phone I see AndyS, ??P1, JohnArwe, Arnaud, Ashok, roger, [IPcaller], SteveBattle, TallTed (muted), Yves, bblfish, EricP
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see AndyS, ??P1, JohnArwe, Arnaud, Ashok, roger, [IPcaller], SteveBattle, TallTed (muted), Yves, bblfish, EricP ←
15:05:53 <bblfish> I can scribe
Henry Story: I can scribe ←
15:05:56 <Zakim> On IRC I see krp, sergio, kalpa, roger, Ashok, JohnArwe, Zakim, RRSAgent, TallTed, AndyS, oberger, stevebattle, Yves, Arnaud, bblfish, jmvanel, jmv, trackbot, betehess, sandro,
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see krp, sergio, kalpa, roger, Ashok, JohnArwe, Zakim, RRSAgent, TallTed, AndyS, oberger, stevebattle, Yves, Arnaud, bblfish, jmvanel, jmv, trackbot, betehess, sandro, ←
15:05:56 <Zakim> ... ericP
Zakim IRC Bot: ... ericP ←
15:06:35 <Zakim> +??P14
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P14 ←
15:06:39 <bblfish> just getting ahead of the scribe
Henry Story: just getting ahead of the scribe ←
15:06:48 <bblfish> scribe: bblfish
(Scribe set to Henry Story)
15:06:57 <krp> zakim, I am ??P14
Kevin Page: zakim, I am ??P14 ←
15:06:57 <Zakim> +krp; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +krp; got it ←
<bblfish> Topic: Admin
15:06:58 <bblfish> subTopic: Minutes from Feb 11
15:07:13 <bblfish> resolved: Minutes from Feb 11 approved
RESOLVED: Minutes from Feb 11 approved ←
<bblfish> subTopic: Next meetings
15:07:32 <bblfish> Arnaud: Next meeting is next week
Arnaud Le Hors: Next meeting is next week ←
15:07:39 <bblfish> ... F2F is getting closer
... F2F is getting closer ←
15:07:54 <bblfish> ... no sponsors yet for the meeting
... no sponsors yet for the meeting ←
<bblfish> ... what's the plan for food at the meeting?
... what's the plan for food at the meeting? ←
15:08:35 <bblfish> what is the URL for the F2F?
what is the URL for the F2F? ←
15:08:52 <sergio> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/F2F2
Sergio Fernández: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/F2F2 ←
15:08:56 <bblfish> thanks
thanks ←
15:09:00 <sergio> yw
Sergio Fernández: yw ←
15:09:00 <bblfish> who is talking?
who is talking? ←
15:09:15 <stevebattle> That's ericP
Steve Battle: That's ericP ←
15:09:32 <bblfish> ericP: we can use the cafeteria
Eric Prud'hommeaux: we can use the cafeteria ←
15:10:02 <Ashok> Eric, do we have a room yet?
Ashok Malhotra: Eric, do we have a room yet? ←
15:10:32 <bblfish> Topic: Tracking of Actions and Issues
<bblfish> subtopic: Actions
15:10:38 <bblfish> Action-42?
15:10:38 <trackbot> ACTION-42 does not exist.
Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-42 does not exist. ←
15:11:07 <bblfish> Action-36?
15:11:07 <trackbot> ACTION-36 -- John Arwe to [EDITOR] Make changes for ISSUE-42 (moving common props to deployment guide) -- due 2013-01-14 -- PENDINGREVIEW
Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-36 -- John Arwe to [EDITOR] Make changes for ISSUE-42 (moving common props to deployment guide) -- due 2013-01-14 -- PENDINGREVIEW ←
15:11:07 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/36
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/36 ←
15:11:29 <bblfish> Arnaud: anyone against closing it?
