See also: IRC log, previous 2008-09-18
ACTION: [CONTINUES] Ben to close loop with Danny. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action19]
Ben: wrote to Danny, don't have a response
ACTION: [DONE] Ben to determine how to highlight RDFa at TPAC [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action17]
Ralph: 2 opportunities
-> TP Agenda
Ralph: 2 lightning talk sessions
... also a "Semantic Web Demo" session
Jeremy, Mark: we'll be at TP
Ben: showing the Drupal work, or SearchMonkey,
or Ubiquity w/RDFa would be good
... we have more showy stuff than last year
Ralph: let Ivan know if you have a brief demo you could offer
Jeremy: I might offer a demo
ACTION: [DONE] Ben to log Danny's issue to tracker. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/18-rdfa-minutes.html#action18]
-> issue 128; PR Comment: Default Graph
ACTION: [CONTINUES] Mark create base wizard suitable for cloning [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action12]
ACTION: [CONTINUES] Mark write foaf examples for wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action13]
ACTION: [DONE] Ben to figure out *how* to do the namespace-doc GRDDL thing [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action18]
Ben: Ralph went ahead and did it
ACTION: [DROPPED] Jeremy review and consider expanding the description of TopBraid in the RDFa wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action02]
ACTION: [CONTINUES] Jeremy to demonstrate GRDDL with XHTML/RDFa once the NS URI is set up. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action03]
ACTION: [CONTINUES] Manu talk with Jamie McCarthy about an AskSlashdot piece [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action04]
ACTION: [DONE] Manu to upload test harness source code to W3C CVS. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action07]
-> RDFa CVS repository on dev.w3.org [Manu 2008-09-30]
ACTION: [CONTINUES] Manu to write summary for Semantic Web Use Cases for Ivan. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action09]
ACTION: [CONTINUES] Manu write the perl code for Slashdot. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action11]
ACTION: [CONTINUES] Michael to create 'RDFa for uF users' on RDFa Wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action14]
ACTION: [CONTINUES] Ralph think about RSS+RDFa [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action15]
ACTION: [DONE] Ralph to make http://www.w3.org/2008/07/rdfa-xslt happen [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action16]
ACTION: [DONE] Shane to update XHTML ns document to point to new XSLT URI [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/11-rdfa-minutes.html#action17]
Ralph: last day to request publication is 13
October
... last pubs before TPAC will be 16 Oct
Ben: we've had a couple of negative comments
about the Primer
... I wish folk would send us pointers to their blogs
... do we _need_ to beef it up?
Mark: I haven't looked at it in a while but I do remember having some thoughts
-> RDFa Trials and Travails ... [Michael 2008-09-25]
Ben: do we _want_ to be telling people how to define vocabularies in this document?
Mark: we'd talked before about the purpose of
the Primer
... probably don't want to get into explaining custom vocabularies
... but if we don't then perhaps we shouldn't mention them at all
... we have a powerful system in RDFa but what really makes it useful to Joe
Public is when we drop namespace prefixes and make it look more like
microformats
<Ralph> [I disagree on Mark's last point but won't go into it in this telecon]
Mark: maybe we just accept that our audience is folk who are somewhat familiar with Semantic Web concepts
Ben: I propose to submit editorial changes only
to the Working Group next week and publish just small changes on 13
October
... just enough modification to the Primer to address the comments a little
bit
Ralph: are there enough updates to be worth pushing for 13 Oct or should the Primer just wait a bit longer?
Jeremy: delay REC?
Ralph: no, let's not delay REC
Ben: there's other introductory material as well, e.g. in the Wiki
Mark: but I do see the argument in favor of removing the section on custom vocabularies
Ralph: there _are_ related documents out there; e.g. the Best Practice Recipes
Mark: but where are the limits on what we do?
Ralph: one of the things that distinguishes
RDFa from microformats is that you _can_ define your own vocabulary when you
decide that there's nothing existing that meets your needs
... so I wouldn't want to drop this entirely from the Primer
... it's not clear whether that commentor tried to follow the URIs
... the early Web was built on cloning pages; the same works for these
examples
ACTION: Ben ask Shane to produce an updated Syntax with editorial changes for the WG to review next week [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/02-rdfa-minutes.html#action17]
-> "xmlse:foo slightly substantive comment on CURIEs (both in stand alone document, and in RDFa PR)" [Jeremy 2008-09-12] Jeremy's editorial suggestion
<benadida> Note: A CURIE prefix value may case-insensitively begin in the string "xml", but then it is not permitted to be used as a prefix in an xmlns declaration in an XML document.
Jeremy: we should align the RDFa Syntax document and the CURIE spec as to whether a prefix can start with 'xml'
<JeremyCarroll> See the text:
<JeremyCarroll> [[
<JeremyCarroll> prefix values MUST be able to be defined using the 'xmlns:' syntax specified in [XMLNAMES].
<JeremyCarroll> ]]
<markbirbeck> "When CURIES are used in an XML-based host language, prefix values MUST be able to be defined using the 'xmlns:' syntax specified in [XMLNAMES]. Such host languages MAY also provide additional prefix mapping definition mechanisms.
<markbirbeck> When CURIES are used in a non-XML host language, the host language MUST provide a mechanism for defining the mapping from the prefix to an IRI."
Ralph: perhaps the 'xml' restriction is a Host
Language restriction and not an RDFa or CURIE restriction
... so RDFa and CURIE should remain silent on this point and leave it to the
Host Language specs to declare any further restrictions
Mark: when I added that sentence I was thinking
of prefixes such as '123abc'
... it wouldn't hurt to add to CURIE the 'xml*' restriction
... I think this would be a useful addition
Ralph: I'd make it an editorial Note: comment rather than make it appearing to be normative about CURIEs
Mark: I agree that the normative constraint is
already covered by the "prefix values MUST be able to be defined using the
'xmlns:' syntax specified in [XMLNAMES]" language
... I'm suggesting adding the comment as assistance to readers
Jeremy: an example would be informative
... I'm happy with no change to RDFa Syntax
<benadida> PROPOSE no modification to the RDFa Syntax document based on Jeremy's xmlse:foo comment
RESOLUTION: no modification to the RDFa Syntax document based on Jeremy's xmlse:foo comment
<JeremyCarroll> accepted as commentator
[adjourned]