See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 16 April 2013
<ReimundoGarcia> i am aaaa
<BobLund> zakin, aagg is me
trackbot-ng, start telcon
<trackbot> Meeting: HTML Media Task Force Teleconference
<trackbot> Date: 16 April 2013
<scribe> scribe: joesteele
<ddorwin> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2013Apr/0042.html
noted
<adrianba> ACTION-10?
<trackbot> ACTION-10 -- Adrian Bateman to discuss bug 19208 with johnsim -- due 2013-04-08 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/media/track/actions/10
<ddorwin> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=19208
adrianba: topic we have been
discussing is the expected lifetime of the session
... we compared the levels people had for the session and the
events that get fired
... in the process of writing up how we think it should
work
... and how we should solve which events get fired when the key
system already has a key
... receive a needkey, call createSession, key system has all
the info it needs, how should it signal that to the app?
... trying to writeup that lifecycle
johnsim: including that app may
require that you get a refresh of the key
... Mark you mentioned that some applications may want
that
... so this is a state transition diagram. Nothing to present
as yet but should have something shortly
ddorwin: new due date?
adrianba: should have something soon
<adrianba> ACTION-10 due 15 apr
<trackbot> Set ACTION-10 Discuss bug 19208 with johnsim due date to 15 apr.
<adrianba> action-10 due 22 apr
<trackbot> Set ACTION-10 Discuss bug 19208 with johnsim due date to 22 apr.
<adrianba> ACTION-11?
<trackbot> ACTION-11 -- Mark Watson to write a proposal for the case where the data is not available to the JS -- due 2013-04-02 -- OPEN
<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/media/track/actions/11
johnsim: I see a second action
for Mark as well
... move on to next agenda item?
markw: haven't done it -- not
sure what it refers to
... will go back to the thread an try to determine what it
means
<adrianba> i think the action makes sense in the context of the minutes
ddorwin: we left error related ones last week, but do we want to discuss the F2F first?
+1
johnsim: do we have a mtg room?
how many hours? has that been discussed?
... that will determine what we can accomplish
<acolwell> yes
johnsim: are all editors attending
ddorwin: yes
johnsim: want to get to FPWD, if
we have triaged down to the bugs that must be addressed for
FPWD
... we should handle those ASAP
adrianba: think we addressed all
of those bugs
... we were gated on the chairs to resolve. don't think we are
waiting on those
johnsim: 19208 is something that
we should address - how we clarify session in the spec
... should be on the agenda
adrianba: paul was investigating
whether we have a breakout space
... we have asked for 2x 90 minutes slots the afternoon of the
first day
... this would be in the full meeting
johnsim: is that the right place to get into the nitty gritty?
adrianba: that is what we did in November
?1: paul said we are very tight on space
ddorwin: might want to go after
some not spec-specific stuff like origin that we might get some
in-the-room expertise on
... there are several like that
<ddorwin> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=21155
<ddorwin> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=21203
<ddorwin> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=21569
<ddorwin> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=20798
johnsim: it seems valuable to go
into the mtg with someone owning each bug
... do you agree David?
ddorwin: definitely should have owner and know what we want to get out of each session
johnsim: definitely want to have an idea of the outcome we want. Should we discuss each of them now?
ddorwin: think we discussed each
but don't remember the outcome
... I have been digging through the minutes to update each bug
with our discussion -- not enough information yet
johnsim: so we should update the bugs with the remaining information from the minutes?
ddorwin: yes
johnsim: do we have concensus that these are what we should discuss?
<ddorwin> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=21586
<adrianba> we have one session for EME and one for MSE
joesteele: should we be prepared to discuss the not-technical issues brought up?
adrianba: yes - some async discussion about giving the UA opportunity to put up permission UI, we might want to cover that in more detail in the group
<ddorwin> I believe that discussion came out of https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=20991
johnsim: Adrian were the slots requested for MSE and EME?
<adrianba> F2F -> http://www.w3.org/wiki/HTML/wg/2013-04-Agenda#Potential_Topics
adrianba: yes
<adrianba> Privacy issue -> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=20965
johnsim: what order should we take these in?