Arnaud Le Hors: anyone against closing it? ←
15:11:37 <bblfish> Proposal: Close Action-36
15:11:41 <stevebattle> +1
Steve Battle: +1 ←
15:11:47 <JohnArwe> +1
15:12:03 <Arnaud> +1
Arnaud Le Hors: +1 ←
15:12:04 <bblfish> Arnaud: if we want to turn this into an actual document we need someone to say "I'll do this"
Arnaud Le Hors: if we want to turn this into an actual document we need someone to say "I'll do this" ←
15:12:09 <bblfish> what was this?
what was this? ←
15:12:17 <bblfish> Resolved: Close action-36
15:12:17 <trackbot> Closed ACTION-36 [EDITOR] Make changes for ISSUE-42 (moving common props to deployment guide).
Trackbot IRC Bot: Closed ACTION-36 [EDITOR] Make changes for ISSUE-42 (moving common props to deployment guide). ←
15:12:23 <JohnArwe> turning deployment guide into document
John Arwe: turning deployment guide into document ←
15:12:24 <stevebattle> this was the deployment guide
Steve Battle: this was the deployment guide ←
15:13:02 <bblfish> Arnaud: we'll need an editor for the deployment guide at some point ( that's what "this" above)
Arnaud Le Hors: we'll need an editor for the deployment guide at some point ( that's what "this" above) ←
15:13:11 <bblfish> who is speaking?
who is speaking? ←
15:13:24 <JohnArwe> Sergio volunteers
John Arwe: Sergio volunteers ←
15:13:25 <bblfish> Sergio was saying he could take care of it
Sergio was saying he could take care of it ←
15:13:41 <bblfish> please put yourself on queue, so I can see who speaks
please put yourself on queue, so I can see who speaks ←
15:13:52 <sergio> sorry bblfish
Sergio Fernández: sorry bblfish ←
15:13:55 <bblfish> Arnaud: any other open actions?
Arnaud Le Hors: any other open actions? ←
15:14:08 <bblfish> subTopic: Raised issues
15:14:30 <bblfish> which issue?
which issue? ←
15:14:44 <JohnArwe> issue-49?
15:14:44 <trackbot> ISSUE-49 -- Canonical URL - how to communicate its value to clients -- raised
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-49 -- Canonical URL - how to communicate its value to clients -- raised ←
15:14:44 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/49
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/49 ←
15:14:48 <bblfish> thanks
thanks ←
15:15:38 <bblfish> John is summarising that issue
John is summarising that issue ←
15:16:26 <bblfish> Arnaud: If HTTP experts can help out
Arnaud Le Hors: If HTTP experts can help out ←
15:16:29 <Zakim> -??P1
Zakim IRC Bot: -??P1 ←
15:16:45 <JohnArwe> basically a question of how to communicate the canonical url back to clients. is Location right, Content-Location, or something else?
John Arwe: basically a question of how to communicate the canonical url back to clients. is Location right, Content-Location, or something else? ←
15:17:05 <bblfish> Steve: Content-Location is not used in caches as it may be spoofed
Yves Lafon: Content-Location is not used in caches as it may be spoofed ←
15:17:18 <JohnArwe> s/Steve:/Yves:/
15:17:26 <bblfish> Yves will need to read the issue before opening it.
Yves will need to read the issue before opening it. ←
15:17:30 <bblfish> sorry
sorry ←
15:17:36 <Yves> not before opening it, before commenting ;)
Yves Lafon: not before opening it, before commenting ;) ←
15:17:42 <bblfish> Resolved: open issue-49
15:17:42 <trackbot> Re-opened ISSUE-49 Canonical URL - how to communicate its value to clients.
