Meeting minutes
Scott: goes over a brief history of the summary element and some of the issues in HTML
scott: what can we do to expose this consitently and home up with a pathway forward
html doesn't want to make changes to the content model
jcraig: is the reason to talk about this in context of role parity
scott: 1st can we do this consistently? then - would it be existing or new
jcraig: so we need a pushable or clickable with open/closed state
matt: 1st respond - tab is all manually done. there is no implicit relationship. Could just as easily use button - no taxonomy changes needed
matt: could be useful for us to have a list of the distinct problems
<jcraig> parity role should be similar to a clickable with a expanded/collapsed state.... tab or toggle button seem most likely: disclosure -> *[role=button][aria-pressed]
matt: a clickable element needs to be exposed and think it is reasonable to assume that that clickable element itself isn't the element with descendant content. and some way of naming it needs to be specified
matt: can't think of any place in aria where you have an interactive element with nested interactives
matt: just a problem as can't have nested interactives
<jcraig> remaining problem with mapping "disclosure -> *[role=button][aria-pressed]" is the children presentational issue with button.
jamesn: want to allow to solve the other nested interactive cases too
mu-an: as someone who uses the details elements - lots of places have disclosure removed - resetting those is a bit of a mess. to expose interactive content - if the triangle has been removed the interactive would be gone
scotto: in reviewing the a11y of these things - there are some issues with some browsers where if the marker is removed it can end up being a nothing element without it
scotto: whatever we end up doing we need to makes sure that css is not required and if the marker is removed it should not make it inaccessible
melanie: are we asking if we would like to more uniformly announce summary - want to get scope right here
scotto: one thing would be good to solve would be a single way that these are implemented
in some browsers would navigate by buttons and in others not
<jcraig> This is the article melsumner was referring to: https://
discussion around bending these elements - usage has been expanded over the years. find in page will expand details elements
can create silly user experiences when using for dropdowns for example
jcraig: remap cases where summary -> menu would be uop to the author to provide the actual mapping
jcraig: initial comments - forgot to mention that disclosure could map to button or tab but the key problem with button is children presentational baggage. Links for example can have nested interactives
mario: can have an exposure of the summary as for example the summary role and tabbing would be the first thing - disclosure button could name that with heading or content
https://
<jcraig> nit: if we go Mario's direction, I prefer “disclosure” as a new role name over “summary”
<melsumner> +1
mario: not possible to say all of summary is exposed as a button - as can have interactive content within it
<melsumner> casual comment: The children of interactives are presentational. Genuinely don't want that to change. Maybe I need to make a t-shirt "no nested interactive" ;)
matt: like the general direction - does skirt the children presentational issue. don't know if it is really a problem
matt: stilll wondering about a use case - where the button that doesn the expanding and collapsing and essentially labels the discolsure - where that button is wrapped in a heading. can put a heading inside the summary but if want to create something more like accordions in APG - can then press enter to expand the content
scotto: regardless there will be work for the browsers
scotto: since html doesn't want to change the content model means there will be needed changes in the browsers
scotto: allowing headings to wrap them could be allowed
matt: could put anything in the summary - seems counter intuitive