<ddorwin> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/html-media/raw-file/tip/encrypted-media/encrypted-media.html#error-codes
ddorwin: revisit the original
list
... specific bug for MEDIA_KEYERR_CLIENT
<ddorwin> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=16737
<ddorwin> Should MEDIA_KEYERR_CLIENT be two separate errors?
ddorwin: should be some other errors I think, do we want to make this generic? think we need a larger discussion about the errors
johnsim: have there been implementations that show these are not sufficient
<adrianba> MEDIA_KEYERR_OUTPUT (numeric value 4)There is no available output device with the required characteristics for the content protection system.
ddorwin: not sure what different between 4 and 5
+q
<adrianba> MEDIA_KEYERR_HARDWARECHANGE (numeric value 5)A hardware configuration change caused a content protection error.
johnsim: should clarify these if not clear
markw: your description of those
two is correct
... MEDIA_KEYERR_HARDWARECHANGE is when outputs have
changed
ddorwin: was a specific bug about how to use this?
johnsim: an action item that we had not worked on?
adrianba: bugs we took several
months ago and things have changed since we took them
... we have been trying to avoid errors when we playback
content, rather signal to the app that it will not get the
protection it was asking for
... allow it to vary the content as a result. in general that
is the approach we want to take, to avoid errors if
possible.
... the other part was for debugging we find that the level of
granularity will not be sufficient, so we will need a system
code to allow apps to understand what is going on
... trying to understand what the balance is between generic
errors and the system level codes
joesteele: my definition of MEDIA_KEYERR_HARDWARECHANGE was very different -- tied to device binding
johnsim: this is what can lead to
a bad interop
... might be worth going over each error and discuss what each
actually means and propose text
... in this case we may be surfacing the need for a new error
code
... e.g. what joe and adrian were suggesting
ddorwin: for those of us with CDM
implementations to go back to our teams and determine what
errors are actually needed
... maybe using this list as a prompt
... related to this, adrians proposal to not have as many
generic errors, it would be nice for apps to display a generic
error.
+q
ddorwin: for example - you need a
new client, or you plugged in a bad output
... application may not want to have a detailed error msg for
each key system
... may want a more general error
... adrian were you thinking we would still have a general
error signal?
... or not have this
s/\.\. or/... or/
adrianba: had not reached a
proposal yet, might be the same event or a different one
... just that we may want an event to signal that status
... think david summarized the right question - do we need more
generic errors? or is that impractical and we should relay on
something system specific?
joesteele: need to focus on errors that mean something to the user
markw: yes - have something that
the user can take an action for
... maybe have one more error that a system specific error has
occured
johnsim: couple minutes left --
what next?
... should we adjourn?
ddorwin: I will be spending lots of time on bugs, please other editors do the same and folks who care about the bugs so we are ready
<adrianba> +1
johnsim: see you all at the F2F -- next Tuesday/Wednesday
<adrianba> thanks for chairing and scribing
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.137 of Date: 2012/09/20 20:19:01 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/markw: yes/adrianba: yes/ Succeeded: s/original order/original list/ Succeeded: s/media key err client/MEDIA_KEYERR_CLIENT/ FAILED: s/\.\. or/... or/ Succeeded: s/adrianba: yes - /markw:yes - / Found Scribe: joesteele Inferring ScribeNick: joesteele Default Present: +1.212.512.aaaa, +1.417.671.aabb, +1.417.671.aacc, glenn, johnsim, markw, +1.408.536.aadd, +1.425.214.aaee, joesteele, Bin_Hu, ReimundoGarcia, +1.425.202.aaff, BobLund, adrianba, Aaron_Colwell WARNING: Replacing previous Present list. (Old list: ReimundoGarcia, johnsim, glenn, markw, joesteele, Bin_Hu) Use 'Present+ ... ' if you meant to add people without replacing the list, such as: <dbooth> Present+ ReimundoGarcia, wseltzer WARNING: Replacing previous Present list. (Old list: ReimundoGarcia, wseltzer) Use 'Present+ ... ' if you meant to add people without replacing the list, such as: <dbooth> Present+ ddorwin Present: ddorwin glenn johnsim markw Bin_Hu ReimundoGarcia BobLund adrianba Aaron_Colwell joesteele wseltzer acolwell Regrets: paulc Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2013Apr/0042.html Found Date: 16 Apr 2013 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2013/04/16-html-media-minutes.html People with action items:[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]