Trackbot IRC Bot: Re-opened ISSUE-49 Canonical URL - how to communicate its value to clients. ←
15:17:54 <Ashok> q+
Ashok Malhotra: q+ ←
15:18:16 <bblfish> Topic: Test Suite Framework
15:18:51 <JohnArwe> agenda link https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/file/39114b935c70/tests/basic
John Arwe: agenda link https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/file/39114b935c70/tests/basic ←
15:19:25 <bblfish> Arnaud: Alexandre proposed something to create a Test suite at TPAC and now we will listen to what has been hapening
Arnaud Le Hors: Alexandre proposed something to create a Test suite at TPAC and now we will listen to what has been hapening ←
15:19:42 <bblfish> who is speaking again?
who is speaking again? ←
15:19:54 <Ashok> q-
Ashok Malhotra: q- ←
15:19:55 <Arnaud> ericp
Arnaud Le Hors: ericp ←
15:20:22 <bblfish> ericp: the goal was to say what is the initial state and requests and replies and what would be the final state
Eric Prud'hommeaux: the goal was to say what is the initial state and requests and replies and what would be the final state ←
15:20:43 <bblfish> ... looking at https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/file/39114b935c70/tests/basic
... looking at https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/file/39114b935c70/tests/basic ←
15:20:56 <bblfish> ... very similar to the test suite in RDF WG, SPARQL WG, etc...
... very similar to the test suite in RDF WG, SPARQL WG, etc... ←
15:20:57 <Ashok> I want to raise an issue on setting page size
Ashok Malhotra: I want to raise an issue on setting page size ←
15:21:09 <bblfish> (also similar to the WebID test suite we were working on btw.)
(also similar to the WebID test suite we were working on btw.) ←
15:21:46 <bblfish> ... the general structure is that there is a manifest.ttl which says there is a list https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/file/39114b935c70/tests/basic/Manifest.ttl of entries and they are listed in that document
... the general structure is that there is a manifest.ttl which says there is a list https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ldpwg/file/39114b935c70/tests/basic/Manifest.ttl of entries and they are listed in that document ←
15:22:16 <bblfish> The specifics of each entry are listed below in the document
The specifics of each entry are listed below in the document ←
15:22:54 <bblfish> looking at :NetWorth_0_4_post
looking at :NetWorth_0_4_post ←
15:23:10 <bblfish> looking at initialState <NetWorth_0_4.trig>
looking at initialState <NetWorth_0_4.trig> ←
15:23:18 <JohnArwe> 0 = initial number of members in container
John Arwe: 0 = initial number of members in container ←
15:23:24 <JohnArwe> 4 = members/page
15:23:33 <bblfish> ... then there is an action of type post
... then there is an action of type post ←
15:24:03 <bblfish> ... 2 urls: one for the page that gets posted and one for the page that gets created
... 2 urls: one for the page that gets posted and one for the page that gets created ←
15:24:42 <bblfish> ... these are translated from test run internally
... these are translated from test run internally ←
15:24:55 <bblfish> ... then there is a final state in the trig
... then there is a final state in the trig ←
15:26:23 <bblfish> ... in favor of using tests very early on
... in favor of using tests very early on ←
15:26:40 <bblfish> Arnaud: before we can all agree that we can use that we need feeback from other people.
Arnaud Le Hors: before we can all agree that we can use that we need feeback from other people. ←
15:26:42 <sergio> q?
Sergio Fernández: q? ←
15:27:12 <roger> +q
Roger Menday: +q ←
15:27:18 <Zakim> -Ashok
Zakim IRC Bot: -Ashok ←
15:27:23 <bblfish> ericp: there is a line in there called status saying that this is a proposed test. Then one can make test tests
Eric Prud'hommeaux: there is a line in there called status saying that this is a proposed test. Then one can make test tests ←
15:27:36 <sergio> q+
Sergio Fernández: q+ ←
15:27:42 <stevebattle> q+
Steve Battle: q+ ←
15:27:50 <bblfish> Arnaud: looking to see if people are happy with the tests
Arnaud Le Hors: looking to see if people are happy with the tests ←
15:28:01 <Zakim> +[IPcaller.a]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller.a] ←
15:28:22 <bblfish> Someone joined
Someone joined ←
15:28:45 <bblfish> All is self documenting.
