See also: IRC log
Shadi: short report from Tunis
<shawn> scribe: Andrew
<shawn> scribenick: andrew
<Wayne> I am having a little computer trouble today, I'll join in a couple of minutes.
Shadi: short report from Tunis at WSIS
Barry: reported on the large
scale survey across the EU that he has been involved in
... outcomes to be announced next week and the report
launched
... Lead partner was RNIB; others included AbilityNet &
SOCITM Insight
Harvey: attended presentation by Maria XXX from School for the Blind
Barry: starting point was a
common set of services from each state, plus sites the state
nominated
... auto scan of all sites (500) plus manual evaluation on
subset (30 sites)
... manual eval confirmed auto test plus issues auto testing
can't look at
... instead of just WCAG "A", broke it into four
categories
... methodologies described in forthcoming report
... tried to pick out particularly good practice, and named
state and org
... long list of recommendations also in the report
... most states ahve WCAG "AA" as their objective, even if not
many have achieved it
Shadi: requirements - http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/Drafts/retrofit/requ-basite
... 4 pages that look equivalent but are inaccessible and
accessible repsectively
... plus a model evaluation
<Wayne> wayne, unmute me
Shadi: List of Web accessibility
barriers selected for demonstration - http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/features
... not comprehensive list of accessibility barries, but
representative
<shawn> shadi: can add accessibility barriers later
Shadi: each of the four pages
demonstrates different bariers
... before (inaccessible) pages - http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/before/
... not complete, but developing rapidly
... some pages not only break with assistive technology, but
also with some browsers
... after (accessible) pages - http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/after/
... the after pages are not as developed as the before
pages
... any comments/feedback?
William: it looks pretty good
Andrew: it will be a nice collection for demo purposes
Shawn: is the visual design final?
Shadi: pretty much final, maybe
some fine tuning
... does the top yellow warning/notice banner work?
Andrew: yellow stands out, but as it does not match the colour scheme it does not detract from the design
Barry: red on yellow is a bit difficult to read but words are good
All: agree that placement is good
<scribe> ACTION: issues 1) reconsider red on yellow; 2) make banner text scalable; 3) consider link to good site as well as to 'about' [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action01]
<Wayne> wayne, unmute me
<scribe> ACTION: issues 4) add some padding to the text [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action02]
Wayne: the before page works fine with my custom stylesheet
Shadi: it would be good to get some feedback from Wayne so we can possibly break it a bit more
<scribe> ACTION: Wayne to check all 'before' pages and provide feedback to TF [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action03]
Wayne: top banner currently interferes with page for me - rest of page is good
<shawn> ACTION: issues 5) strong bottom border line [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action04]
Barry: likes overall visual design - not as strong concerns as Wayne as can factor out the banner (once you realise it's purpose)
Shawn: is grey boring? Harvey - yes; Barry - no, quite common
<scribe> ACTION: issues 6) are some space around the borders, e.g. 'traffic' should not be against the page boundry [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action05]
Shawn: lets consider navigation
for the demo and between the good/bad pages
... do we all agree that best is a tweaking of the top warning
banner?
All: all agree that notificayion and navigation can be in the top bar on bother versions
Andrew: what about using the LHS nav to link to the report, and then to the repaired (or damaged) page?
Shadi: please think about use cases - page by page vs site vs report etc
Shawn: Andrew's suggestion may
also alow demo of menu hierarchy
... it should always be clear as to whether you are in the
before or after site
William: keep is simple
Barry: disagrees with Andrew's
suggestion - keep suite navigation separate from model
navigation
... keep all suite navigation to the page linked from the
banner at the top, might be extra links but simple and
discreet
... put the good/bad indicator into the top banner, not on the
page (but top banner needs to be kept concise)
Shadi: what about using colour in the banner to help differentiate between good/bad?
Wayne: why not just say BEFORE & AFTER?
Shadi: what about information that is actually informative about accessibility?
William: keep the pages pure - keep accessibility info out
Most: agree with William; Andrew doesn't mind accessibility info
Shawn: discussion seems to be that the top bar should NOT be integrated more into the site, but can still demo best practice such as use of colour
Shadi: thanks to TF members - Steve Faulkner, Liam McGee, Pasquale, Tanguy
<scribe> ACTION: consider links to 'intro', 'before', 'after', 'eval' in the top banner [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action06]
Shadi: update on activities -
user interface almost stable; TF collecting data
... see - http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/2005/tools-tf
William: will be collecting the accessibility of the tools themselves?
Andrew: we are trying to gather this information from the vendors/developers
See - http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/#meetings
Shawn: may need to progress some activities via email as we are missing several Friday meetings in the next month and a half
<shawn> andrew ***THANKS***
thanks shawn - i was just looking it up
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.127 of Date: 2005/08/16 15:12:03 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/See/Shadi/ Succeeded: s/boring? William - yes;/boring? Harvey - yes;/ Succeeded: s/repaierd/repaired/ Succeeded: s/whhy/why/ Found Scribe: Andrew Found ScribeNick: andrew Default Present: Doyle_Saylor, Sylvie_Duchateau\Tanguy_Lohéac, Shawn, Alan, Andrew, Shadi, Loughborough, Barry, pasquale, Bingham, wayne, Jack, Barry_McMullin Present: Alan_Chuter Doyle_Saylor Tanguy_Lohéac Shawn_Lawton_Henry Andrew_Arch Barry Shadi Pasquale William_Loughborough Harvey_Bingham Wayne_Dick Regrets: Henk_Snetselaar Justin_Thorp Liam_McGee Roberto_Castaldo Helle Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-eo/2005OctDec/0100.html WARNING: No meeting chair found! You should specify the meeting chair like this: <dbooth> Chair: dbooth Got date from IRC log name: 18 Nov 2005 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html People with action items: 4 add consider issues links padding some wayne WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]