<scribe> ScribeNick: ArtB

<scribe> Scribe: Art

<rbyers> can anyone see this? IRC seems to be acting up...

<sangwhan> rbyers: I can see your messages

Tweak agenda

AB: I posted a Draft agenda yesterday http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pointer-events/2013JulSep/0048.html. Any change requests?
... after the Draft agenda was submitted, a question was asked re the relationship between the PE spec's pointerType and EMMA spec http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pointer-events/2013JulSep/0050.html. We can add this to the end of meeting provided we have time or reply on the list.
... any preference?

JR: I'd like to read it before discussing

RB: same here

JR: your suggestion Art probably makes sense

<jrossi> http://www.w3.org/TR/emma11/

… I'm not sure of the impl status

AB: good question

… pointerType ref is new in EMMA 1.1 (does not occur in the EMMA 1.0 REC)

… ok, so let's leave that for the list

RB: should we pay attention to this spec?

… or is it orthoganal

JR: I don't have any context

AV: same with me

AB: same here

JR: it could overlap with PE
... not sure if they use an event model like PE does

AB: please everyone read up on this EMMA vs PE question

CR implementation status

AB: any new news re implementations of the Pointer Events CR?

RB: re Chrome

… no big `landings`

… still need to re-architect gestures

… think we have consensus

… still need to `prove in code`

… it's a big job

… within a few weeks think we can land an impl of touch-action

AV: can you give any dates?

RB: depends on the reviewers

… my best guess is on the order of "3 weeks"

… Without this change, would have interop problems

… so we are being careful here re interop

AV: do you think you'll be ready for testing by end of October?

RB: that's probably pushing it

… probably won't be feature complete re touch-action by end of October

<rbyers> Bug to follow progress on chromium event flow re-architecture necessary for touch-ACTION: https://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=294239

MB: in Gecko, still have some Mozilla people + Msft Open Tech working on impl

… for touch-action still mostly talking about design

… we don't have any dates for completion yet

AB: is Rob O'Callahan part of the discussion?

MB: yes

Test Suite status and plans

AB: Matt submitted some comments re Microsoft's tests PR324 https://github.com/w3c/web-platform-tests/pull/324.

<mbrubeck> On a side note, I'm working on a Firefox feature that would be much easier to build if we had touch-action implemented already: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=915328

AB: a few of us (me, Matt, Cathy, Rick) agreed to review the tests based on a division by Matt.

<mbrubeck> issue 45?

MB: I added the split/division to Tracker

<mbrubeck> issue 45

AB: ah, ok, good

action-45?

<trackbot> action-45 -- Matt Brubeck to Divide up msft's tests for review by rick, cathy, art and matt -- due 2013-09-17 -- CLOSED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/pointerevents/track/actions/45

AB: my status is that the PE review was trumped by a commitment to review Web IDL tests

… but that is done

… so I will Q up PE review next

RB: I just started looking

… I have some questions about the process

… As we review, should we run them?

… i.e. to test the tests or just review

… Would love to test with Polymer or something

… I'd feel more comfortable if I can run the test

MB: yes, I agree need to run them

AB: I agree

AV: can run with Polymer and Chrom

JR: if wait until Oct 18, IE11 on Windows 8.1 will be available

… expect banners to "get Windows 8.1 for free"

RB: should people then wait until Oct 18 to test?

JR: check my e-mail; notes IE11 preview for Windows 7
... the tests we submitted were run against IE for Windows 8.1

AV: are there other submissions?

AB: yes and Scott is blocking on the review of Microsoft's tests is complete

SG: yes, that's true

CC: I'll try to test them on Windows 7 and IE11 Preview

… what about Windows Phone?

… what can we expect there?

JR: Windows Phone has the prefixed version of PE

MB: the TestTWF tests, what are we doing with them?

SG: Dave and I will meet in two weeks and go work on this

MB: thanks

AB: if you can help with any reviews, please do so

touch-action comment by ROC

AB: Mozilla's Robert O'Callahan submitted a comment "touch-action on elements that aren't scrolled by their nearest scrollable element ancestor" http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pointer-events/2013JulSep/0047.html
... Matt clarified Rob is working on the Gecko implementation

JR: I think we can dig back to previous discussions with Tab and the CSS WG

… in the specific example, the behavior Rob describes is correct

… but not correct that it can't be prevented

… needs another touch-action rule to address this example

MB: can prevent on the inner most without affecting outter elements

… if touches on inner element never scrooll, touches on other elements should scroll

AB: Jacob, would you please reply to Rob?

JR: sure

MB: discussed on a Mozilla list

… question about if the algorithm

RB: algorithm is defined in terms of the DOM

… is the behavior in IE just dependent on the DOM

… and cannot be changed by altering the CSS

JR: that's correct

RB: with respect to compat, I think we just want to follow what IE did (keeping all things equal)

MB: this came up in the context of scrollable rectangles

… we are fine with either behavior, just want to make it clear

… and documented

JR: we've been thinking about test cases for this scenario

RB: that would be great

… f.ex. "scroll here and X should happen"

<scribe> ACTION: jacob Reply to Rob O'Callahan's e-mail re touch-action [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2013/10/01-pointerevents-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-51 - Reply to rob o'callahan's e-mail re touch-action [on Jacob Rossi - due 2013-10-08].

AoB

AB: we have some test cases

RB: I think we still need test cases, especially for touch-action

… don't want people to think we are "in good shape"

AV: we have some touch-action tests that we will submit

AB: great

RB: would be interested in hearing from Scott re Polymer and jQuery

SG: still working on it

… it is complicated

… lots of layers

… and difficult to debug

… best we can do is to test some demos

… error reporting isn't very good

… need to think more on how to make progress

… may have to create a pollyfill for old IE

… (IE 6, 7)

… So far, only one place we had a problem polyfilling and that is the getter

RB: please feel free to create PRs for Polymer

SG: hopefully we will soon have something to send

RB: ok, awesome, thanks for the update

AB: meeting adjourned

This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.138  of Date: 2013-04-25 13:59:11  
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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/innner/inner/
Found ScribeNick: ArtB
Found Scribe: Art
Present: Art_Barstow Jacob_Rossi Scott_González Matt_Brubeck Asir_Vedamuthu Cathy_Chan Rick_Byers Sangwhan_Moon(IRC_only) Sangwhan_Moon
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-pointer-events/2013JulSep/0048.html
Got date from IRC log name: 01 Oct 2013
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2013/10/01-pointerevents-minutes.html
People with action items: jacob reply

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