All is self documenting. ←
15:29:07 <bblfish> q?
q? ←
15:29:12 <Arnaud> ack roger
Arnaud Le Hors: ack roger ←
15:29:54 <bblfish> roger: It looks pretty good, and the only thing I would ask is ... the nice thing is how it is broken down. It would be nice if it were possible to compose these atomic parts into a larger journey
Roger Menday: It looks pretty good, and the only thing I would ask is ... the nice thing is how it is broken down. It would be nice if it were possible to compose these atomic parts into a larger journey ←
15:30:41 <Arnaud> zakim, who's on the call?
Arnaud Le Hors: zakim, who's on the call? ←
15:30:41 <Zakim> On the phone I see AndyS, JohnArwe, Arnaud, roger, [IPcaller], SteveBattle, TallTed (muted), Yves, bblfish, EricP, krp, [IPcaller.a]
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see AndyS, JohnArwe, Arnaud, roger, [IPcaller], SteveBattle, TallTed (muted), Yves, bblfish, EricP, krp, [IPcaller.a] ←
15:30:42 <bblfish> ericp: Networth can be run as individual tests, but running them in sequence should be possible
Eric Prud'hommeaux: Networth can be run as individual tests, but running them in sequence should be possible ←
15:31:00 <Arnaud> zakim, IPCaller is sergio
Arnaud Le Hors: zakim, IPCaller is sergio ←
15:31:00 <Zakim> +sergio; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +sergio; got it ←
15:31:06 <bblfish> ... line 42, the final state is Net..404 and the next one has that as an initial state
... line 42, the final state is Net..404 and the next one has that as an initial state ←
15:31:06 <Arnaud> q?
Arnaud Le Hors: q? ←
15:31:23 <bblfish> eg: rdft:finalState <NetWorth_4_4.trig> .
eg: rdft:finalState <NetWorth_4_4.trig> . ←
15:31:31 <bblfish> or rdft:initialState <NetWorth_3_4.trig> ;
or rdft:initialState <NetWorth_3_4.trig> ; ←
15:31:36 <Arnaud> ack IPCaller
Arnaud Le Hors: ack IPCaller ←
15:31:49 <Arnaud> ack [IPcaller]
Arnaud Le Hors: ack [IPcaller] ←
15:32:04 <Arnaud> ack stevebattle
Arnaud Le Hors: ack stevebattle ←
15:32:04 <bblfish> sergio: already started implementing something like this, and will have an implementation too
Sergio Fernández: already started implementing something like this, and will have an implementation too ←
15:32:21 <bblfish> stevebattle: Is there a process for adding our own tests.
Steve Battle: Is there a process for adding our own tests. ←
15:32:31 <bblfish> ericp: every body has access to hg
Eric Prud'hommeaux: every body has access to hg ←
15:32:51 <bblfish> stevebattle: would be nice to have links to URIs for individual use case
Steve Battle: would be nice to have links to URIs for individual use case ←
15:33:01 <Zakim> -[IPcaller.a]
Zakim IRC Bot: -[IPcaller.a] ←
15:33:05 <bblfish> ericp: needs a predicate for that but +1
Eric Prud'hommeaux: needs a predicate for that but +1 ←
15:33:31 <stevebattle> I'll research that (URI for link to use-case).
Steve Battle: I'll research that (URI for link to use-case). ←
15:33:41 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←
15:33:54 <Arnaud> q?
Arnaud Le Hors: q? ←
15:34:13 <bblfish> ericp is not married to the naming converntion,
ericp is not married to the naming converntion, ←
15:34:24 <stevebattle> Yes, '5 of 4' hints that this naming scheme might get unmanageable.
Steve Battle: Yes, '5 of 4' hints that this naming scheme might get unmanageable. ←
15:35:13 <bblfish> Arnaud: if people want to add tests how do they choose their nameing the tests.
Arnaud Le Hors: if people want to add tests how do they choose their nameing the tests. ←
15:35:27 <JohnArwe> zakim, [IPCaller] is sergio
John Arwe: zakim, [IPCaller] is sergio ←
15:35:27 <Zakim> +sergio; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +sergio; got it ←
15:35:29 <bblfish> ericp: one could annotate the tests with tests attributes
Eric Prud'hommeaux: one could annotate the tests with tests attributes ←
15:35:46 <bblfish> ... so one can then query the tests to see if it has particular features
... so one can then query the tests to see if it has particular features ←
15:36:06 <bblfish> +1 seems good to me
+1 seems good to me ←
15:36:26 <Arnaud> q?
Arnaud Le Hors: q? ←
15:37:02 <bblfish> Arnaud: people should try seeing if they can run these tests.
Arnaud Le Hors: people should try seeing if they can run these tests. ←
15:37:59 <bblfish> Topic: Open Issues
<bblfish> subtopic: LDP Model Section
15:38:14 <JohnArwe> did you want to go back to ashok?
John Arwe: did you want to go back to ashok? ←
15:38:37 <bblfish> Arnaud: planned to discuss the model issue there were two proposals, Eric is sick, so not much to talk about
Arnaud Le Hors: planned to discuss the model issue there were two proposals, Erik is sick, so not much to talk about ←
15:38:50 <bblfish> s/Eric/Erik/
15:39:21 <stevebattle> q+
Steve Battle: q+ ←
15:39:28 <bblfish> Arnaud: leave it up to the editors perhaps to take this?
Arnaud Le Hors: leave it up to the editors perhaps to take this? ←
15:39:28 <Arnaud> ack stevebattle
Arnaud Le Hors: ack stevebattle ←
15:39:56 <bblfish> stevebattle: prefers bblfish's pragraph without new concepts being involved
Steve Battle: prefers bblfish's paragraph without new concepts being involved ←
15:40:06 <roger> +q
Roger Menday: +q ←
15:40:11 <stevebattle> might be interesting
Steve Battle: might be interesting ←
15:40:14 <bblfish> Arnaud: straw poll on those two versions
Arnaud Le Hors: straw poll on those two versions ←
15:40:14 <Arnaud> ack roger
Arnaud Le Hors: ack roger ←
15:40:20 <JohnArwe> s/pragraph/paragraph/
15:40:24 <AndyS> +1 to Henry's approach
Andy Seaborne: +1 to Henry's approach ←
15:40:25 <bblfish> roger: is not happy with either of them.
Roger Menday: is not happy with either of them. ←
15:40:44 <bblfish> roger: proposes to move this to F2F
Roger Menday: proposes to move this to F2F ←
15:41:01 <roger> correction : is not 100% happy with either of them ...
Roger Menday: correction : is not 100% happy with either of them ... ←
15:41:01 <JohnArwe> q+
15:41:08 <bblfish> Arnaud: we need to converge on a piece of text. Let's pick one and discuss the changed to make it
Arnaud Le Hors: we need to converge on a piece of text. Let's pick one and discuss the changed to make it ←
15:41:16 <Arnaud> ack john
Arnaud Le Hors: ack john ←
15:42:38 <bblfish> Arnaud: straw poll to settle on Henry Story (bblfish)'s proposal to get going and move on from there as a starting point
Arnaud Le Hors: straw poll to settle on Henry Story (bblfish)'s proposal to get going and move on from there as a starting point ←
15:42:39 <JohnArwe> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/ISSUE-37#Proposed_Spec_Section_.28for_the_LDP_Spec.29
John Arwe: ISSUE-37#Proposed_Spec_Section_.28for_the_LDP_Spec.29">http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/ISSUE-37#Proposed_Spec_Section_.28for_the_LDP_Spec.29 ←
15:42:40 <Arnaud> PROPOSED: select Henry's text as the status quo for the proposed section
PROPOSED: select Henry's text as the status quo for the proposed section ←
15:42:43 <stevebattle> +1
Steve Battle: +1 ←
15:42:45 <bblfish> +1
+1 ←
15:42:50 <sergio> +1
Sergio Fernández: +1 ←
15:42:59 <Ashok> I think we should wait until F2F
Ashok Malhotra: I think we should wait until F2F ←
15:43:01 <roger> +0
Roger Menday: +0 ←
15:43:04 <krp> +0
Kevin Page: +0 ←
15:43:11 <roger> +1 to Ashok
Roger Menday: +1 to Ashok ←
15:43:33 <JohnArwe> +0
15:43:37 <bblfish> ( ok I had to vote for my own proposal )
( ok I had to vote for my own proposal ) ←
15:43:52 <nmihindu> +0
Nandana Mihindukulasooriya: +0 ←
15:43:55 <JohnArwe> I have no criticisms of Henry's fwiw
John Arwe: I have no criticisms of Henry's fwiw ←
15:43:59 <bblfish> Arnaud: one had to try this out
Arnaud Le Hors: one had to try this out ←
15:44:17 <bblfish> ... we'll leave this for later, and move on
... we'll leave this for later, and move on ←
15:44:22 <bblfish> subtopic: ISSUE-13
15:44:22 <trackbot> ISSUE-13 -- Include clarifications about BPC representations that include member triples -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-13 -- Include clarifications about BPC representations that include member triples -- open ←
15:44:22 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/13
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/13 ←
15:45:22 <stevebattle> q+
Steve Battle: q+ ←
15:45:46 <Arnaud> ack stevebattle
Arnaud Le Hors: ack stevebattle ←
15:46:30 <bblfish> stevebattle: agrees that it is useful to represent these non membership properties with a container and that it is worth adding that metadata to the container ( sent a longer mail to the list)
Steve Battle: agrees that it is useful to represent these non membership properties with a container and that it is worth adding that metadata to the container ( sent a longer mail to the list) ←
15:46:38 <JohnArwe> q+
15:46:44 <roger> +q
Roger Menday: +q ←
15:46:47 <JohnArwe> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp-wg/2013Feb/0108.html is where I suggested answered
John Arwe: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp-wg/2013Feb/0108.html is where I suggested answered ←
15:46:49 <bblfish> Arnaud: there seem to be two seperate questions in there
Arnaud Le Hors: there seem to be two seperate questions in there ←
15:46:52 <Arnaud> ack john
Arnaud Le Hors: ack john ←
15:46:57 <bblfish> ( can someone summarise those ? )
( can someone summarise those ? ) ←
15:47:21 <stevebattle> we could 'inlaw' it
Steve Battle: we could 'inlaw' it ←
15:47:35 <bblfish> JohnArwe: I like the flexibility. But if you want to update the members go to the members URL that's what its for.
John Arwe: I like the flexibility. But if you want to update the members go to the members URL that's what its for. ←
15:47:58 <Arnaud> ack roger
Arnaud Le Hors: ack roger ←
15:48:02 <bblfish> ... does not understand how the conclusion was drawn from the antecedent.
... does not understand how the conclusion was drawn from the antecedent. ←
15:48:33 <bblfish> roger: summarise if you have collection and have a bunch of members of the collection,
Roger Menday: summarise if you have collection and have a bunch of members of the collection, ←
15:48:51 <JohnArwe> q+
15:48:54 <stevebattle> yes - That's what I would call the metadata, as opposed to the data in the LDPR itself.
Steve Battle: yes - That's what I would call the metadata, as opposed to the data in the LDPR itself. ←
15:49:03 <bblfish> Arnaud: the minimum should be a list of triples on the member of resource.
Arnaud Le Hors: the minimum should be a list of triples on the member of resource. ←
15:49:08 <bblfish> q+
q+ ←
15:49:25 <bblfish> +1 for stevebattle's point
+1 for stevebattle's point ←
15:50:01 <stevebattle> Membership triples are those that use the membership predicate, no?
Steve Battle: Membership triples are those that use the membership predicate, no? ←
15:50:23 <JohnArwe> +1 steveB's membership triple def.
John Arwe: +1 steveB's membership triple def. ←
15:50:32 <JohnArwe> q-
15:50:35 <bblfish> Arnaud: if you change the representation of the elements of an LDPR on a container what does it mean
Arnaud Le Hors: if you change the representation of the elements of an LDPR on a container what does it mean ←
15:50:50 <Arnaud> ack bblfish
Arnaud Le Hors: ack bblfish ←
15:51:36 <JohnArwe> q+
15:52:19 <bblfish> bblfish: I was arguing it should be metadata because its less dangerous
Henry Story: I was arguing it should be metadata because its less dangerous ←
15:52:37 <stevebattle> Let's leave the door open...
Steve Battle: Let's leave the door open... ←
15:52:38 <ericP> i note that the NetWorth example includes e.g. stock prices in the container listing
Eric Prud'hommeaux: i note that the NetWorth example includes e.g. stock prices in the container listing ←
15:52:49 <Arnaud> ack john
Arnaud Le Hors: ack john ←
15:52:51 <bblfish> Arnaud: that was the point of the issue, yes. So perhaps people don't want to close the door... Just wanted this to be highlighted.
Arnaud Le Hors: that was the point of the issue, yes. So perhaps people don't want to close the door... Just wanted this to be highlighted. ←
15:53:22 <bblfish> John: there seems to be use cases where it is needed
John Arwe: there seems to be use cases where it is needed ←
15:54:08 <bblfish> ... This has to do with how people are going to use that. It needs to be permitted for efficiency reasons.
... This has to do with how people are going to use that. It needs to be permitted for efficiency reasons. ←
15:54:13 <bblfish> q+
q+ ←
15:54:22 <Arnaud> ack bblfish
Arnaud Le Hors: ack bblfish ←
15:54:44 <bblfish> that's it
that's it ←
15:55:08 <bblfish> bblfish: just if we can have the use cases that explain the problem
Henry Story: just if we can have the use cases that explain the problem ←
15:55:08 <stevebattle> And if this u/c isn't in uc&r, help me write one for the next rev.
Steve Battle: And if this u/c isn't in uc&r, help me write one for the next rev. ←
15:55:14 <bblfish> subtopic: Issue-21
15:55:14 <trackbot> ISSUE-21 -- container affordances -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-21 -- container affordances -- open ←
15:55:14 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/21
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/21 ←
15:56:10 <JohnArwe> Ashok's "use a property" suggestion was #2 here: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp-wg/2013Feb/0014.html
John Arwe: Ashok's "use a property" suggestion was #2 here: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp-wg/2013Feb/0014.html ←
15:56:29 <bblfish> Arnaud: summarising the issue
Arnaud Le Hors: summarising the issue ←
15:56:46 <bblfish> ( bblfish not yet very confident about this as I have not implmented it )
( bblfish not yet very confident about this as I have not implmented it ) ←
15:58:21 <bblfish> stevebattle: reverse membership predicate pops up a lot
Steve Battle: reverse membership predicate pops up a lot ←
15:58:30 <roger> +q
Roger Menday: +q ←
15:58:34 <bblfish> ... something like rev="..."
... something like rev="..." ←
15:58:43 <bblfish> ... cropped up a lot in calimachus
... cropped up a lot in calimachus ←
15:58:54 <Arnaud> ack roger
Arnaud Le Hors: ack roger ←
15:59:39 <JohnArwe> q+
15:59:41 <bblfish> roger: the spec at the moment has a link from the LDPC to the LDPR and there is not one going the other direction. There should be a link the other way around
Roger Menday: the spec at the moment has a link from the LDPC to the LDPR and there is not one going the other direction. There should be a link the other way around ←
16:00:00 <bblfish> q+
q+ ←
16:00:05 <Arnaud> ack john
Arnaud Le Hors: ack john ←
16:00:31 <bblfish> john, is asking... :-/
john, is asking... :-/ ←
16:00:31 <stevebattle> Navigability (within a given RDF graph such as the LDPC) isn't the issue. Links are bi-navigable.
Steve Battle: Navigability (within a given RDF graph such as the LDPC) isn't the issue. Links are bi-navigable. ←
16:00:36 <bblfish> lsot the question
lsot the question ←
16:00:38 <Arnaud> ack bblfish
Arnaud Le Hors: ack bblfish ←
16:00:53 <stevebattle> This is an addenda, not a replacement.
Steve Battle: This is an addenda, not a replacement. ←
16:01:19 <JohnArwe> as an addendum (per steveb's verbal answer), seems reasonable to first order. as henry asked earlier, do we have any use cases to help understand this more deeply?
John Arwe: as an addendum (per steveb's verbal answer), seems reasonable to first order. as henry asked earlier, do we have any use cases to help understand this more deeply? ←
16:01:23 <roger> if we are trying to expand the topic of affordances, then issue 21 starts to cross-over with other issues
Roger Menday: if we are trying to expand the topic of affordances, then ISSUE-21 starts to cross-over with other issues ←
16:01:27 <bblfish> bblfish: looking for help to see where the use cases for this whole framework is
Henry Story: looking for help to see where the use cases for this whole framework is ←
16:01:32 <roger> for example, issue 26
Roger Menday: for example, ISSUE-26 ←
16:01:38 <stevebattle> wishful thinking :)
Steve Battle: wishful thinking :) ←
16:01:52 <bblfish> Arnaud: we may need to have two issues one for affordances and one for reverse membership.
Arnaud Le Hors: we may need to have two issues one for affordances and one for reverse membership. ←
16:01:57 <JohnArwe> issue-32?
16:01:57 <trackbot> ISSUE-32 -- How can clients discover that a resource is an LDPR or LDPC, and what features are supported? -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-32 -- How can clients discover that a resource is an LDPR or LDPC, and what features are supported? -- open ←
16:01:57 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/32
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/32 ←
16:02:00 <bblfish> Arnaud: lets close the call
Arnaud Le Hors: lets close the call ←
16:02:06 <bblfish> Arnaud: talk next week
Arnaud Le Hors: talk next week ←
16:02:08 <JohnArwe> that may be the general case issue arnaud
John Arwe: that may be the general case issue arnaud ←
16:02:08 <stevebattle> bye
Steve Battle: bye ←
16:02:11 <Zakim> -TallTed
Zakim IRC Bot: -TallTed ←
16:02:11 <bblfish> Arnaud: meeting is adjourned
Arnaud Le Hors: meeting is adjourned ←
16:02:13 <Zakim> -roger
Zakim IRC Bot: -roger ←
16:02:14 <Zakim> -AndyS
Zakim IRC Bot: -AndyS ←
16:02:14 <Zakim> -sergio
Zakim IRC Bot: -sergio ←
16:02:15 <bblfish> thanks
thanks ←
16:02:16 <Zakim> -Yves
Zakim IRC Bot: -Yves ←
16:02:16 <Zakim> -JohnArwe
Zakim IRC Bot: -JohnArwe ←
16:02:17 <Zakim> -EricP
Zakim IRC Bot: -EricP ←
16:02:18 <Zakim> -SteveBattle
Zakim IRC Bot: -SteveBattle ←
16:02:19 <Zakim> -Arnaud
Zakim IRC Bot: -Arnaud ←
16:02:21 <Zakim> -bblfish
Zakim IRC Bot: -bblfish ←
16:07:22 <Zakim> disconnecting the lone participant, krp, in SW_LDP()10:00AM
(No events recorded for 5 minutes)
Zakim IRC Bot: disconnecting the lone participant, krp, in SW_LDP()10:00AM ←
16:07:23 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended ←
16:07:23 <Zakim> Attendees were AndyS, JohnArwe, Arnaud, Ashok, +44.208.573.aaaa, SteveBattle, Yves, TallTed, bblfish, roger, EricP, krp, sergio
Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were AndyS, JohnArwe, Arnaud, Ashok, +44.208.573.aaaa, SteveBattle, Yves, TallTed, bblfish, roger, EricP, krp, sergio ←
Formatted by CommonScribe